Surely not? To say if Ibra had scored that header is plain daft, had it hit the bar or an excellent save perhaps use that argument but he cocked it up and it never threatened our goal at all.

I'd counter that argument then with the 2 outstanding saves De Gea made from Coutinho & Can.

It is dropped points simply because we didn't win the game, that is just going strictly by the facts of things.
As for being unlucky, well we had a gameplan, that almost worked to perfection if Ibra could have scored that header of his.

There are plenty of what of if's that both sides can point to, that is very true, however we were just talking from a United perspective, as that was what you were asking myself about.

In the state that we are in, in terms of the league table, and our current points total, we need as many wins as we can get to move on up the league table, so any dropped points, even at this stage of the season, are not helpful to the cause.

Not so long ago Chelsea were considered in trouble and unlikely to finish in the top four. Now they're in fourth, one point behind Liverpool who people are talking of being in a title race.

It's only October, it's way too soon to consider yourselves out of the top four race. You're in terrible form, but that's, well, form. Teams have them, and things look bleak when you're in terrible form. But things can change, and if you get into some good form things start to look promising again. A good win can change things. Maybe if Mkhitaryan gets some games, or if Zlatan goes on a goalscoring run.

As it stands, it doesn't look like you'll finish in the top four. And right now, I'm doubting it. The teams currently in the top four are looking good, and there's Tottenham in fifth. But a few consecutive wins might change my opinion. If you can capitalise on your rivals making mistakes and dropping points, including when they play each other, you'll be back in the race.



A bit of a contradiction there. You say the teams above you possess a striker who is scoring goals, unlike you, then list Sturridge who is struggling to get (league) goals. The odd thing about Liverpool's goals is that they're not coming from strikers. In fact, most of the time we don't even play with strikers. Firmino is our main forward and he's not a striker.

Oh, and Janssen is also struggling for goals. According to Wikipedia, he's got 3 goals in 13 appearances. 1 in 10 league appearances, 2 in 2 League Cup appearances.


If your game plan relied on a header to be the difference between 1 and 3 points then it doesn't sound very promising.

What I meant by our gameplan at Anfield was that we set up to be tight at the back, (which we were), and then to try and take advantage of any chances that we got either on a break, or via our own making, which we very nearly did, hence why we were a tad unfortunate not to come away with the full three points.

As for the strikers comment from other clubs, you make a good point about your club, and I admit that I only included Sturridge, as he is in a bit of a good patch in terms of goals scored elsewhere away from the league, but at least he is scoring goals for you.
For example, Rooney passed up two potential chances to score in the European game we had recently, so we cannot even say something similar, "at least our strikers are scoring away from the league, so it might be just a case of transferring that form into a league game".
You are doing very well at spreading your goals in amongst a few players, and if you do decide to play with Sturridge, then he could come in, with a hunger to want to prove the manager wrong, whilst also being in a bit of decent goalscoring form, a good combination to have I would say.

Spurs are also a tricky one, as obviously their main striker Kane has been out for a while now, so others have had to step up in his absence, with perhaps Ali shouldering most of the goalscoring so far, but they do have potential in their other strikers.

We are still awaiting for Ibra to come good, or for Rashford to manage to do something from a wide area, Martial has apart from Stoke, sadly not hit the heights of last season so far, and well Rooney has been talked about a lot, so we don't need to revisit that situation.

A lot of our goalscoring burden, at the moment is falling on the shoulders of our midfielders, and as good as Mata is, he cannot be a provider and a goalscorer at the same time.
We need others to chip in with their fair share of goals, and at the moment, that isn't happening.

Yes we have been playing very well against Stoke, and Burnley, (less said about Chelsea the better), but without getting multiple goals and winning those matches, then the performance suddenly doesn't look as good unfortunately, or at the very least, it takes some of the gloss off of the final results of those matches.

If we can find someone akin to who our rivals have scoring goals, then and perhaps only then, will we move up the league table.

Sturridge isn't in good form at all. Got two in the League Cup, and he is scoring when he plays in the League Cup, but really he wasn't a good example to use. You aren't going to get far in the league if your striker isn't scoring league goals. In his current state, he's a poor example to use to explain why Liverpool are doing well. He's contributed when he's played, but not with goals.

I'm just nitpicking at the example you used, not the point you're making. Our leftback has more goals than Sturridge this season. I mean they both have four this season, but Milner's got four in the league. Hell, Lovren (2) and Matip (1) have more league goals than him!

I know a goal is a goal no matter how it is scored, but I think and please correct me if I am wrong, are Milners goals this season all been either pens or I think a free-kick (I could be remembering this wrongly )??
So it is a bit different to a striker scoring goals in open play etc, like away from the league Sturridge has recently.

