DS Forums

 
 

World Wrestling Entertainment Discussion 42 (Spoilers)


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 30-07-2016, 03:10
FMKK
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 26,167
Not sure there needs to be any 'criteria' though. At the end of the day, it's one person's list. Nothing more, nothing less
Well then why bother posting it? I just want to know what his judgements are other than favourites.
FMKK is offline   Reply With Quote
Please sign in or register to remove this advertisement.
Old 30-07-2016, 03:12
FMKK
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 26,167
I've not really looked at the list to see how it ranks talent, but assuming we're talking about the biggest draws. Pre-war superstars (Londos, Lewis, Gotch etc) can't easily or at all be compared to those who were on top when television gave wrestling a boom period in the 1950's. Then as wrestling became even more regional based in the 1960's there would have been wrestlers who were huge in one area, but not that big in another. A good example of that would be Big Daddy vs. Giant Haystacks in the UK, which peaked in 1981. Those British guys were household names for the time, but not very well known in other countries. That's not due to talent but rather a combination of freak appeal, the novelty of pro wrestling on television and more people getting a colour television.

There's too much of a difference between then and WWE going national and then international. Hogan became a household name all other the world, but Flair was a major asset for the NWA, Mid Atlantic and TBS. It could be argued he's underrated in that regard because the WWE onslaught was so strong in the mid 80's. The NWA/WCW and AWA went international, but due to Vince getting their first and forging strong links, rivals and 'wrasslers' were seen as imitators by some and simply less exciting to others.

Guys like The Undertaker, Bret Hart, Sting, Shawn Michaels, The Rock and Steve Austin were the first to really benefit from the new world of an international platform on satellite and cable television. Those guys would have eyes on them in every big arena, in every state and in nearly every country. The latter also benefited, or arguably negatively, from the internet as well. Though they also had to deal with kayfabe pretty much dying and wrestling becoming episodic TV centric. In the case of The Rock, that was the perfect platform. However, it would have been interesting to see how big of a draw he could have been should he have lasted longer. He also exited in a gimmicky world of car crash television aimed at young adult males rather than classic pro wrestling.
Obviously it's hard to judge anything across historical eras, but Jim Londos sold out 80,000 stadiums in Greece in the 1930s as well as being a star in the US. Those guys had more reach than you might think.
FMKK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 08:26
dave_windows
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 5,371
Obviously it's hard to judge anything across historical eras, but Jim Londos sold out 80,000 stadiums in Greece in the 1930s as well as being a star in the US. Those guys had more reach than you might think.
Back when I used to buy PWI Magazine I used to like it when they would look at history listings and Jim Londos would randomly appear having bare knuckles fight matches I guess todays term would be street fight or a No DQ match.

Well then why bother posting it? I just want to know what his judgements are other than favourites.
Why? Theres probably a million websites that do the same thing. Once you run a website your free to do what you want. Theres probably even a site somewhere that listed a top 100 wrestlers and probably put Heidenreich as number 1.

Saying that though about 5 years ago there was a youtube user who did a Top 1000 wrestlers of all time. From memory it was pretty lengthy and I do remember checking the members videos on a weekly basis because it was extremely well done how he had a video package for every wrestler that he had made himself and added his own commentary to the video. He didnt just do WWE/WCW but all the other foreign promotions like Japan etc, cant remember what he judged it on but it was a mixture of various stuff.

Sadly someone obviously reported it to youtube and had the account shut down as it was a thing of quality.
dave_windows is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 10:46
BFGArmy
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 14,316
Well then why bother posting it? I just want to know what his judgements are other than favourites.
I wasn't the one who posted it lol.

It's someone's opinion so if someone wants to post it they can.
BFGArmy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 12:07
PandaPawPaw
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Bamboo Island, Shango's Castle
Posts: 7,196
I don't know much about Will Ospreay but I did watch his match against Ricochet a while back and read that Ospreay was recently injured.

I also read he's only 23 and has had the following injuries:

He’s has two slipped discs in his back
Seven concussions
A shoulder that is prone to separation
Two fractured heels
Sciatica that is causing numbness in his foot

DAYUM! The guy needs to tone down his style or he's going to have his wrestling career cut way short (if it hasn't already).

BTW I thought his match against Ricochet was cool visually but I got bored after a while.
PandaPawPaw is offline Follow this poster on Twitter   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 12:33
FMKK
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 26,167
I don't know much about Will Ospreay but I did watch his match against Ricochet a while back and read that Ospreay was recently injured.

I also read he's only 23 and has had the following injuries:

He’s has two slipped discs in his back
Seven concussions
A shoulder that is prone to separation
Two fractured heels
Sciatica that is causing numbness in his foot

DAYUM! The guy needs to tone down his style or he's going to have his wrestling career cut way short (if it hasn't already).

