• TV
  • MOVIES
  • MUSIC
  • SHOWBIZ
  • SOAPS
  • GAMING
  • TECH
  • FORUMS
  • Follow
    • Follow
    • facebook
    • twitter
    • google+
    • instagram
    • youtube
Hearst Corporation
  • TV
  • MOVIES
  • MUSIC
  • SHOWBIZ
  • SOAPS
  • GAMING
  • TECH
  • FORUMS
Forums
  • Register
  • Login
  • Forums
  • Gadgets
  • Mobile Phones
Microsoft Lumia sales nose dive selling only 2.3 million phones in 3 months
<<
<
2 of 3
>>
>
gomezz
25-04-2016
Originally Posted by Moleskin:
“Android won even though that's far from perfect too.”

Such as OS updates to older devices and even newer non-Nexus devices taking ages to happen or never happening. One consequence of that is updated apps no longer being supported on a significant proportion of devices.
jonmorris
25-04-2016
Are there many apps that will only work on phones running the latest OS?

I find most apps say they'll run on Android 4 or above, and I expect it's similar on iOS.
jchamier
25-04-2016
Originally Posted by jonmorris:
“Are there many apps that will only work on phones running the latest OS?

I find most apps say they'll run on Android 4 or above, and I expect it's similar on iOS.”

iOS 9 runs on the 4S and iOS 7 is on the 4, and those are the oldest phones I suspect people to really use - most apps work on the 4 still ; both those phones have 512mb RAM, and the later have 1GB or more. The apple app store even gives your device the latest version of an app it can run, even if the vendor has submitted newer versions.
gomezz
25-04-2016
The one app I want to have that no longer runs is BT Sport. And there are a few others I wanted to try (ACAST is one I was after yesterday) that is not supported. My5 initially wouldn't run on my tablet but has since been made to run on earlier OS versions. At least Channel 4 did the sensible thing and keep the older version of All4 for older devices as well as the latest and greatest version.
IvanIV
25-04-2016
Originally Posted by Stig:
“Microsoft shot themselves in the foot again. Everyone was waiting for Windows 10 Phone devices, so wouldn't buy the 'old' models.”

There weren't any anyway. They were releasing low budget Lumias, but there were no flagship phones for a very long time. That's the main problem, IMO. Any momentum they thought WP was having was killed by MS not giving a shit about keeping the WP/ potential users interested. I had bought Lumia 1520, which apart from having to be upgraded in a fridge, is an excellent HW IMO, a long time ago and since then there was nothing tempting me. Surelly not L950 and L950XL. And they came a bit late and with an OS that has bugs discoverable in a daily usage.

The app problem is a cyclic one, without apps no users, and without users no apps. Yes, a lot of apps are needed/missed only because of the peer pressure, but that's not a way you can argue with a customer. They want the bloody app and it's available on iOS and Android, so that's 0 for the WM, +1 for one of the other two. MS is trying to do something with UWP universal apps where you (a developer) get the mobile app almost for free, they say, but one has to look at the history of app development for WP. Since WP7 there were more reboots of MS way to write apps than Windows 95 had on a bad day. They were backwards compatible, but one had to keep changing the way to program to use new features etc. Who knows if UWP won't be replaced with something else again. iOS and Android have a stable way to write apps since the beginning.

Microsoft is cool about the W10M, it would seem, they are a software company after all, it's enough if they have their services out there. But telling Samsung to install MS apps on their phones is not enough, I think. They have to have a successful platform of their own to demonstrate the services in their natural habitat, so to speak. And it can be embarrassing if their solutions for other platforms are better, simply because the developers got more resources to implement them and WM10 solution is not a priority.
Minardi
25-04-2016
They got WP8.1 working beautifully and then ditched it to start again. I love my Lumia 1020 but I think after 2.5 years it's perhaps got another 6 months in it, then I'll probably be off to Android.
pixel_pixel
25-04-2016
You only have to see the 950 to see the poor design when compared to the Nokia's. I take it Nokia are no longer designing for Lumia? Why They dropped the Nokia brand is beyond me. It amazes me how the 950 design got past the prototype stage, its awful.
d123
25-04-2016
Originally Posted by pixel_pixel:
“Why They dropped the Nokia brand is beyond me..”

Mainly because they had to at some point, MS only has the rights to use the Nokia name for a set period before it reverts back to Nokia ownership.

The Lumia name belongs to MS which is why the MS phones have ended up as Microsoft Lumia.
IvanIV
26-04-2016
Microsoft fired thousands and thousands of Nokia people, they basically killed their mobile phones division. It showed how serious Nadella's Microsoft was about their own mobile phone brand.
jonmorris
26-04-2016
I'm surprised Microsoft gets things wrong so often.