You are doing well as a collective going forward, and if you can sort out your defensive side, then (unfortunately for myself) I can see you pushing the top teams quite far this season.

Yes, they're all penalties. But they're goals, and he has more than Sturridge. Milner is our main penalty taker. Sturridge doesn't have a good record at penalties. Milner, Matip, and Lovren have more league goals this season than Sturridge. I don't know why people look down on goals scored from penalties and free kicks, as if it's not as significant as goals from open play.

Again, I'm just nitpicking at your use of Sturridge and Janssen because they weren't good examples, and Sturridge in particular shouldn't have been an example. If you're talking about climbing up the league, and that the teams above you have strikers getting league goals, then you can't list a striker who isn't scoring league goals, who hasn't got a single league goal this season so far. If you wanted to include a Liverpool goalscorer, then Firmino is the one to go to.

Fair enough, it was just a point about goalscoring, and who is doing it for each team, and at the moment we don't have a goalscorer who is matching those above us.
You and perhaps Spurs are somewhat bucking that trend, so fair play to you for that.
It does prove that the collective is sometimes better than having a top class striker to rely upon for goals.

On a more lighter subject, if anyone is interested we have I think two birthdays today, as Irwin is turning 51 (wow that makes me feel really old right now!), and Rashford is turning 19.

The main problem man united have is that you are too negative against the big teams. You always seem afraid to go for it against the flair teams.

Suspect it will be the same against Arsenal in two weeks, you will park the bus despite being the home team

I'm curious about what you mean by 'Conte to some extent'? He's new to the league, nevermind club. Unlike Mourinho who's only new to his club but has plenty of experience working over here.

Janssen wasn't a good example to use then. Aside from only having scored one goal in the league, all three of the total goals he's scored were penalties.

conte to some extent lol. whats he on about?

Schweinsteiger and Jones have ben training with the first team today, maybe Schweinsteiger might get a game Thursday.

It'd be a kick in the plums for Schneiderlin, if he does.

Mourinho's already implied that Carrick will play, so I could only see him on the bench at most.

Schweini hasn't played I believe since last March, so starting him in a game that we really have to win, to ease our progress to the next round, might not be the best of ideas.

Having him on the bench might be a better idea.

I referred to managers new to their club, if you want to start a discussion about managers new to the league, we can do that as well.


Think about it for a moment or check their appointment dates and it should become clear, at least to some extent.

dont be silly. appointed before after euros doesnt matter. conte is new to chelsea and new to the prem.

Yes I got that you were talking about managers new to their club, but as you seemed to be suggesting Conte has an advantage over Mourinho (even though he's actually had no longer to work with the players) then it's fair to mention that he's also new to the league. If anything, Mourinho has the advantage over him with all of his experience over here. It was one of the worst kept secrets in football that Mourinho was being lined up for the United job, so I'm sure he was making plans a good while before being officially appointed.

Bastian I really hope José has changed his mind on him could be a good option for certain games

All that's why I qualified it, to some extent.

Neither man could do much or make firm plans until the certainty of their appointment though, so Conte had in theory that extra 6 or 7 weeks over Mourinho. Unless of course you believe the pre-contract contract rumours, but even then... The effects of familiarity or lack of it with the PL is a different question altogether, something we could discuss for weeks. I tend to think the quality of players there on arrival, followed by familiarity with the club and its players, are both more important.

We spent a couple of seasons with one striker of note - and his constant absence through injury crippled us as the backups were either misfits or not up to the task (or both!). Klopp likes mobile forward players and has settled on a false 9 system mostly which works fantastically for us - the Mane signing was to add more pace, creativity and goals to the side so we rely on a core of 4 to 5 players for goals and assists and spread the burden.

Playing Sturrudge short-curcuits our flow despite him as an individual being our best goalscorer - which doesn't help him or the team. Crowbarring a player into a team/system where he doesn't fit will break it and a player's success in other teams or systems can make that a hard admission to make.

It's about a balanced side that work well together - I personally think if United find a compatible partner for Pogba and a potent right-sided player (or get Mikataryan on the pitch and firing) they'll click.

Yes, they probably are more important, but adjusting to managing in a new league is still an issue to overcome nevertheless. Even the much acclaimed Guardiola is finding himself on a learning curve in English football.

Bearing in mind Conte was busy preparing and then coaching Italy at the Euros I'd say he was probably very limited in what he could do in those first few weeks after his appointment was officially announced. It's probably safe to assume he would have been discussing transfer targets with the club, although no deals were done until after the Euros anyway, and even then Kante was the only player the club managed to sign for him that he particularly wanted. He's had to make do with the others.

What are people here expecting team wise for our European match, and can we do enough to actually get back to goalscoring ways, and win the match?