BTW I thought his match against Ricochet was cool visually but I got bored after a while.
Agree, I kinda think those matches have a short shelf life because it's all flips and no story. I know that's what makes him unique but he'll be retired by 30 with all those injuries! It's amazing to think that he's got all that by 23 when some old school guys could get great reactions through playing to the crowd and barely doing any moves.
FMKK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 12:37
DanielF
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Burton upon Trent
Posts: 1,929
Just got Sky Sports back... shall be joining the weekly raw and smackdown bitchfest from now on!
DanielF is offline Follow this poster on Twitter   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 12:44
BFGArmy
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 14,316
Agree, I kinda think those matches have a short shelf life because it's all flips and no story. I know that's what makes him unique but he'll be retired by 30 with all those injuries! It's amazing to think that he's got all that by 23 when some old school guys could get great reactions through playing to the crowd and barely doing any moves.
Nothing wrong with a few flips. I do watch to be entertained at the end of the day - and if the story is OK then nothing wrong with some entertaining moves.

However that Richocet/Osprey match seemed to take it to ludicrous proportions for me- less is more sometimes.
BFGArmy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 13:11
dave_windows
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 5,371
Will we ever get a true Survivor Series PPV again? Over the years they have kinda derailed away from the origins where it has for a long time just looked like a regular PPV.

Id love to see the 2016 Survivor Series PPV and every single match was 4 vs 4 or 5 vs 5 matches.
dave_windows is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 13:21
batdude_uk1
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 69,147
Nothing wrong with a few flips. I do watch to be entertained at the end of the day - and if the story is OK then nothing wrong with some entertaining moves.

However that Richocet/Osprey match seemed to take it to ludicrous proportions for me- less is more sometimes.
To me it was almost like watching a ballet in a wrestling ring, it's incredible the moves and the quickness that they did them, but there was no storytelling, or any reason to continue watching the match beyond the first few min I thought.
batdude_uk1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 14:31
stu64
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Manchester
Posts: 3,178
Only just caught up with Raw/Smackdown. Raw was loads better and hopefully going forward it can build on a good opening show and continue being a better show each week.

As for Smackdown, thought it was a mess to be honest. The camera angle was awful and all it did was give me a headache. There was a lot of things wrong with SD but the camera angle was not one of them!

Also, Ziggler???!!! Honestly, really? In a main event match at Summerslam for the World Championship?? They missed the boat on Ziggler about 2/3 years ago, no one cares now and he is character has been buried so much it makes no sense. His PPV record is awful over the last 2 years as well, taking away pre show matches he has only won 2 matches and lost 11 in the last 2 years.

Surely if they wanted a surprise and start a new push then why not go fully in with a Bray Wyatt singles push? Actually invest properly in him this time as a singles guy but instead they went with Ziggler, madness.
stu64 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 14:57
dave_windows
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 5,371
Surely if they wanted a surprise and start a new push then why not go fully in with a Bray Wyatt singles push? Actually invest properly in him this time as a singles guy but instead they went with Ziggler, madness.
Because the overratted Wyatt's have been shoved down our throats for the past 4 years!

I do take your point on Ziggler though because yes they missed the boat on him and the past couple years hes just been a jobber every week. I would have liked it to be someone who hasent been in the main event scene before. I think that was the whole part of change how us fans are supposedly sick of current WWE we want a change.

I think if WWE hadent pissed about with AJ Styles so much this year and just shoved him in 2 PPV title matches against Roman, this week he could have been a viable contender that fans wanted to see happen. Smackdown really needed a strong NXT star that would end up in a title match at Summerslam to counteract with the strong lead that Finn Balor has done on Raw.
dave_windows is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 17:08
Lee_Smith2
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 1,929
They've got their marquee selling point for SummerSlam to attract the casuals. Balor/Rollins is a dream match for the wrestling fan. Plus the Styles/Cena singles rematch.

They probably don't feel the need to back theirselves into a corner, so have decided to give Ambrose a simple little defense against a former world champion.
Lee_Smith2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 17:37
BFGArmy
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 14,316
Ambrose/Wyatt would've given me horrible flashbacks to holograms and exploding TVs.
BFGArmy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 17:49
batdude_uk1
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 69,147
Charlotte v Banks has been announced for Summerslam.

Would be nice if it were a ladder match, or some other sort of match, rather than just another match for the women.
batdude_uk1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 18:02
stu64
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Manchester
Posts: 3,178
Ambrose/Wyatt would've given me horrible flashbacks to holograms and exploding TVs.
That was so bad I actually forgot!

I know Bray has been pushed a lot with the Wyatt Family but how many times have the actually gone the whole way with them? Never. They always lost the big matches and now it looks like The Wyatts are splitting up due to the draft, it is mad to think they never won the tag team belts.
stu64 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 19:19
Lee_Smith2
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 1,929
I'm sure Bray and Dean have already wrestled a dozen times apart from the PPV series. No wonder they brought back the brand split, now they can do it all again!

