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Football Neutrals Thread - Part 2


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Old 16-05-2016, 15:06
Dandem
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Mesut Ozil isn't good because he doesn't kick the ball very hard
Did he say this? Please tell me he said this. Because that's amazing if he said this.

I've still heard no names coming forward as to who would replace Wilshere, apart from the depressingly mediocre Mark Noble. The sad fact is that England are currently not blessed with world class talent in central midfield, and Wilshere is one of the best we've got, regardless of whether or not he's on the same level as Xavi and Pirlo.

He's a cut above bloody Noble at least.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:06
batdude_uk1
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They're all but verbatim, there was no context to remove. It's the exact points you made at the time and were roundly questioned on, before in a few cases just repeating them later.
They are out of context within the topics that were being covered at the time, so just pulling them all out of thin air, and putting them in a post as you did, just makes your post mean basically nothing.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:07
celesti
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No, they are out of the topic they were in but there's no context in any of the threads that changes them. To illustrate I've added the Ozil saga to my post.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:13
batdude_uk1
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Did he say this? Please tell me he said this. Because that's amazing if he said this.

I've still heard no names coming forward as to who would replace Wilshere, apart from the depressingly mediocre Mark Noble. The sad fact is that England are currently not blessed with world class talent in central midfield, and Wilshere is one of the best we've got, regardless of whether or not he's on the same level as Xavi and Pirlo.

He's a cut above bloody Noble at least.
Not within the context that is trying to be put forward in this particular back and forth.

I have not for one moment suggested that Wilshire is on the same level as those two players that you mention.

As for replacing Wilshire in the squad, it depends on what we are looking to do, I would take him out of the squad and replace him with an extra defender, so that we have a better range of cover there.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:15
batdude_uk1
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No, they are out of the topic they were in but there's no context in any of the threads that changes them. To illustrate I've added the Ozil saga to my post.
If you look at what I was saying at the time, it was part of the illustrative nature of his style of play.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:16
celesti
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Ok then, benefit of the doubt and let's pretend the entire conversation isn't on the previous page - what is the context of this specific quote?


He is no way near good enough, consistently, he is just too flaky, I don't think that I have ever seen him hit a ball hard before, it just seems to be all flicks, and outside of the boot stuff.


From what I can see, the 'illustrative nature of his style of play' boils down to him being no way near good enough and too flaky, illustrated by you never having seen him kick a ball hard. Like I said but was apparently way out of context.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:19
batdude_uk1
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Ok then, benefit of the doubt and let's pretend the entire conversation isn't on the previous page - what is the context of this specific quote?


He is no way near good enough, consistently, he is just too flaky, I don't think that I have ever seen him hit a ball hard before, it just seems to be all flicks, and outside of the boot stuff.
The context as I said above was about describing him as a player, he is about the subtle, rather than the outlandish style of others.

For the price that he cost Arsenal, he should be doing more, scoring more goals himself, and looking to be more effective in the important matches, especially in the Champions League.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:21
celesti
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'He's not good enough, here are reasons why' Nothing's been taken out of context at all.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:24
batdude_uk1
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'He's not good enough, here are reasons why' Nothing's been taken out of context at all.
You missed a key part or word out, the word "consistently", he has some very good games, but not consistent enough to make Arsenal challenge for the big and important trophies, which for a player who cost such a high figure, should be doing.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:28
celesti
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He should really work on his kicking.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:28
DavidT
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You missed a key part or word out, the word "consistently", he has some very good games, but not consistent enough to make Arsenal challenge for the big and important trophies, which for a player who cost such a high figure, should be doing.
No he didn't, you simply don't understand anything and its utterly pointless anyone trying to educate you. Reply as you must, as you do to everything but I won't be reading it.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:29
batdude_uk1
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He should really work on his kicking.
Kicking yes in terms of being able to score more goals then he currently does.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:29
CGG_12
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Wilshere has to go

I imagine he'll even start the first match once he gets the warm ups under his belt. Crucial player

Shame for Drinkwater if he misses out which I imagine he will. Need to keep Sterling and Townsend as wing options
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:30
batdude_uk1
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No he didn't, you simply don't understand anything and its utterly pointless anyone trying to educate you. Reply as you must, as you do to everything but I won't be reading it.
I understand perfectly well, I just happen to have a different viewpoint on this particular topic, no harm in that is there?
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:32
celesti
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Humm, you can score goals with your head too, he should try and head more, head hard, and head on target.

