Where is Vince? It feels like a while since we've seen him, right?
World Wrestling Entertainment Discussion 41 (Spoilers)
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Originally Posted by hazydayz:
“At no other point in history has professional wrestling been less cool, less popular and more importantly, less watched. There's fewer people watching at home and attending live events than ever before.”
“At no other point in history has professional wrestling been less cool, less popular and more importantly, less watched. There's fewer people watching at home and attending live events than ever before.”
Yes. I dropped in here out of curiosity as to what was going on now, as a visitor from the past. My lovely old dad (now passed away) and I used to watch WWF and WCW wrestling back in the day. There were great personalities with greater gimmicks or tremendous athletic skills... or both. Randy Savage, Rick Rude, Bret the Hitman Hart, Mr Perfect, Jake the Snake Roberts, Mankind, Gold Dust, Dusty Rhodes, the British Bulldog, Eddie Gurerro, Triple H, Shawn Michaels, and so many others.
I gather that some of the above passed away, and some are still shambling around, but where are the new BIG stars of today? I know the past always looks rosy, but honestly when I look at the schedules, I can't find anything or anyone that makes me want to return to watching pro wrestling.
Originally Posted by Draca_Noir:
“I think you're giving Vince Russo a bit too much credit for the 10 million viewers in the attitude era. Wrestling became cool when one man turned on his friends and that was the Hulk Hogan heel turn, that night turned the industry on its head and created the most over group of all time, the NWO. If it wasn't for the NWO there wouln't have been the same buzz around wrestling. The Monday night wars was what kept viewers coming back for more, once WCW went, it was inevitable that WWE would drop their standards, they had no one to compete against. And this is coming from a huge WWE fan of that time.
Also, guys like Stone Cold and The Rock made themselves, creative held them back to begin with rubbish gimmicks, but luckily for the WWE they found their own voices. Also, with regards to ratings, I used to remember the days when Eastenders got 18-20 million viewers per episode, they've probably dipped by a significant amount now though and that's because there's more choice out there, easier to record more than one show at a time and watch it later etc.
You're probably right that Vince doesn't care as much about the product as he once did and that's probably because he has a steady income coming in from the network etc.”
“I think you're giving Vince Russo a bit too much credit for the 10 million viewers in the attitude era. Wrestling became cool when one man turned on his friends and that was the Hulk Hogan heel turn, that night turned the industry on its head and created the most over group of all time, the NWO. If it wasn't for the NWO there wouln't have been the same buzz around wrestling. The Monday night wars was what kept viewers coming back for more, once WCW went, it was inevitable that WWE would drop their standards, they had no one to compete against. And this is coming from a huge WWE fan of that time.
Also, guys like Stone Cold and The Rock made themselves, creative held them back to begin with rubbish gimmicks, but luckily for the WWE they found their own voices. Also, with regards to ratings, I used to remember the days when Eastenders got 18-20 million viewers per episode, they've probably dipped by a significant amount now though and that's because there's more choice out there, easier to record more than one show at a time and watch it later etc.
You're probably right that Vince doesn't care as much about the product as he once did and that's probably because he has a steady income coming in from the network etc.”
You're spot on with this, in my opinion. The most popular British soaps were attracting 18 million viewers on average when Monday night wrestling was at its peak in 1998/1999. These days they are down to often a third of that.
Whenever any brand or franchise 'catches on' it makes its biggest impact due do the fad element. That's why the TMNT franchise won't sell as many tickets (in North America/Europe) as it did in 1990. It's also why The Simpsons won't ever attract the ratings it did in its early days. A brand has to go through a complete renaissance to hit big - late 1990's wrestling was a radical departure from that of late 1980's. If Rock n' Wrestling had a shelf life, the NWO and Attitude had an even shorter one due to the fast nature and overexposure. American Wrestling and Vince McMahon's version of it doesn't have a shelf life, but the fan base and how they watch it will both shrink and evolve due to the changes in habits. The way they handle the performers and their character does make it easier to miss, in my opinion.
After working in the industry for 45 years, being old and filthy rich, I'd be amazed if Vince McMahon had anywhere close to the same amount of passion he did even a decade ago.
Originally Posted by cris182:
“So it is a surprise when they cash in, Even though everyone sees it coming”
“So it is a surprise when they cash in, Even though everyone sees it coming”
If anything they should come in strong seeing as they have the title match. Rather than oh hes the champ now? Didnt he job every match for the past 6 months thing.
Originally Posted by JCR:
“Rumours on the twitter the hatch is for a trailer for the next video game, with Goldberg.”
“Rumours on the twitter the hatch is for a trailer for the next video game, with Goldberg.”
This is a long time coming. Absolutely awesome hes in, hopefully we finally get a WCW Showcase.
