Isn't the Canary Wharf Cyberman invasion is mentioned on the news in Death in Heaven? Mr Saxon also still happened - both Osgood and O'Donnell reference him. As far as I understand, there's no reason to assume the past invasion have been erased.
21st century Earth in the Whoniverse- how is it different?
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Originally Posted by Airborae:
“It's never been explicitly stated about the memory wipe - Moffat often used to leave the explanation in our own minds - and Amy's memory was likely restored. Just because the invasions haven't been mentioned, doesn't mean to say they haven't happened. That has never been explicitly stated either. Like I said earlier, people in Moffat's seasons do seem to take an alien presence at face value. The Big Bang reboot to me, fixed the Universe and stopped the Tardis from exploding.
An example is when a computer is rebooted when starting up. The same files and programs remain. That's what the reboot did to the Universe. If the recent invasions over the last 10 years didn't happen, then why are UNIT and Torchwood still in existence? Surely everybody's mind would be wiped of the even earlier invasions such as the Cybermen, Yeti, Zygons etc.”
“It's never been explicitly stated about the memory wipe - Moffat often used to leave the explanation in our own minds - and Amy's memory was likely restored. Just because the invasions haven't been mentioned, doesn't mean to say they haven't happened. That has never been explicitly stated either. Like I said earlier, people in Moffat's seasons do seem to take an alien presence at face value. The Big Bang reboot to me, fixed the Universe and stopped the Tardis from exploding.
An example is when a computer is rebooted when starting up. The same files and programs remain. That's what the reboot did to the Universe. If the recent invasions over the last 10 years didn't happen, then why are UNIT and Torchwood still in existence? Surely everybody's mind would be wiped of the even earlier invasions such as the Cybermen, Yeti, Zygons etc.”
Torchwood had existed since the 19th century and UNIT since the 1960s. Their job is to be ready just in case of invasions. That's why they'd still exist.
Though Torchwood actually DOESN'T still exist. It disbanded when Jack went off world again after Miracle Day. Gwen's been busy raising her baby and only now that the kid is about to start school has she been making moves to re-establish the organisation (see the recent BF audios).
Originally Posted by davrosdodebird:
“The cracks erased people's memories but the events still happened. See: duck pond scenario”
“The cracks erased people's memories but the events still happened. See: duck pond scenario”
No, the events didn't happen, but subsequent events were still there.
It's not that there were ducks and no-one remembers them, but that the timeline previously contained a duck pond with ducks, but all the ducks were then removed, leaving a duck pond that has never had any ducks. (I'm not saying that that was what actually happened to the ducks, of course, that's just the analogy.)
The cracks ripped away parts of history, somehow leaving other parts mostly unaffected. It's interesting to speculate that, if the TARDIS was the source of the cracks, then the 'tear points' were more likely to be places the Doctor has had the most impact and made the timeline vulnerable - so maybe his adventures that caused the most 'upset' to the timeline were the first to be affected. It's not been said whether those have been reinstated, or if time flowed back along the 'easiest' lines.
You can't build an arched bridge without something supporting the weight of the pieces. However, once the bridge is built, the supports can be removed without everything falling down. And there would be no evidence the support was ever there.
Originally Posted by johnnysaucepn:
“You can't build an arched bridge without something supporting the weight of the pieces. However, once the bridge is built, the supports can be removed without everything falling down. And there would be no evidence the support was ever there.”
“You can't build an arched bridge without something supporting the weight of the pieces. However, once the bridge is built, the supports can be removed without everything falling down. And there would be no evidence the support was ever there.”
Surely the bridge itself - which cannot be constructed without the falsework - is evidence that it existed?
The question of why Earthlings don't seem to remember alien attacks was briefly addressed in Remembrance of the Daleks, when Ace says something to the effect that she would have known about it if the Daleks had invaded in 1963, and the Doctor replies, "Do you remember the Zygon gambit with the Loch Ness monster? Or the Yeti in the Underground? Your species has an amazing capacity for self-deception". It doesn't seem necessary to posit the erasure of large chunks of time and space, when a psychological explanation is possible.
To return to the OP's original question, one way in which 21st-century Earth in the Doctor Who universe differs from our own is that they had BBC3 as far back as the mid-1970s, whereas it was launched in 2003 in this world. We have thus been spared Alastair Fergus and The Passing Parade.
My understanding is that the Pandorica generated an identical copy of the universe, in which all of these events still happened.
