Me neither, unless it's S7 where she was a plot device more than a character, but I think once that was out of the way she was really allowed to grow and develop. She was a very flawed character, but unlike another flawed character named after a flower who should have stayed in another dimension, her motivations for acting the way she did were much more clear and made her sympathetic. I actually felt I could relate to her on an emotional level, whereas Rose was more of a case of "she's like us because she likes chips and has a normal job". Clara was no Sarah Jane but I think she earned her place in the Doctor Who universe.

It's only been one episode without her, but I miss her knowing the show's coming back without her. Bill looks great, though, and it's good to see Jenna doing more work beyond DW.

I've seen the first two episodes of Victoria so far and I'm enjoying it.

I can see similarities beteen the relationship between Victoria and Lord Melbourne and the relationship between Clara and the Doctor - the wiser, older man trying to make the impetuous young female do the right thing but being charmed by her feisty personality and twisted round her little finger.

I'm finding the show pretty fascinating as I actually have zero knowledge of Queen Victoria other than that she married Albert, had a very long reign and is known for the phrase "We are not amused".

That and the fact that the Victorian era in general was known for a certain amount of prudishness when it came to exposed skin, such as ankles, for example.

Eve Myles is also in this as one of the staff and there was a nice little bit of Doctor Who irony when they wanted to install gas lighting in the Palace instead of candles. It reminded me of the first Doctor Who episode we saw her in (the Unquiet Dead)!

Because she was 'sassy and feisty' (yawn, and didn't she know it) a control freak, lied to everybody and was generally far too full of herself, made to look far too important and took up too much screen time?
Which was a shame as Victorian Clara was a good character.

And now Jenna is a Victorian Victoria.

Agree with everything here except I also found Victorian Clara unbearable smug. I also found Jenna Coleman very wooden in the acting department - all rapid, breathy delivery, which she is also doing in 'Victoria'.

As an aside, I'm finding 'Victoria' difficult to watch because I studied that period of history - as well as the preceding 100 years of Industrial Revolution - at A Level, and I have to stop myself from screaming whenever things like the Bedchamber Crisis and the Chartist Movement are glossed over, or, in the latter' case, re-written outright. it was actually Melbourne's intervention, not Victoria's, which prevented the Chartist leaders being hanged, drawn and quartered.

Also, the music is extremely annoying. All those constant 'Hallelujahs'? Even Victoria's most ardent admirers would struggle to argue that she was ever the saviour of a nation. Looking forward to seeing how they tackle the Irish Potato Famine, though - a rare example of the queen's desperation to see something done to alleviate the suffering of her subjects.

Jim Broadbent is still my favourite ever Prince Albert. "Demmmm!"

Why an aside? It's the Clara stuff that's off topic on this thread!

I'm absolutely loving this series although it's a little disappointing to hear it's not entirely accurate as the historical stuff is what I'm finding most fascinating.

http://www.radiotimes.com/news/2016-...-itvs-victoria

I hadn't even heard of Melbourne or the Chartists so it's still pretty educational even if some of the detail has been amended somewhat.

God, good point, I'm actually on pretty strong medication at the minute and it's messing with my head. I have the odd lucid moment but most of the time I feel like I'm swimming in oil, if that makes sense.

Melbourne's not considered a big hitter politically; the latter half of Voctoria's reign was dominated by Gladstone and Disraeli...personalities as huge as those tend to overshadow everything else. Most people remember Melbourne for Victoria's infatuation with him, and for his wife running off with Lord Byron!

From what I've heard there's been complaints that Jenna is too good looking for the role and that her image and portrayal is too far removed from what most people perceive of Queen Victoria, which is probably close to the version Pauline Collins portrayed in Tooth and Claw.

Reading what the writer has to say, the whole point of this series is to get away from the image of the older Victoria and inform people more of her younger years for which I for one am more unfamiliar.

Having watching a documentary on her last night, there are a few adjustments to some events as other posters have described but nonetheless she is for me doing a superb job in the role and she does seem to be getting a lot of praise in the media whether you agree it or not.

Agree, I couldn't watch past episode 1 because there was so much that simply wasn't accurate (quite apart from finding Jenna less than inspiring). Why do they do it, the real story was just as dramatic as anything some writer can dream up.


Except there was a major film called Young Victoria covering exactly the same ground just a few years ago which got huge amounts of publicity at the time. It really didn't need to be made again so soon. Writers may get subliminal signals from other people's recent ideas or something, I don't know.

Good point but not everyone has seen that film. I certainly haven't so it's all new to me.

I noticed it was on TV the other week and wondered if the timing was deliberate to upstage the series

Not only have I not the seen the film I don't even remember hearing about the film.

To be honest it was only because Jenna was in it that I even considered watching a historical drama. Usually, if it's not sci-fi or fantasy I'm not interested!

I would say so, it's called jumping on the bandwagon. As soon as a big film is out at the cinema's, you know the TV channels will go all out to show a previous film connected to it or something similar.


I love a bit of true life drama and would have watched this regardless. Having Jenna Coleman in it is an absolute bonus as is Eve Myles and Tommy Knight.

Usually I watch as little as possible on advert obsessed ITV but thankfully skipping them makes watching it a far more enjoyable experience.

Been renewed for a second series.

How far into Victoria's reign they can go without having to age Jenna up is the question.

She's 30 (I think) playing a 19 year old at the moment so she'll be fine for a while. If they plan on doing the whole of Vic's reign though they might need to dig out the makeup Jenna used in Last Christmas.

I think by the time Victoria was 30, she looked much older than Jenna does now, and was probably a bit more portly, due to the 9 kids and all that!

It's the same with Matt Smith in The Crown. That is due to go on for a few series, but Phil was balding from quite an dearly age, whereas Matt at the moment is sporting quite the quiff!!

I'm enjoying it. But I agree. I'd rather have a bit more of the actual events re: the chartists etc. I must have done the same A Level History syllabus! they could easily have cut out all the dull downstairs servants nonsense and put that in.

They must be using the same principle as RTD in Who - you can't just have the stars, you have to have the hangers-on as well whether you want them or not

Timing was deliberate, but upstaging? Wasn't the channel in question ITV3? They'd be upstaging themselves!

I just noticed it was on, not the channel. Maybe they scored an own goal or don't talk to each other much!

I quite fancy seeI g the film. ITV 3 repeat everything so hope it's on again. Apparently it's quite good so probably done to whet the appetite for the series.

Not sure they made much effort to make Jenna look like the 19 year old Victoria other than give her contact lenses to make her brown eyes look blue.

But it does seem like quite a bit of dramatic licence has been taken with Victoria's story. Today's Scottish Sunday Post has a 2-page article on the historical accuracy of the programme comparing the "reel" with the "real" (clever) and it seems inadvisable to use the programme as the basis for an A-level essay on QV. I'm thinking writer Daisy Goodwin may have only got a D in O-level history.

(sings) "Did they make her brown eyes blueee-oo-ee--oooo"?

Louise Jameson in reverse!

Jenna seems like a nice lass so even though historical drama plus royalty is not my thing at all, nice to hear it's been a success and got another run.

Amusing bit of dialogue from Pyramids of Mars given which Victoria Sarah jokes about.

The episodes I've seen have been very enjoyable. The costumes and hairstyles have been of the time so they must have done a lot of researching to get it just right. There's also an interesting rapport between Queen Victoria and Albert, the silly arguments and then the making up after.