The Wyatt's got hit hard in their feuds with Cena and Taker. The latter was the worst and so counterproductive. He helps prop up the TV product and live events throughout 2014, only for The Undertaker to no sell the feud and go over cleanly. Yet the company ridicules that sort of thing in WCW documentaries.

With a bit of effort from creative, Luke Harper could still go further up the card when he returns in my opinion.
Lee_Smith2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 20:24
FMKK
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 26,167
To me it was almost like watching a ballet in a wrestling ring, it's incredible the moves and the quickness that they did them, but there was no storytelling, or any reason to continue watching the match beyond the first few min I thought.
Not only that, but at no point did it look like they might actually be fighting.
FMKK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 22:13
FMKK
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 26,167
That was so bad I actually forgot!

I know Bray has been pushed a lot with the Wyatt Family but how many times have the actually gone the whole way with them? Never. They always lost the big matches and now it looks like The Wyatts are splitting up due to the draft, it is mad to think they never won the tag team belts.
I'm sure Bray and Dean have already wrestled a dozen times apart from the PPV series. No wonder they brought back the brand split, now they can do it all again!

The Wyatt's got hit hard in their feuds with Cena and Taker. The latter was the worst and so counterproductive. He helps prop up the TV product and live events throughout 2014, only for The Undertaker to no sell the feud and go over cleanly. Yet the company ridicules that sort of thing in WCW documentaries.

With a bit of effort from creative, Luke Harper could still go further up the card when he returns in my opinion.
Pretty certain the feud with Ambrose is the only proper one Bray has actually won. Both are serial feud losers, which is why it's a struggle to see them at the top level. Newer stars in WWE tend to only get pushed to fatten them up for a loss to the main guys.
FMKK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-07-2016, 23:14
dave_windows
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 5,371
I'm sure Bray and Dean have already wrestled a dozen times apart from the PPV series. No wonder they brought back the brand split, now they can do it all again!

The Wyatt's got hit hard in their feuds with Cena and Taker. The latter was the worst and so counterproductive. He helps prop up the TV product and live events throughout 2014, only for The Undertaker to no sell the feud and go over cleanly. Yet the company ridicules that sort of thing in WCW documentaries.

With a bit of effort from creative, Luke Harper could still go further up the card when he returns in my opinion.
I actually enjoyed Bray losing at Wrestlemania and so did a lot of other fans who watched mania. Mind you there wasent a chance Taker was losing after he lost the previous year.

However I put the question to you would it have been better if Taker had beaten Brock and then put Bray over the following year and given him the streak?
dave_windows is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31-07-2016, 00:15
BFGArmy
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 14,316
That was so bad I actually forgot!
Haha

Still better than Brie and Daniel trying to escape Kane
BFGArmy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 31-07-2016, 10:11
batdude_uk1
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 69,147

With a bit of effort from creative, Luke Harper could still go further up the card when he returns in my opinion.
Which card are you thinking of? Raw or Smackdown??

Be interesting where he ends up.
batdude_uk1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 31-07-2016, 10:40
DejaVoodoo
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Earth
Posts: 5,669
Surely, Harper is more likely to end up on Smackdown so he can potentially team up with other Wyatt Family members. Strowman is getting the single monster heel push.
DejaVoodoo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31-07-2016, 12:26
Harris_07
Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: London
Posts: 23,152
From NoDQ.com:

As previously reported, a WWE representative told TMZ that all part-time Superstars are exempt from The Wellness Policy testing. Some of those names include The Rock, The Undertaker, Triple H, and Brock Lesnar.

This apparently didn’t go over two well with several WWE Superstars who are upset about Brock Lesnar continuing to be exempt from the policy when he’s failed two tests with the USADA.

The problem with many is that they feel its making the company look bad, especially after all that has happened with Roman Reigns recently. There is also concern about the double standard of Billy Gunn not being a full-time WWE performer yet being fired for failing a drug test outside the company.
Harris_07 is offline Follow this poster on Twitter   Reply With Quote
Old 31-07-2016, 12:30
BFGArmy
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 14,316
Which card are you thinking of? Raw or Smackdown??

Be interesting where he ends up.
I hope he ends up on Smackdown.

Raw is stacked with superstars and there's a risk of Harper again getting lost in the shuffle whereas on SD there's much less depth so he might get a bit more focus.

That said knowing WWE, he'd probably just be paired as Bray's lackey again but I'd like to see him get a proper singles push.

For me, he's the standout of the Wyatts by a distance - gets his character, acts it so well and great to watch in ring. His ladder match with Ziggler a few years back and of course that Shield/Wyatt war were particular highlights.
BFGArmy is online now   Reply With Quote
 
Reply




 
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 12:34.