Originally Posted by richie4eva:
“Booooooooooooooo Reigns”
“Booooooooooooooo Reigns”
Shut up Richie. You say that comment every damn week.
Originally Posted by calderyon:
“Titus? OK, i´m fine with this.
Better than Cena atleast.”
“Titus? OK, i´m fine with this.
Better than Cena atleast.”
After Titus has come back from a suspension that Vince wanted him fired there is no way hes winning the US title.
Originally Posted by CardioCortez:
“Can't wait for Steph Vs Charlotte at Summerslam
”
“Can't wait for Steph Vs Charlotte at Summerslam
”
Im suprised Ric Flair didnt go ape shit on Charlotte last week and gave her a beating for how she treated her father. Cant see many parents putting up with that shit being disrespected by their kid.
Before anyone jumps on about its scripted yeah we all know but he doesnt have to hurt her just make the part look good.
Originally Posted by FMKK:
“On the point of AJ btw, the stories coming out recently regarding a brand split seem to suggest that Reigns will be the main star on Raw and Cena his counterpart on Smackdown so it could be that the AJ/The Club vs John Cena feud is the one that kinda kicks off the newly revamped Smackdown and if there's two world titles again, there's every chance that AJ ends up holding the Smackdown belt as the top heel.”
“On the point of AJ btw, the stories coming out recently regarding a brand split seem to suggest that Reigns will be the main star on Raw and Cena his counterpart on Smackdown so it could be that the AJ/The Club vs John Cena feud is the one that kinda kicks off the newly revamped Smackdown and if there's two world titles again, there's every chance that AJ ends up holding the Smackdown belt as the top heel.”
If it was anybody else than Cena (and Reigns) facing him, i would believe he had a chance to win. But no, i think after this feud, his record will sadly most likely be 0-3 due to certain someones (Vince) ego getting in the way.
Originally Posted by Lee_Smith2:
“You're spot on with this, in my opinion. The most popular British soaps were attracting 18 million viewers on average when Monday night wrestling was at its peak in 1998/1999. These days they are down to often a third of that.
Whenever any brand or franchise 'catches on' it makes its biggest impact due do the fad element. That's why the TMNT franchise won't sell as many tickets (in North America/Europe) as it did in 1990. It's also why The Simpsons won't ever attract the ratings it did in its early days. A brand has to go through a complete renaissance to hit big - late 1990's wrestling was a radical departure from that of late 1980's. If Rock n' Wrestling had a shelf life, the NWO and Attitude had an even shorter one due to the fast nature and overexposure. American Wrestling and Vince McMahon's version of it doesn't have a shelf life, but the fan base and how they watch it will both shrink and evolve due to the changes in habits. The way they handle the performers and their character does make it easier to miss, in my opinion.
After working in the industry for 45 years, being old and filthy rich, I'd be amazed if Vince McMahon had anywhere close to the same amount of passion he did even a decade ago.”
“You're spot on with this, in my opinion. The most popular British soaps were attracting 18 million viewers on average when Monday night wrestling was at its peak in 1998/1999. These days they are down to often a third of that.
Whenever any brand or franchise 'catches on' it makes its biggest impact due do the fad element. That's why the TMNT franchise won't sell as many tickets (in North America/Europe) as it did in 1990. It's also why The Simpsons won't ever attract the ratings it did in its early days. A brand has to go through a complete renaissance to hit big - late 1990's wrestling was a radical departure from that of late 1980's. If Rock n' Wrestling had a shelf life, the NWO and Attitude had an even shorter one due to the fast nature and overexposure. American Wrestling and Vince McMahon's version of it doesn't have a shelf life, but the fan base and how they watch it will both shrink and evolve due to the changes in habits. The way they handle the performers and their character does make it easier to miss, in my opinion.
After working in the industry for 45 years, being old and filthy rich, I'd be amazed if Vince McMahon had anywhere close to the same amount of passion he did even a decade ago.”
Agree with this. Really good post. The fad element is really overlooked by people who just want wrestling to be like it was when they were 12 or whatever. But on the other hand, there are some pretty basic elements that WWE seem to have forgotten.
Originally Posted by dave_windows:
“Im suprised Ric Flair didnt go ape shit on Charlotte last week and gave her a beating for how she treated her father. Cant see many parents putting up with that shit being disrespected by their kid.
Before anyone jumps on about its scripted yeah we all know but he doesnt have to hurt her just make the part look good.”
“Im suprised Ric Flair didnt go ape shit on Charlotte last week and gave her a beating for how she treated her father. Cant see many parents putting up with that shit being disrespected by their kid.
Before anyone jumps on about its scripted yeah we all know but he doesnt have to hurt her just make the part look good.”
