That's exactly the point I tried to make earlier. Jose needs to get wise to that, and fast. Our defence just cannot "do" holding onto a one goal lead.


Fellaini's next game should be for another club. Hull or Sunderland, something like that.

There have been some bonkers comments on here this evening though - blooding youngsters? Concentrate on the Europa League? Is it an outbreak of mid winter madness or something?

I agree that the EL looks our most likely route to the Champions League next season - albeit still a mountain to climb as the competition is far more competitive than it used to be.

However, what you are suggesting is the equivalent of throwing away the league in December. The idea that we should be playing youngsters in every league game, regardless of whether we have a Europa League tie the next week or the next month, is up there with one of the stupidest suggestions you've ever made. And that's really saying something.

We should play our strongest team for every Europa League game, yes, and if there's a tough league game the same week then I agree the EL should take priority now. But that's as far as I'd go. There's still a chance of top four, albeit an increasingly slim one.

The europa league is still a big ask but if you win the group gives you a chance to be seeded in the first knock out draw but it's the long uncertainty of the europa league and it's doesn't return until February and at least you will know who is in it this week.

Teams like schalke, Roma, shaktar Donetsk, villireal and maybe even Seville yet again if these lose in the champions league would all have to be got past

Jesus Fellani is a joke of a player really we need to get shut of him. Jose needs to start picking up points fast this is not acceptable. Are finishing in the final third was just not there and the misplaced passes i counted was too much. Only great thing was the scousers losing and city yesterday.

The Europa League will of course not be easy by any stretch of the imagination, but how else are we going to get Champions League football next season, as I can't see it being via our league position, so we really should be going all out try and win it.

What I meant by playing youngsters is that for example, today we might have used F-M instead of Fellaini, or used Tunzabe instead of say Rojo, would the result really have been that much worse?
If we do that in enough games, whilst prioritising the Europa League, that kills two birds at the same time so to speak.

Of course it is frustrating, severely disheartening, and annoying to see us so far from even fifth place at this stage of the season, and I would of course rather this were not our current situation, but unfortunately it is, and until someone actually invents time travel, we will have to put up with it.

There just needs to be a refocusing on what our priorities are for the remainder of this season, yes we should of course still try to win as many league games as possible, but since it is now very unlikely that we will get anywhere above sixth, we can experiment a bit more with the team, be it the players used, or just even the tactics.
It is not so much throwing away the league, it is just looking at things realistically.
I would so like to be proven wrong, and for us to grab a place in the top four places, but currently that just does not look like being something that we will do.
This season now rests on what we do in Europe, winning a league or FA cup is just a bonus, a nice bonus yes, but just that a bonus.

I still don't know how both Rojo or Darmian get in ahead of Blind.

Mata should be starting considering he's one of our biggest goal threats from midfield and I am seriously getting pissed off when he's the first to get subbed practically every game whilst other under performing players stay on the pitch.

We are seriously lacking at least one clinical striker.

Rashford scored 3 in the league, Rooney 1. Zlatan 8 , which isn't a bad return (Zlatan)but when he or Mata don't score it's hard to see where the goals are coming from.

Need to ship out a few players and a few loan moves would be good in Jan.

Agreed on both accounts.

Pogba needs to get the Rooney treatment, I'm afraid. Look how Rooney's form has improved since he learnt he wasn't undroppable. Pogba needs to be benched after what I would consider an unacceptable performance level today. Too easily out-thought and too easily out-fought. Even if he wasn't the most expensive player in the world, that performance would have been abject. I want to see Jose make a statement.

Yeah the press treatment after getting pissed after the England game and being dropped on several occasions by Jose seems to have lit a fire under his arse.

No player should ever be a nailed on starter.

A draw is the difference between you closing the gap to Liverpool and "the league is lost - just play the kids"? Every game is a must win game, but let's play the kids because the results aren't that important anymore?

Huh??

The results are of course important, but we have to be realistic, are the teams above us going to drop enough points, and are we going to gain enough to be able to overtake them for one of those key places? Sure there are still a heck of a lot of points to play for, but we are asking for a lot to go in our favour for that to happen.

I never said that the results are not important, just that we can experiment slightly more, as currently we are not on course to get a top four place.

Hopefully we can go on a huge winning run of six, seven or more games, as that is what is now required to put real pressure from ourselves on the teams above ourselves, but until we find a way to score multiple goals in a match on a regular basis, that just will not be the case sadly.

You keep talking about being out of the race for top four, then talk about games being a "must win", and talk about closing the gap on Liverpool, despite you claiming to be out of the top four race every single time you drop points.

Now you're talking about playing kids for the remainder of the league campaign, because you don't think you'll finish higher, as if the results are no longer important as long as you finish in the top ten.

You can't think to just put the kids in for the rest of the league campaign and also say the games are a "must win". And you can't talk about closing the gap on Liverpool, then say you aren't finishing in the top four after a single draw. Next week you'll be saying the game is a "must win" again, and if you drop points you'll be talking about not finishing in the top four again.

