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Really felt sorry for Winston...and I'm gay
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yellowlabbie
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by sheils1:
“Why do you say he needs educating?

His belief comes from the bible, so now you are saying the bible is wrong?”

Well if he believes everything in the bible then he does indeed need educating.
zelda fan
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by yellowlabbie:
“Well if he believes everything in the bible then he does indeed need educating.”

Exactly it shouldn't be taken so absolutely. The bible reflects the views of the time it was made in and i think the more wiser Christians are able to distinguish the difference between the good(love,kindness,charitable,compassion,empathy,respect) and the bad(violence,judgemental,anti gay, outdated views on women). Even if there is a Christian god we can't know for sure everything in the bible represents his true feelings, the bible is a book written by man which could have easily had it's messages manipulated and distorted over time. Think about it who is to say back when the book was newly created that a person didn't edit the book for their own agendas and beliefs? It would be very ironic if the most 'devout' christians were in fact following edited man made lies and not the true message their god had wished to convey.

A god if it exists would be incredibly wise and considering it would have chosen to give life to us all (including animals) i truly doubt it would wish us to be cruel to one another. That applies to all gender/race/sexuality/nationality and if anyone truly believes their god wishes people to be punished or discriminated against because of adults having a consensual relationship that harms no other, well then they clearly think very little of their god because it creates gay people then condemns them that is sick and cruel.
joe gillott
10-01-2016
I'm just sorry he hasn't become open minded and tries to divert away and hides being "the people count, not my opinion". He deserves what he gets. No sympathy for his treatment from me. He is a coward and his type of people are one lf tje main problems with the world and cause nothing but misery. I'm just sorry his mind never cjanged amd never will.
joe gillott
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by sheils1:
“Why do you say he needs educating?

His belief comes from the bible, so now you are saying the bible is wrong?”

Of course it is. Its a bunch of fairy tales written to manipulate people to hate certain types of people. If god loves us all - then he would of loved us for being gay.
yellowlabbie
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by zelda fan:
“Exactly it shouldn't be taken so absolutely. The bible reflects the views of the time it was made in and i think the more wiser Christians are able to distinguish the difference between the good(love,kindness,charitable,compassion,empathy,respect) and the bad(violence,judgemental,anti gay, outdated views on women). Even if there is a Christian god we can't know for sure everything in the bible represents his true feelings, the bible is a book written by man which could have easily had it's messages manipulated and distorted over time. Think about it who is to say back when the book was newly created that a person didn't edit the book for their own agendas and beliefs? It would be very ironic if the most 'devout' christians were in fact following edited man made lies and not the true message their god had wished to convey.

A god if it exists would be incredibly wise and considering it would have chosen to give life to us all (including animals) i truly doubt it would wish us to be cruel to one another. That applies to all gender/race/sexuality/nationality and if anyone truly believes their god wishes people to be punished or discriminated against because of adults having a consensual relationship that harms no other, well then they clearly think very little of their god because it creates gay people then condemns them that is sick and cruel.”

Thank you for such a great reply to my post.
yellowlabbie
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by joe gillott:
“Of course it is. Its a bunch of fairy tales written to manipulate people to hate certain types of people. If god loves us all - then he would of loved us for being gay.”

Here, here.
FusionFury
10-01-2016
It was uncomfortable viewing tbh I had to turn off.. I felt sick that another human would do that do someone.. sick show.
aggielane
10-01-2016
I would have liked to have seen without BBs interference if Winston would have changed any of his views if he had spent more time in the company of John and Chris. He seemed to be getting on with most of them up until the moment BB shafted him.
zelda fan
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by yellowlabbie:
“Thank you for such a great reply to my post.”

Thanks for appreciating what i was saying.
Eurostar
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by aggielane:
“I would have liked to have seen without BBs interference if Winston would have changed any of his views if he had spent more time in the company of John and Chris. He seemed to be getting on with most of them up until the moment BB shafted him.”

He was getting on absolutely fine with John and Chris in fact (much to the producers' annoyance I imagine).
An Thropologist
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by zelda fan:
“Exactly it shouldn't be taken so absolutely. The bible reflects the views of the time it was made in and i think the more wiser Christians are able to distinguish the difference between the good(love,kindness,charitable,compassion,empathy,respect) and the bad(violence,judgemental,anti gay, outdated views on women). Even if there is a Christian god we can't know for sure everything in the bible represents his true feelings, the bible is a book written by man which could have easily had it's messages manipulated and distorted over time. Think about it who is to say back when the book was newly created that a person didn't edit the book for their own agendas and beliefs? It would be very ironic if the most 'devout' christians were in fact following edited man made lies and not the true message their god had wished to convey.

A god if it exists would be incredibly wise and considering it would have chosen to give life to us all (including animals) i truly doubt it would wish us to be cruel to one another. That applies to all gender/race/sexuality/nationality and if anyone truly believes their god wishes people to be punished or discriminated against because of adults having a consensual relationship that harms no other, well then they clearly think very little of their god because it creates gay people then condemns them that is sick and cruel.”

