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Android Pay to Rival Apple Pay in the UK Next Month


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Old 01-03-2016, 08:58
jchamier
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With EE Cash On Tap you just tap the phone and that's it. You don't have to touch the button or you could be wearing gloves. Contactless cards don't need a PIN so why should a phone doing the same thing?
A PIN seems silly as it slows it down. The EECash on Tap, and Barclays bPay alternatives are also limited to £30 in stores. They are just the same as your card. (So I never understood why anyone would bother with them)

The point about Apple Pay (and Android Pay) is you can spend MORE than the £30 UK limit. You can buy a Mac worth £1500 in an Apple Store using Apple Pay for example. The only way the banks would allow this was if there was a way to check the human was the right human - so fingerprint, or PIN or signature.

To me using PIN on an Android Pay phone is pointless, might as well just use traditional Chip&PIN card.
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Old 01-03-2016, 10:24
Mark in Essex
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I think I'd prefer to either have to unlock the phone or swipe my finger as I'll only be using it in emergencies if I have forgotten my card (don't usually carry my wallet round with me all the time (keep it in my car in the daytime) and only take my card out with me if I think I may be going somewhere to buy something, but sometimes something crops up where I need to buy something (like when I pop to the gym and my wife asks me to buy a couple of things from the shop on the way back once I've already left home)).
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Old 01-03-2016, 10:44
IvanIV
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I do not see an attraction in this. Yet. I have a contactless card for small amounts, for higher I have to enter a pin. I feel safer not having the card info cloned somewhere, too. I wonder what shops think about it. Credit card companies get their cut from the paid amount and now it's also Apple and Google waiting in the line, too. Without raising the price the shops can only hope using the smartphones will bring more business for them.
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Old 01-03-2016, 19:43
wb9999
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Ok, so get phone out of pocket, unlock it and hold against terminal ( after setting it all up before hand) vs get card out of pocket, hold against terminal, done.
Other than the sheer novelty factor I really cant see the advantages of paying using a phone
I have a card that is not contactless (chip and pin only) but is enabled for Apple Pay. And, as has been pointed out, it can work for purchases above the £30 contactless limit.
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Old 01-03-2016, 19:50
Thine Wonk
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I do not see an attraction in this. Yet. I have a contactless card for small amounts, for higher I have to enter a pin. I feel safer not having the card info cloned somewhere, too. I wonder what shops think about it. Credit card companies get their cut from the paid amount and now it's also Apple and Google waiting in the line, too. Without raising the price the shops can only hope using the smartphones will bring more business for them.
Retailers like contactless as I believe they pay a lot less to the payment processor for those transactions.
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Old 01-03-2016, 23:49
PrinceGaz
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Great. That's just what we need: multiple competing contactless payment standards.

We've already got an easily recognised and widely used one here in the UK which is included on all major bank cards for transactions up to £30. That covers everything you're likely to want to use it for in a hurry, such as local public-transport, a convenience store grocery purchase, or another drink in a Wetherspoons if you're too drunk to work out which coins or notes the person behind the bar might need.

Add Apple Pay and Google Pay to that and the readers will now need three separate symbols to show what they accept. Four if Barclays bPay is also accepted. Let's hope Samsung's own payment system isn't launched here or that would be five. That way madness lies.

Is it really too time consuming to type in a PIN when spending over £30?
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Old 02-03-2016, 01:09
WelshBluebird
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Great. That's just what we need: multiple competing contactless payment standards.

We've already got an easily recognised and widely used one here in the UK which is included on all major bank cards for transactions up to £30. That covers everything you're likely to want to use it for in a hurry, such as local public-transport, a convenience store grocery purchase, or another drink in a Wetherspoons if you're too drunk to work out which coins or notes the person behind the bar might need.

Add Apple Pay and Google Pay to that and the readers will now need three separate symbols to show what they accept. Four if Barclays bPay is also accepted. Let's hope Samsung's own payment system isn't launched here or that would be five. That way madness lies.

Is it really too time consuming to type in a PIN when spending over £30?
Except they aren't really competing standards. They all use the same NFC standard contactless cards use but with an addition (that is again part of the a standard) for authenticated transactions to allow purchases over £30.

What they are in reality are competing implementations of the same underlying standard.