Games are either must wins or they're not. They can't be must wins while also thinking you should just give the league to young players because the results won't make much difference if you aren't finishing in the top four.

Also, do you have to say "huh??" all the time? It's annoying.

Previously when the gap to the top four was in single digits, the chances of us managing to overcome it, and finish above the teams currently in those positions were small but still achievable, hence why us wining our games was so important.
Now that the gap is in double digits, and seemingly only going to increase as the season goes on (if the form of the teams involved carries on, ourselves included), then even if every game was a must win, we would still be someway off of the pace.

The game against Spurs, is I don't actually think as important as previous games were, as we have significantly given too much advantage to them and the other teams above us.
Would I still like to see us winning games, but of course, I hope that we win every game that we play, but I am realistic enough to know that just will not happen.

So, with that in mind, plus the fact that our kit deal requires us to being playing in the Champions League next year, otherwise we will see a huge downturn in payments from them, we have to look at the best possible way of doing so, and with the best will in the world, that is just not going to be via our league position, hence why the Europa League should be our main aim for the season now
Of course we should still play and try to win every league game, but between now and the end of the season, we will drop plenty of points, that much is certain, so with that in mind, I would rather if they are going to happen, they happen with one or two younger members in the team, then with more experienced players, as at the very least, the matches will be helping their development.

Hopefully though, I am dead wrong in my opinions, and that we go on a huge winning run, and finish in the top four, then I would not mind at all being wrong.

That's kind of ignoring the point I was making. You keep talking about must win games, you even said it about today's game.

You talked about closing the gap on Liverpool. And one draw later you're saying you won't get top four so just play the kids. You can't have both.

I am not ignoring your point, sorry if you feel as if I am.

Yes I did say that yesterday's game, because it was to take advantage of not just Liverpool's defeat, but also City's as well, and yes we did close the gap by a single point, but being realistic, we won't get too many more chances where two or more teams above us get beat before we play.

It is just about recognising where we currently are, we are battering it out with West Bromwich Albion, rather than yourselves for a league place, and it is tough to take really (no disrespect meant towards West Brom).
This means that we should look and see where is the best chance of rescuing this season, and coming out of it with any semblance of success, and that would be via winning the Europa League.
As great as an idea of getting in the top four league positions would be, I am realistic to know and recognise that it would take an awful lot to go in our favour to do so.
Now of course, winning the Europa League is by no means an easy thing to go, it is a very, very hard thing to do, but since that is an option to qualify for the Champions League, we need to take it as seriously as we possibly can due to our current circumstances in the league.

This does not mean that I am not bothered by league results, it just means that I am being realistic in that of course before every game I would like us to win, but I know that it is most likely that we will not end up in the top four, so why not try to blood a few youngsters along the way?

You just can't go from "let's close the gap on Liverpool" to "we're not getting top four, let's play the young players and concentrate on the Europa League" in the space of a draw. That's my entire point. You talk about closing gaps and games being "must win" and then you talk about playing young players because you think top four is out of reach. You're essentially throwing away your league campaign in December.

Jose used to be amusing now he's showing himself as just a brat.
Man United will give him this season and part of next then boot him.
Great Manager?
No way.
He buys a team.
He's been well caught out as ordinary at best.

So if this theory is correct how did he buy a team for Inter and Porto?

If, by your logic, he buys a team, then surely Man United should be winning things with the money he's had available and spent? If he just buys success, then he's at the right club to do so.

well he certainly appears to be struggling to coach this team to even the sum of its parts, nevermind anything more.

Just out of interest, which manager doesn't "buys a team"?!
As I could be wrong here, but every manager spends money on a team, so that is hardly a negative to be thrown at José.

He has spent more than any manager in history

Lose next Sunday and there will be a big points gap opened up from the top 5 in the PL. Should this happen, effectively everyone else will be playing for 6 place.

Even with that in mind, other managers do still spend money of their respective teams, so saying he is a poor manager because he spends money on a team doesn't make him unique does it?


There already is a fairly big gap from fifth place down, the teams that are currently in those top five places will be the ones to finish in them, although what order, I don't quite know just yet.

Nope, he's not a poor manager. but I'm just answering your point as to why the accusation is directed at him perhaps more than certain other managers.

Whenever the argument that Mourinho buys success comes up, I always say he's just good with money. He may well buy success, but he should take some credit for achieving it. Many managers spend a lot of money and fail. LvG spent £250m and only has an FA Cup and fourth place finish to show for it. Things haven't quite worked out just yet, but if Mourinho spends £250m I'd be confident he'd win a title or CL trophy, which of course isn't available to him this season.

He seems to be good with money, and I don't think that should be a criticism, it's just his style, and it works. Put him at a club like West Brom and he might not work out, but I don't think that makes him a bad manager, he's just suited to managing at the top level.

He'll probably win stuff at Man United before he leaves, and not just an FA Cup.