Let's ignore that he creates so many chances (as his the basic MO of his role) that if Arsenal had a clinical striker that person could waltz the golden boot by Christmas.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:33
batdude_uk1
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Wilshere has to go

I imagine he'll even start the first match once he gets the warm ups under his belt. Crucial player

Shame for Drinkwater if he misses out which I imagine he will. Need to keep Sterling and Townsend as wing options
How would the midfield be set up to accommodate Wilshire, as Dier and Ali presumably will start, as they have been fantastic this season, plus if you are wishing Townsend and Sterling to play, that is four midfielders there, will you only be playing one up front?
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:35
batdude_uk1
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Humm, you can score goals with your head too, he should try and head more, head hard, and head on target.

Let's ignore that he creates so many chances (as his the basic MO of his role) that if Arsenal had a clinical striker that person could waltz the golden boot by Christmas.
Yes he creates chances, but for a player that has so much talent, he should be doing more than that, he should be scoring goals, by whatever means, head or foot.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:36
Dandem
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How would the midfield be set up to accommodate Wilshire, as Dier and Ali presumably will start, as they have been fantastic this season, plus if you are wishing Townsend and Sterling to play, that is four midfielders there, will you only be playing one up front?
Well at least one of Townsend/Sterling will be on the bench for a kick off. Let's say Hodgson plays a 4-3-3, you'll have Wilshere, Alli and Dier in one 3, and Townsend, Kane and (probably) Rooney in the other 3.

There, wasn't that easy.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:37
celesti
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Hodgson doesn't play with two central strikers, as mentioned before. Wilshere would quite easily slot in with Dier in place of a Henderson or Delph, if anyone's going to threaten Alli's spot in the team it's likely to be Rooney.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:39
batdude_uk1
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Well at least one of Townsend/Sterling will be on the bench for a kick off. Let's say Hodgson plays a 4-3-3, you'll have Wilshere, Alli and Dier in one 3, and Townsend, Kane and (probably) Rooney in the other 3.

There, wasn't that easy.
That leaves us very open in the centre of the park, I would be very worried if I saw that as the team.

But fair enough, if you think that set-up would be good for us, I asked you a question and you answered it, I can't ask for much more than that!
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:41
batdude_uk1
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Hodgson doesn't play with two central strikers, as mentioned before. Wilshere would quite easily slot in with Dier in place of a Henderson or Delph, if anyone's going to threaten Alli's spot in the team it's likely to be Rooney.
Surely Kane and Vardy both have to play, they have both been on top form, and not playing either would mean us not having our best goalscoring options on the pitch.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:42
celesti
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Yes he creates chances, but for a player that has so much talent, he should be doing more than that, he should be scoring goals, by whatever means, head or foot.
That's not his game though, he's a creator above all else, something he does better and more often than practically anyone. His goal to games ratio is almost robotically consistent throughout his career at around the 1 in 5 mark, it's not just simply the better the player = the more goals they should score.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:43
celesti
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That leaves us very open in the centre of the park, I would be very worried if I saw that as the team.
Surely Kane and Vardy both have to play, they have both been on top form, and not playing either would mean us not having our best goalscoring options on the pitch.
If you're worried about three players leaving the central midfield exposed, you can't play two strikers too.

Kane's almost certainly going to be the main forward, if Vardy starts it'd be in a wider role with someone on the other flank. I'd have him come off the bench to add a bit of urgency if needed.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:47
Dandem
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That leaves us very open in the centre of the park, I would be very worried if I saw that as the team.

But fair enough, if you think that set-up would be good for us, I asked you a question and you answered it, I can't ask for much more than that!
Oh no, that's not the team I'd play. I posted my team about a page or 2 ago, that's just how I think Hodgson will line up whilst simultaneously including the 3 specified players.
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Old 16-05-2016, 15:51
batdude_uk1
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If you're worried about three players leaving the central midfield exposed, you can't play two strikers too.

Kane's almost certainly going to be the main forward, if Vardy starts it'd be in a wider role with someone on the other flank. I'd have him come off the bench to add a bit of urgency if needed.
I think both Kane and Vardy deserve to play and start, as they both have been far too good to not play either.

So if they both were to play I would have a central midfield of Henderson and Dier to create that pathway to allow say a Rooney or an Ali to perform in "the hole".
Then you could play two wider players to do what they should be good at.
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