So yes, while it is confusing to the customer at the end of the day anywhere that accepts contactless cards will also accept Apple Pay, Android Pay, Samsung Pay (and indeed barclays bPay - which is just the contactless chip from a card in a different form factor). And anywhere that has updates their terminals to accept authenticated payments of more than £30 should also work with Apple Pay, Android Pay and Samsung Pay for that.
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Old 02-03-2016, 09:36
The Sack
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I've been using contactless payments via NFC (not a bpay sticker) thanks to Barclaycard for a while and because it is linked direct to my card and not a pay system it works anywhere contactless is available. I find it really handy, £30 tap and pay or £100 pin and tap.
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Old 03-03-2016, 08:25
natbike
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I think that there is also a convenience in access to your phone. Like most people I know, I keep my phone in a pocket that allows me to use one hand to pick up my phone and answer calls. If I pay by card I have to use 2 hands (remove wallet, then remove desired card).

In London it's rare to not accept contactless payments. Everywhere will be similar soon. Nobody really wants to needlessly transport more cash than they have to due to security issues.
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Old 04-03-2016, 02:36
zz9
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I do not see an attraction in this. Yet. I have a contactless card for small amounts, for higher I have to enter a pin. I feel safer not having the card info cloned somewhere, too. I wonder what shops think about it. Credit card companies get their cut from the paid amount and now it's also Apple and Google waiting in the line, too. Without raising the price the shops can only hope using the smartphones will bring more business for them.
For most shops it is cheaper to take cards than cash. The only exceptions are tiny owner run shops where the owner can just take cash out of the till to pay his bills. For everyone else the processing fees for cards are less than the fees and costs for taking cash.
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Old 04-03-2016, 02:39
zz9
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I think that there is also a convenience in access to your phone. Like most people I know, I keep my phone in a pocket that allows me to use one hand to pick up my phone and answer calls. If I pay by card I have to use 2 hands (remove wallet, then remove desired card).

In London it's rare to not accept contactless payments. Everywhere will be similar soon. Nobody really wants to needlessly transport more cash than they have to due to security issues.
And the tube of course.

Another advantage of using a phone is you get a record of all your transactions. With a card you often don't even get a receipt. I can look at all my transactions and if I see a charge on my statement I don't recognise I can double check it on my phone. It also displays the charge at the time of purchase so you can see you have been charged the right amount.
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Old 04-03-2016, 12:49
finbaar
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I think that there is also a convenience in access to your phone. Like most people I know, I keep my phone in a pocket that allows me to use one hand to pick up my phone and answer calls. If I pay by card I have to use 2 hands (remove wallet, then remove desired card).

In London it's rare to not accept contactless payments. Everywhere will be similar soon. Nobody really wants to needlessly transport more cash than they have to due to security issues.
Well not everywhere is like London you know. Some of us don't live in a tech paradise.

Here in Cumbria we not only haven't even adopted LSD – the sheep is still official currency.
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Old 05-03-2016, 19:28
Stiggles
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I managed to download the app the other day somehow! Wont register any of my cards yet though.
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Old 06-03-2016, 09:11
Stuart_h
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Isn't one of the big differences (and I may be out of date here) that apple charge an additional fee for use of their payment method (to the vendor) whereas android pay costs nothing extra.

Is guess if that's still true then android pay will be more popular with sellers.
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Old 06-03-2016, 09:21
NathDogg
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Isn't one of the big differences (and I may be out of date here) that apple charge an additional fee for use of their payment method (to the vendor) whereas android pay costs nothing extra.

Is guess if that's still true then android pay will be more popular with sellers.
I believe the banks pay an additional service charge to apple. As a seller it should be handled the same as any other nfc transaction.
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Old 06-03-2016, 09:31
psionic
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Isn't one of the big differences (and I may be out of date here) that apple charge an additional fee for use of their payment method (to the vendor) whereas android pay costs nothing extra.

