Exactly. And man united were completely outplayed in that final as well, so it was pure luck.
At least today, England dominated the game.

We're doing well. We have been involved in the two of the only good matches in this tournament, for different reasons the first relentless attacking and creating chances. Today's match was one of the most tense matches that I have ever seen, something so rare now that the time flew by.

We've played very well in both of them and had two of the best halves of football England must have ever played in tournament football, although partly due to our past achievements being abysmal.

I have seen enough to suggest that we are probably not going to win this and probably by the semis at best, we will have met a side too good for us.

However I have really enjoyed both of the games and all in all have been terrific for much of both games.

If we get to the semis, it will be fantastic.

For one thing because it means the excitement of looking forward to the next game continues until nearly the end...

I agree with everything you have said. We're not great, but I think this England team is playing the best football that England have played in a tournament since Euro 2004. I can't understand people moaning about it. This is a well above average England team. And Group B has a favourable draw, If you win the group you could make the semi-finals quite plausibly.

If you haven't enjoyed the two England games, I am not sure that football is for you. There have been some tedious games in this tournament, the three qualifiers from four teams is not working at all so far, as sides are not having to push themselves and a draw counts for much more than when only the top two go through.

But our games have been compelling and so refreshing to see how much the goals have meant to the squad, although Wales and Northern Ireland have shown that too. That's the one positive from this tournament.

I've enjoyed the positivity from England. The intent, passion and endeavour is all there. For that I can have no complaints. I think Roy is quite naive tactically and defensively we'll be exposed later in the tournament but overall I'm pretty happy. The win was so important today. Just getting the hype of the Wales game out of the way will do us good. Just let the players express themselves against Slovakia and we should win without any real problems.

Its great that England are putting in a performance even though there is added drama. Also after losing a late goal to Russia, the mannor of this result should bring confidence. I won't pretend that i was nuverse especially half time.
Wales need to puck themselves up. They should get a draw with Russia.

I think we should win the next game easy but cant see us getting to the semis, maybe quarter finals. What do others think? who's in agreance with me?

Is scoring three goals in 45 mins a bigger achievement than scoring two goals in a single minute??
Personally taking all of the club rivalry out of it, the latter is more hard to do in a top level match then the former, so for me, whilst both were terrific matches, and both are definitely top two, 99 pips 05 in terms of the greater achievement and comeback.

It wasn't three goals in 45 minutes. It was 3 goals in 6 minutes, and having to survive the rest of the second half and extra time and winning on penalties.

2005 was better. But that wasn't the point Stilton Cheesew was making.

Coming from 3-0 down has to be better than coming from 1-0 down, particularly when the latter has late goals which equals lucky.

99 had the better comeback for me, and was a very open and exciting match to watch (much to my annoyance as it was mostly shots against us!), so that is why I would put that match ahead of 05, but as I say it is very close, and both are clearly top two.

Liverpool had 45 minutes to score 3 goals and force extra time.

Man United had 84 minutes to score 1 goal and force extra time.

Come now.

We had 45 minutes to score 3 goals, did it in 6 minutes and survived all the way to penalties in which we won.

I guess it all depends on ones point of view!

But by your own admission scoring in injury time is mostly down to luck - your words, so you can't possibly think that the Man Utd comeback was better if its just lucky? It makes no sense to hold both opinions.

It doesn't really matter both were very special in their own different ways. I just dont understand how Batdude can dismiss scoring in injury time as "lucky" whilst at the same time putting Man Utd's comeback above Liverpools!!!

We were lucky to get the goals when we did, I have not said otherwise have I?

However coming back from that deficit however lucky it was, doesn't change the fact that it did happen, and thus it was a great comeback.


Where did I dismiss anything??

How on earth can something thats as lucky as you believe it to be be seen as better than what Liverpool did over the period of 45 mins, extra time and penalties? It makes no sense.



When you were at pains to point out that England beating wales was lucky. Of course that may have had more to do with your 4 days of suggesting that England would struggle to beat them.

One thing doesn't automatically rule out the other.
I was talking about the game as a whole, there were plenty of Bayern chance, they should really have scored a fair few against us that night, but for whatever reason, they only got the one goal.
Then we somehow got the two goals, and it was a very fortunate (but very welcome from my own personal perspective), and was a comeback almost out of nowhere, and was a very good comeback.

As for the England and Wales match, the comeback was very good, but it was very different to the 99 match in so much as at least England were on top, and one might say that the goal was coming, but it was very late in doing so.

My comments have nothing to do with me thinking before the match that it was going to be a very tough match, just being honest about the situation as I see it.

On Saturday when England conceded a goal in injury time you were saying nothing mattered but getting the win and you were lambasting England for failing to do so. However when they did the exact same thing get the win on Thursday you were saying that it was lucky.

Again though I know the United comeback was brilliant however its you that is putting it above Liverpools despite you thinking its "lucky". Presumably Liverpools comeback couldn't be dismissed as lucky given the nature of how it happened so it seems weird that you put the United one above it. I was initially surprised to see you talk about goals in injury time the way you did given that you are a Man Utd fan and their achievement in 99.

I have been very complimentary towards both finals, and one could put forward a case for either being the best comeback as both were very dramatic finals for very different reasons.

The comeback by England was totally different to either of the finals we are talking about here as England were after they got the equalising goal, dominant in terms of having the ball and being on the front foot looking to make things happen.

I don't really know how much more I can say without repeating myself on this topic, so I will just say that England got lucky with their goal in injury time, but they made their own luck so to speak, as they were the dominant side.

It doesn't really matter, the comment was days old anyway.

If you make the luck it stops being luck. It's just something that happened.

It's like being on a thread with The Dalai Lama.