When I spoke to engineers working on the stop-gap fix for Windows Mobile (6.5 I think it was), the Microsoft opinion was that Windows Phone 7 would fix everything - but even then, a lot of Windows Mobile users were long suffering business users who were using devices given by their employer had various apps installed that never got ported to Windows Phone.

So for months, perhaps even years, business users carried on using Windows Mobile. In fact, Windows Mobile carried on for business users and new devices were still released. People still seem to use Windows Mobile devices today (couriers etc).

So, Microsoft couldn't even find a way to keep the customers it already had. Windows Phone had to start from scratch, and never gained momentum.

Then later, the thought was that when Windows 8 came out, everyone would buy a Windows phone because the UI was so similar. Except Windows 8 was near universally hated because the phone style UI just didn't work (as it was then) on a desktop. Of course 8.1 tried to fix certain issues, and arguably Windows 10 has nailed it, but - again - more irreversible damage was done.

And now it's all about the fact that apps for Windows 10 can be made to work on a phone with ease. That's all well and good, but are there actually that many great apps on the Windows Store for desktop users anyway? Sure, Windows has plenty of 'proper' applications, but has it ever really done that well with the cut down apps we were all supposed to be running in split screen windows?
finbaar
26-04-2016
I actually think Microsoft will continue with a limited number of handsets for the time being. They have enough money to see if W10 for mobile will take off and become self sustaining.
The future of Microsoft on mobile though is through getting it's services on iOS and Android, plus I can see them owning the >10" tablet market for serious users. I have an Office 356 sub and find the service on Android great.
jonmorris
26-04-2016
It would be mad to bail just now, if there's a chance that Windows 10 will sort everything. I suspect it won't however.

I think as Microsoft continues to release its apps/services for other platforms, including its keyboard for iOS just now, the company has already realised that it doesn't really need its own platform to continue making money.
ibatten
26-04-2016
Originally Posted by solare:
“ Reading the news, using Wikipedia, checking timetables, booking tickets and having the possibility to have tickets and boarding cards sent to my phone (something that's not possible with my non-smartphone) are really the only functions I need.”

In many cases, however, tickets and boarding cards require the transport company's app, or they require at the very least custom links to push an image into Wallet (on iPhone) or its equivalents. I would be interested to know how often a transport company that offers tickets and boarding passes for iPhone and Android does something, by accident or design, which excludes Windows phones, and whether they care.

A related point that no-one seems to have made is watches. Mainstream, sensible money stuff like the Motorola 360 and the Pebble only support iOS and Android; it's just not worth the effort supporting Windows. Now that may not matter to a lot of people - it doesn't matter to me, certainly - but it shows where the development effort is, and that "people with Windows phones" is a small enough market that companies can just shrug their shoulders. As go watches, so go travel apps.
jonmorris
26-04-2016
The same will apply in the future if/when IoT applications take off. Can you get these apps for Windows Phone?

What about VR?

And as mentioned, there's wearables. Not everyone cares about smartwatches, but what about the many different fitness wearables? Some do have support, but do they get the same level of support/updates?

This is a big problem even for the apps that ARE on Windows. They are often far inferior in terms of functionality and almost left to rot.
clonmult
26-04-2016
Originally Posted by jonmorris:
“The same will apply in the future if/when IoT applications take off. Can you get these apps for Windows Phone?

What about VR?

And as mentioned, there's wearables. Not everyone cares about smartwatches, but what about the many different fitness wearables? Some do have support, but do they get the same level of support/updates?

This is a big problem even for the apps that ARE on Windows. They are often far inferior in terms of functionality and almost left to rot.”

Fitbits WP client is pretty good, and tends to be kept up to date. Polar and Garmin don't support it. That was part of the reason why I went for a fitbit early last year. On one of your first points about banking apps, I'm with Barclays and their WP app is pretty good - it was definitely on par with their Android offering.

You're bang on with the functionality of many apps that are on Windows - my ex's daughter jumped to Android due to snapchat and instagram clients being either non existent or sucky. The Facebook client on Windows Phone is utter rubbish.

If MS can't encourage the "major" application vendors to support their product, they're pretty much screwed.
daleski75
26-04-2016
I think windows phone will stick around but to what degree is anyone's guess.
jonmorris
26-04-2016
When Microsoft paid some developers to write apps, I think it did more harm than good. It presumably didn't require any support beyond an agreed time, and probably made others demand money from MS to port their apps.