Oh yeah, Ric Flair abusing his daughter would be a great angle....
Pretty sure she could take the old soak anyway.
Originally Posted by calderyon:
“If it was anybody else than Cena (and Reigns) facing him, i would believe he had a chance to win. But no, i think after this feud, his record will sadly most likely be 0-3 due to certain someones (Vince) ego getting in the way.”
“If it was anybody else than Cena (and Reigns) facing him, i would believe he had a chance to win. But no, i think after this feud, his record will sadly most likely be 0-3 due to certain someones (Vince) ego getting in the way.”
Not sure what ego has to do with it. Why would Styles go over Reigns? It makes no sense. And the Cena thing makes sense either way but I feel like there's a long way to go on that feud anyway.
^ I only mentioned Reigns for reference, because he is the other one who AJ would never allowed to win a title against. Everyone and their pet animal knew that AJ wasn´t going to win against Reigns.
I´m just skeptical if they would let AJ win any matches against Cena.
I´m just skeptical if they would let AJ win any matches against Cena.
Originally Posted by calderyon:
“^ I only mentioned Reigns for reference, because he is the other one who AJ would never allowed to win a title against. Everyone and their pet animal knew that AJ wasn´t going to win against Reigns.
I´m just skeptical if they would let AJ win any matches against Cena.”
“^ I only mentioned Reigns for reference, because he is the other one who AJ would never allowed to win a title against. Everyone and their pet animal knew that AJ wasn´t going to win against Reigns.
I´m just skeptical if they would let AJ win any matches against Cena.”
Nor should he have. That's the point.
Originally Posted by FMKK:
“Nor should he have. That's the point.”
“Nor should he have. That's the point.”
No it isn't.
Bryan's first title defence - 40+ year old veteran Kane.
Punk's first title defence - Alberto Del Rio. Then The Miz. Then Dolph Ziggler.
There is a very, very clear pattern here - top stars are fed to the likes of Cena and Reigns as if it means nothing at all. This is not the case for any proper fan favourites, like Punk, Bryan or indeed AJ Styles.
It is pure ignorance to suggest the burial of Styles (and I don't use that term lightly) is nothing to do with his run in TNA and as a top indy star. If this were a one-off we could brush it to one side, but we ALL know it isn't. Vince has a huge track record of burying non-WWE talent - as recently as last year, Sting was signed and his first match, his Wrestlemania moment, was booked as a WWE vs. wCw war...14 YEARS AFTER THAT WAR HAD ENDED.
The booking of Styles is all about supremacy. It's not because Vince feels threatened by TNA, or because he has even paid any great deal of attention to Styles' career there - it is all about sending a message. The top indy work in the world (as he has often been referred to on WWE programming) just can't hang with the best in the business in the "big leagues" of WWE.
Originally Posted by JCR:
“NJPW put the Ricochet vs Will Ospreay match up officially in HD- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TgbxaQcheQ
Watched it all the way through a second time on a big tv. That count out spot is still ridiculous mind.”
“NJPW put the Ricochet vs Will Ospreay match up officially in HD- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TgbxaQcheQ
Watched it all the way through a second time on a big tv. That count out spot is still ridiculous mind.”
Amazing match. All the haters can go on WWE Network to watch Bret and Shawn bore a Wrestlemania arena half to death with 60 minutes of chain-wrestling and rest-holds...sorry, "psychology" and "story-telling".
Originally Posted by twitter:
“Sarah Cassi Verified account
@SarahCassi
#Breaking: #SuperflySnuka NOT competent to stand trial in 1983 death of Nancy Argentino, judge rules.”
“Sarah Cassi Verified account
@SarahCassi
#Breaking: #SuperflySnuka NOT competent to stand trial in 1983 death of Nancy Argentino, judge rules.”
WWE dodges a bullet on that one
Originally Posted by ags_rule:
“No it isn't.
Bryan's first title defence - 40+ year old veteran Kane.
Punk's first title defence - Alberto Del Rio. Then The Miz. Then Dolph Ziggler.
There is a very, very clear pattern here - top stars are fed to the likes of Cena and Reigns as if it means nothing at all. This is not the case for any proper fan favourites, like Punk, Bryan or indeed AJ Styles.
It is pure ignorance to suggest the burial of Styles (and I don't use that term lightly) is nothing to do with his run in TNA and as a top indy star. If this were a one-off we could brush it to one side, but we ALL know it isn't. Vince has a huge track record of burying non-WWE talent - as recently as last year, Sting was signed and his first match, his Wrestlemania moment, was booked as a WWE vs. wCw war...14 YEARS AFTER THAT WAR HAD ENDED.