There is pretty strong evidence to support that being exactly what did happen. In the first place the bible wasn't written as a single book. It is a collection of writings, essays and journals (as we might classify them today) written in the early 1st century.

The editing which took the form of choosing which articles to include in the collection and which to surpress took place decades later by the early (Catholic) church.
Wainy84
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by An Thropologist:
“There is pretty strong evidence to support that being exactly what did happen. In the first place the bible wasn't written as a single book. It is a collection of writings, essays and journals (as we might classify them today) written in the early 1st century.

The editing which took the form of choosing which articles to include in the collection and which to surpress took place decades later by the early (Catholic) church.”

There loads missing that the Catholic church have removed.
That why it's abit comfusing till you have read the rest of them.
I have never read them myself.
Sammie_B
10-01-2016
Agree.
I didn't agree with his opinion, yet we all have opinions on stuff, which some of us will disagree with. We are all entitled to one.
Think the whole house or some of the housemates could of dealt with it better.
zelda fan
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by An Thropologist:
“There is pretty strong evidence to support that being exactly what did happen. In the first place the bible wasn't written as a single book. It is a collection of writings, essays and journals (as we might classify them today) written in the early 1st century.

The editing which took the form of choosing which articles to include in the collection and which to surpress took place decades later by the early (Catholic) church.”

Interesting, this is why i could never place all my faith in a book from times before we kept archived copies in libraries and online. I would be interested to see which stuff has been removed or suppressed by the catholic church and the reasons why.
Eurostar
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by zelda fan:
“Interesting, this is why i could never place all my faith in a book from times before we kept archived copies in libraries and online. I would be interested to see which stuff has been removed or suppressed by the catholic church and the reasons why.”

The Bible had very little to say about homosexuality and Jesus was surprisingly relaxed about the subject of sexuality and liked the company of women and had female friends. All of the repressed stuff seems to have come from the Church in subsequent centuries.
erin_p
10-01-2016
well here is his party speaking op for Winston ..(.1.35 in )
@EnglishDemocrat s defend Free speech http://bbc.in/1TH7odU @ 1hr 35mins @SteveUncles [on behalf of @WinstonMcK]

Now he doesn't remember making homophobic comment
http://metro.co.uk/2016/01/09/celebr...ments-5611836/

His VT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_pyTTme-Sk
Virgil Tracy
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by TV_Steve:
“The fact that there are so many people on this forum saying they feel sorry for this man is exactly why it was important that he got such a public roasting last night.

Of course everyone is entitled to an opinion but that doesn't mean it's acceptable to voice an opinion in such an unacceptable and hateful manner. It is completely a personal choice as to how you decide to air your opinions and you need to accept the consequences.

These types hide behind the myth that Freedom of Speech is permission to say whatever we like without consequence or criticism. No. Freedom of Speech is entirely related to permission to criticise governments and the state without fear of persecution. It's not a free pass to make hateful, racist, sexist or homophobic comments to attack minorities or other religions and creeds.

Hiding behind supposed religious beliefs isn't an excuse either. If it was OK for religious homophobes to attack people in this way then it would follow that it's perfectly acceptable for those so called Muslim followers who use their personal interpretation of ancient text to murder innocent people indiscriminately.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion but it's what you choose to do with that opinion that defines you as a human being in modern society.”

ok , so - what did Winston choose to do with his opinion that was so problematic ?


.
Eurostar
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy:
“ok , so - what did Winston choose to do with his opinion that was so problematic ?


.”

Winston never said anything about homosexuality or gay adoption in the house and was getting on absolutely fine with the gay housemates (much to the annoyance of the producers I imagine, who then decided to ambush him).
Penny Crayon
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy:
“ok , so - what did Winston choose to do with his opinion that was so problematic ?


.”

As far as BB goes he seems to have chosen to keep quiet about it until they forced the issue.
1fab
10-01-2016
Originally Posted by joe gillott:
“I'm just sorry he hasn't become open minded and tries to divert away and hides being "the people count, not my opinion". He deserves what he gets. No sympathy for his treatment from me. He is a coward and his type of people are one lf tje main problems with the world and cause nothing but misery. I'm just sorry his mind never cjanged amd never will.”

When he came out, he started talking about his experience in the house, until Emma shut him down. He said something that made me think there was hope for him to change his views. Thanks to KT_Dog's transcript thread, I can show you what I'm talking about:

Quote:
“I’m the type of guy who, having been a boxer, amateur and professional, I thought I knew everything – but when I walked into the house and heard other people’s way of life, how they live, their anxieties and what they’ve been through, I realised that no, you don’t know it all, you know? There are people out there who really, really have given it their all and are still trying… And it’s… it’s… I mean to listen to the likes of Angie Bowie speaking about her life, David Gest, you know? Erm… And many others. It was just such a revelation for me.”

He didn't get the opportunity to go any further than that. Maybe, just maybe, he was saying that he felt he could learn from meeting different kinds of people.
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