Nokia did the same with an official Facebook app and BlackBerry did it with Angry Birds and others. Didn't seem to help anyone much.
Minardi
26-04-2016
Originally Posted by clonmult:
“Fitbits WP client is pretty good, and tends to be kept up to date. Polar and Garmin don't support it. That was part of the reason why I went for a fitbit early last year. On one of your first points about banking apps, I'm with Barclays and their WP app is pretty good - it was definitely on par with their Android offering.

You're bang on with the functionality of many apps that are on Windows - my ex's daughter jumped to Android due to snapchat and instagram clients being either non existent or sucky. The Facebook client on Windows Phone is utter rubbish.

If MS can't encourage the "major" application vendors to support their product, they're pretty much screwed.”

This, basically. The apps that are there often haven't been updated for years, and no one cares. For me, WP8 has 3 months in it, probably. Then I'll have to do something. I can't do much before anyway as I'm swamped in work!
Moleskin
26-04-2016
Originally Posted by gomezz:
“The one app I want to have that no longer runs is BT Sport. And there are a few others I wanted to try (ACAST is one I was after yesterday) that is not supported. My5 initially wouldn't run on my tablet but has since been made to run on earlier OS versions. At least Channel 4 did the sensible thing and keep the older version of All4 for older devices as well as the latest and greatest version.”

The BT Sport app is the reason I updated to Windows 10, finally able to watch live games on my phone, but as I said, Windows Phone 10 is buggy, games crash, apps crash, websites crash, hope further updates fix it.
GreenLantern
26-04-2016
http://store.hp.com/us/en/ContentVie...tName=Elite-x3

....
1manonthebog
27-04-2016
This doesn't surprise me, Even die hard Windows Phone fan boys Paul Thurrott and Mary Jo Foley have given up hope and moved to Android. Flogging a dead horse springs to mind, WP has been dead for years.
pixel_pixel
27-04-2016
8.1 is a far superior OS than 10. I'm going to stick with it for as long as I can. There can lt be many products where the hardware and software takes a backwards step when a new version is launched.

If only they could bring back XP! That was the last decent desktop version. The problem is Windows is trying to be all sing and all dancing. They need to stick to their core values and products.

So will Nokia return to making phones in the future? They make some beautiful handsets. Shame Windows could not get the designs right for their own Lumias.
Everything Goes
27-04-2016
Originally Posted by pixel_pixel:
“8.1 is a far superior OS than 10. I'm going to stick with it for as long as I can. There can lt be many products where the hardware and software takes a backwards step when a new version is launched.

If only they could bring back XP! That was the last decent desktop version. The problem is Windows is trying to be all sing and all dancing. They need to stick to their core values and products.

So will Nokia return to making phones in the future? They make some beautiful handsets. Shame Windows could not get the designs right for their own Lumias.”

The Nokia brand should return this year. However the phones will be made under licence so who knows what they will be like.
IvanIV
27-04-2016
At least one can rollback to 8.1 if they are not happy with W10M. I like that W10M makes a better use of my L1520 Full HD screen, but that's about it. There are just so many issues with what MS is doing W10M at the moment. Unexciting hardware, buggy software, zero marketing, MS attitude - we don't care if anybody buys a W10M phone or not. I hope they are not surprised that Windows phone sales are in a free fall.
clonmult
27-04-2016
Originally Posted by pixel_pixel:
“8.1 is a far superior OS than 10. I'm going to stick with it for as long as I can. There can lt be many products where the hardware and software takes a backwards step when a new version is launched.

If only they could bring back XP! That was the last decent desktop version. The problem is Windows is trying to be all sing and all dancing. They need to stick to their core values and products.

So will Nokia return to making phones in the future? They make some beautiful handsets. Shame Windows could not get the designs right for their own Lumias.”

On the mobile, i agree - 8 is definitely better than 10. But on the desktop and tablet form factors, I can't - I have a couple of tablets on 8.1, both upgraded to 10 and feel it is much better. On my laptop it is more of a sideways move - definitely not worse.
<<
<
2 of 3
>>
>
VIEW DESKTOP SITE TOP

JOIN US HERE

  • Facebook
  • Twitter

Hearst Corporation

Hearst Corporation

DIGITAL SPY, PART OF THE HEARST UK ENTERTAINMENT NETWORK

© 2015 Hearst Magazines UK is the trading name of the National Magazine Company Ltd, 72 Broadwick Street, London, W1F 9EP. Registered in England 112955. All rights reserved.

  • Terms & Conditions
  • Privacy Policy
  • Cookie Policy
  • Complaints
  • Site Map