The booking of Styles is all about supremacy. It's not because Vince feels threatened by TNA, or because he has even paid any great deal of attention to Styles' career there - it is all about sending a message. The top indy work in the world (as he has often been referred to on WWE programming) just can't hang with the best in the business in the "big leagues" of WWE.”
“No it isn't.
Bryan's first title defence - 40+ year old veteran Kane.
Punk's first title defence - Alberto Del Rio. Then The Miz. Then Dolph Ziggler.
There is a very, very clear pattern here - top stars are fed to the likes of Cena and Reigns as if it means nothing at all. This is not the case for any proper fan favourites, like Punk, Bryan or indeed AJ Styles.
It is pure ignorance to suggest the burial of Styles (and I don't use that term lightly) is nothing to do with his run in TNA and as a top indy star. If this were a one-off we could brush it to one side, but we ALL know it isn't. Vince has a huge track record of burying non-WWE talent - as recently as last year, Sting was signed and his first match, his Wrestlemania moment, was booked as a WWE vs. wCw war...14 YEARS AFTER THAT WAR HAD ENDED.
The booking of Styles is all about supremacy. It's not because Vince feels threatened by TNA, or because he has even paid any great deal of attention to Styles' career there - it is all about sending a message. The top indy work in the world (as he has often been referred to on WWE programming) just can't hang with the best in the business in the "big leagues" of WWE.”
So he's booked with all the top stars, made to look like a credible main eventer and given the opportunity to have extender PPV matches with the world champion and the company's biggest star. These literally nothing WWE could have done other than putting Styles on a huge winning streak and getting the title right away without people coming out and claiming that he's buried.
Originally Posted by ags_rule:
“Amazing match. All the haters can go on WWE Network to watch Bret and Shawn bore a Wrestlemania arena half to death with 60 minutes of chain-wrestling and rest-holds...sorry, "psychology" and "story-telling".”
“Amazing match. All the haters can go on WWE Network to watch Bret and Shawn bore a Wrestlemania arena half to death with 60 minutes of chain-wrestling and rest-holds...sorry, "psychology" and "story-telling".”
I'm pretty sure people can simultaneously hold that Michaels vs Hart was very boring AND dislike the egregious flipping and flopping that opened this match.
https://www.facebook.com/PWSpotlight...5518724153287/
Could be worse I suppose! Supposedly aired on Impact but I'm struggling to believe it, surely they wouldn't let that air.
Could be worse I suppose! Supposedly aired on Impact but I'm struggling to believe it, surely they wouldn't let that air.
What in the name of holy **** did I just watch? What is going on with Matt Hardy?
The acting and production there was sub-pornography bad. The worst segment I've ever seen.
The acting and production there was sub-pornography bad. The worst segment I've ever seen.
Just bear in mind, a year ago this week James Storm committed what was a "borderline criminal" act (AKA attempted murder) when he pushed Mickie James in front of a train.
It makes the McMahon promo this week look genius in comparison. I don't know how that video gets approved, who watched that and said it should go on national television?
It makes the McMahon promo this week look genius in comparison. I don't know how that video gets approved, who watched that and said it should go on national television?
Originally Posted by Hollie_Louise:
“Please tell me that didn't actually go out television.”
“Please tell me that didn't actually go out television.”
Sunday 9pm Challenge. In fairness if the point is to get TNA noticed by the internet it succeeded... brother Nero.
Been noticed that Mark Dallas just started following Challenge on twitter and some hope this maybe the beginning of the end of TNA on British telly. But c'mon, we're no that lucky.
Raw ratings in
Hour 1 - 3.282
Hour 2 - 3.324
Hour 3 - 3.081
Hour number 2 grew and hour 3 hit by the over run for the nba.
Not bad considering the nba play off finals for 9pm hit 15.996!!😱
Hour 1 - 3.282
Hour 2 - 3.324
Hour 3 - 3.081
Hour number 2 grew and hour 3 hit by the over run for the nba.
Not bad considering the nba play off finals for 9pm hit 15.996!!😱
Originally Posted by Hollie_Louise:
“Just bear in mind, a year ago this week James Storm committed what was a "borderline criminal" act (AKA attempted murder) when he pushed Mickie James in front of a train.
It makes the McMahon promo this week look genius in comparison. I don't know how that video gets approved, who watched that and said it should go on national television?”
“Just bear in mind, a year ago this week James Storm committed what was a "borderline criminal" act (AKA attempted murder) when he pushed Mickie James in front of a train.
It makes the McMahon promo this week look genius in comparison. I don't know how that video gets approved, who watched that and said it should go on national television?”
Haha
thanks for reminding me of this. I had to go back and listen to Bryan Vinnys review of it on youtube.
"what COCKS!"
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