Originally Posted by Thamwet:
“My understanding is that the Pandorica generated an identical copy of the universe, in which all of these events still happened.”
“My understanding is that the Pandorica generated an identical copy of the universe, in which all of these events still happened.”
And that is what happened, nothing was erased from time.
Originally Posted by Vopiscus:
“Surely the bridge itself - which cannot be constructed without the falsework - is evidence that it existed?
The question of why Earthlings don't seem to remember alien attacks was briefly addressed in Remembrance of the Daleks, when Ace says something to the effect that she would have known about it if the Daleks had invaded in 1963, and the Doctor replies, "Do you remember the Zygon gambit with the Loch Ness monster? Or the Yeti in the Underground? Your species has an amazing capacity for self-deception". It doesn't seem necessary to posit the erasure of large chunks of time and space, when a psychological explanation is possible.
To return to the OP's original question, one way in which 21st-century Earth in the Doctor Who universe differs from our own is that they had BBC3 as far back as the mid-1970s, whereas it was launched in 2003 in this world. We have thus been spared Alastair Fergus and The Passing Parade.”
“Surely the bridge itself - which cannot be constructed without the falsework - is evidence that it existed?
The question of why Earthlings don't seem to remember alien attacks was briefly addressed in Remembrance of the Daleks, when Ace says something to the effect that she would have known about it if the Daleks had invaded in 1963, and the Doctor replies, "Do you remember the Zygon gambit with the Loch Ness monster? Or the Yeti in the Underground? Your species has an amazing capacity for self-deception". It doesn't seem necessary to posit the erasure of large chunks of time and space, when a psychological explanation is possible.
To return to the OP's original question, one way in which 21st-century Earth in the Doctor Who universe differs from our own is that they had BBC3 as far back as the mid-1970s, whereas it was launched in 2003 in this world. We have thus been spared Alastair Fergus and The Passing Parade.”
Sunnydale Syndrome.
Originally Posted by Sam_Gee1:
“And that is what happened, nothing was erased from time.”
“And that is what happened, nothing was erased from time.”
Why did Amy have to specifically remember her parents for them to be part of the rebooted Universe then?
Quote:
“DOCTOR:
There's going to be a very big bang. Big Bang Two. Try and remember your family and they'll be there.
AMY:
How can I remember them if they never existed?
DOCTOR:
Because... you're special. That crack in your wall, all that time, the universe pouring into your head. You brought Rory back...you can bring them back, too. You just remember, and they'll be there.”
“DOCTOR:
There's going to be a very big bang. Big Bang Two. Try and remember your family and they'll be there.
AMY:
How can I remember them if they never existed?
DOCTOR:
Because... you're special. That crack in your wall, all that time, the universe pouring into your head. You brought Rory back...you can bring them back, too. You just remember, and they'll be there.”
Originally Posted by Corwin:
“Why did Amy have to specifically remember her parents for them to be part of the rebooted Universe then?”
“Why did Amy have to specifically remember her parents for them to be part of the rebooted Universe then?”
And she remembered The Doctor back in the universe, with everything that happened to him.
Like why do UNIT still have basically everything which has happened to The Doctor if it never happened?
And if you say, not everything was forgotten, then why are certain things not effected by it?
Something to add having re-watched the Zygon Invasion- the country of Turmezistan is made up, according to the web. There is a country named Turkmenistan in real life, but Turmezistan apparently only exists in the Whoniverse Earth.
Originally Posted by Corwin:
“Why did Amy have to specifically remember her parents for them to be part of the rebooted Universe then?”
“Why did Amy have to specifically remember her parents for them to be part of the rebooted Universe then?”
Drama. I can't think of any other reason. Unless Amy literally had all of time and space backed up in her head, and the Doctor was just emphasising that point.
Originally Posted by johnnysaucepn:
“Drama. I can't think of any other reason. Unless Amy literally had all of time and space backed up in her head, and the Doctor was just emphasising that point.”
“Drama. I can't think of any other reason. Unless Amy literally had all of time and space backed up in her head, and the Doctor was just emphasising that point.”
BIB: She would have had to use a pretty extreme compression algorithm, not to mention all the parts of Universe A - from big bang to heat death - that Amy had not actually experienced! Even Sherlock Holmes, with his great mind palace, was careful about the stuff he chose to remember!
Might as well extrapolate the entire universe from, say, a piece of fairy cake.
Having to carry all that lot around in her head might explain her tetchiness, though.
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