Is guess if that's still true then android pay will be more popular with sellers.
AFAIK Apple charges 0.15% to the BANK not the vendor. So far this hasn't been passed on to vendors who continue paying the same as they have always been for card transactions.
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Old 06-03-2016, 12:37
Aye Up
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Can Apple Pay be used with any contactless terminal or does hthe vendor have to support Apple Pay specifically?
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Old 06-03-2016, 12:56
B_W2
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Any contactless terminal as far as I am aware- and have used it at lots also even without specific Apple Pay branding. Let's hope more places adopt NFC, keep going!! Also a nice rise to £50 limit would be great, especially for Apple Pay customers who can authenticate with a fingerprint (Android Pay also if needs be)
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Old 06-03-2016, 14:49
Aye Up
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Any contactless terminal as far as I am aware- and have used it at lots also even without specific Apple Pay branding. Let's hope more places adopt NFC, keep going!! Also a nice rise to £50 limit would be great, especially for Apple Pay customers who can authenticate with a fingerprint (Android Pay also if needs be)
I think you're right, though Apple don't half bloody confuse things when hey talk about vendors accepting Apple Pay and then everywhere else contactless is available.

Would it not be easier if they just said it was accepted everywhere the contactless symbol is shown?

http://www.apple.com/uk/apple-pay/wh...use-apple-pay/
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Old 06-03-2016, 15:29
d123
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I think you're right, though Apple don't half bloody confuse things when hey talk about vendors accepting Apple Pay and then everywhere else contactless is available.

Would it not be easier if they just said it was accepted everywhere the contactless symbol is shown?

http://www.apple.com/uk/apple-pay/wh...use-apple-pay/
I think the difference is transaction amounts, a retailer who accepts ApplePay specifically has the new equipment and shouldn't have a £30 contactless limit, other retailers who incidentally accept ApplePay by virtue of the fact that they accept contactless will be restricted to £30.

Can I accept transactions over £30 in my shop?

Apple Pay allows your customers to make easy and secure contactless payments at any amount. If your payment terminal or payment provider doesn’t support the latest network specifications, as with contactless debit and credit cards today, your customers might need to insert their card if the transaction amount is over £30.

To accept Apple Pay for transactions over £30, your payment terminal must be capable and configured properly, and your payment provider needs to support the latest network contactless specifications. Share the consumer device cardmember verification white paper with your payment provider and ask them how you can allow your customers to use Apple Pay for any amount.
https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT204906
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Old 06-03-2016, 21:01
WelshBluebird
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The way I understand it is that:

1 - Any Contactless terminal will support Apple, Android and Samsung Pay with a limit of £30.

2 - If the terminal supports it, has the correct software and configuration and if the retailer allows it, then it can also support Apple, Android or Samsung Pay without a limit (as the payment will be used with either a pin on the phone or a fingerprint scan). This is part of the contactless spec so isn't specific to any one method of those 3 (or if anyone else does a similar thing).

3 - This has nothing to do with what stickers the terminal has on it (so you can have an Apple Pay sticker but still be limited to £30).

4 - Samsung pay is also supported for some types of card swipe terminal assuming the swipe part of the terminal is enabled with no limits although I am not sure if this will be supported in the UK (where swiping a card is much less common than the US).
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Old 07-03-2016, 10:22
BKM
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.....if the retailer allows it, then it can also support Apple, Android or Samsung Pay without a limit (
Are you sure it is the retailer and not the issuing bank? I would imagine that, as long as the retailer knows they are guaranteed to be paid, they don't care about contactless limits that much!
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Old 07-03-2016, 12:19
lamby
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So to use Android Pay, you need a NFC phone?
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Old 07-03-2016, 12:37
Roush
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So to use Android Pay, you need a NFC phone?
Yes, an NFC equipped phone running Android 4.4 or later.
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Old 07-03-2016, 12:46
Roush
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Are you sure it is the retailer and not the issuing bank? I would imagine that, as long as the retailer knows they are guaranteed to be paid, they don't care about contactless limits that much!
It's all done at the card terminal before a card / device is presented, so the issuer isn't involved yet.

The terminal has to be running software that supports cardholder verification on contactless transactions and the feature has to be enabled in the terminal's configuration.

The issuer will know it's an Apple Pay transaction due to the way the card provisioning and tokenisation works, but they aren't allowed to decline cardholder-verified contactless transactions purely because they are over the contactless limit. They will have agreed to this as part of offering Apple Pay.

I don't see Android Pay operating any differently to this.
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