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Brexit - Roaming After We Leave |
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#51 |
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 14,546
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I'm with Devon and others, we tried to get the changes to the EU to make it more democratic and reform and we couldn't time after time. We were increasingly seeing things being decided outside of any democratic system.
The EU single market has been declining, down 5% to 17% recently, the unemployment across Europe (much worse than the EU) and massive Euro crisis and bailouts, the migrant crisis and many other things can in part be blamed on the EU. Those saying "we'll lose X billion in university and science funding" have forgotten that tax payers in Greece and Spain don't pay their taxes for it to fund our universities, it's our money we pay to the EU that we get back in funding. Skip the EU all together and we can directly fund these things, especially as we got back less than we paid into the EU. I fully welcome the situation, FTSE is at June 13th level and the currency markets will recover in the longer term, but we are in for a few years of pain, that is for longer term gain outside of the EU. When younger people throughout Europe start rising up at an ever increasing anti-democratic system, especially in the next recession, we'll be looking and thinking - I'm glad we voted out. |
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#52 |
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: a land filled with trolls
Posts: 12,014
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Quote:
Plenty of left wingers voted for Brexit. But don't let your skewed view affect what you write.
I even checked some of the public profiles of these people to see the Britain First posts, anti-Muslim posts and so on. It does confuse me how Labour voters can show such right-wing views when it comes to immigration but it seems that concerns about immigration don't follow normal rules. |
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#53 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 720
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Quote:
It's quite likely that more left wingers voted leave than right wingers actually. Including Corbyn. I'd have loved to have been a fly on the wall in that polling booth. : )
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#54 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Midlands
Posts: 2,860
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The honest answer is no one knows.
Just looking at this from the other angle. Some would welcome it as it could mean prices fall domestically. It's long been suspected that "free" roaming has been paid for by price hikes in contracts, as the networks need to get the profits somehow. However like I say, that is just looking at it from another angle |
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#55 |
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Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: East Midlands
Posts: 3,840
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Lets get some perspective here, irrespective ofhow people voted, and their opinions, the UK is still a member of the European union, and as such nothing has changed for the moment.
The formal leaving process has not even begun yet, and as the Prime minister has said, he does not intend to start this, or it will not be started until a new prime minister is in place, and Article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty is signed/triggered then the formal separation process will begin, and even once that happens it will not be overnight, it could take at least two years, possibly even Three years, or longer. In the meantime the Eu is set to scrap roaming charges soemtime around the second half of 2017, thats next year according to this http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technolog...s-by-2017.html And even after we have left, then its highly likely that we will be in the EFTA/Council of Europe area where such things as roaming rates will be legislated for as per the main inner EU. |
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#56 |
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Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Midlands
Posts: 2,860
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I think what you are seeing is the left being left behind in a world where sadly money talks. It's also become more about champagne socialism and forgetting its core members. You now have other parties like UKIP (let's not get into this debate) who are / have filled the void and speaks the language of the traditional Labour core voter.
On the roaming front you could argue that leaving would be good for the general consumer. The "free" roaming has been paid for from hikes in prices and reducions in tariffs, it has long been suspected. So maybe we will see increased offers and cheaper prices for most, whilst those who use the phone for 14 days a year max on holiday, just pay a bit more at these times. |
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#57 |
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Hertfordshire
Posts: 2,937
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...and even once that happens it will not be overnight, it could take at least two years, possibly even Three years, or longer.
It would require the consent of all 27 remaining EU states for the UK to remain in the EU for longer than 2 years, and somehow I don't see that happening. |
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#58 |
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 105
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I am not sure you can define left and right in this. In my town, the local Labour group went with leave and most residents who have been the most vocal in the council elections also went with leave, but many of them (not all, but too many) have been praising how we're going to get rid of the Poles and Romanians working here.
I even checked some of the public profiles of these people to see the Britain First posts, anti-Muslim posts and so on. It does confuse me how Labour voters can show such right-wing views when it comes to immigration but it seems that concerns about immigration don't follow normal rules. The working class are far more affected by uncontrolled mass immigration. They have to compete for jobs, school places, nhs waiting times....etc
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#59 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 14,546
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It does seem unfair for some employers to deliberately look to bring cheap labour in, rather than hire here. In some cases that can be labourers who come here to earn money, stay in very cheap accommodation and then go back to Europe where that wage means considerably more in a poorer country.
Meanwhile somebody here who could do the job just can't compete and have any kind of living standard. We have also suffered real crowding in areas on the roads, the trains, the schools and generally struggled in certain areas of the country due to the masses of people choosing to come and work in the UK for economic reasons, 300,000 net additional people each year, or enough to fill a city the the size of Bristol every 3 years, that isn't really sustainable. We have had mass uncontrolled immegration due to the success of the U.K.and many from Europe wanting to come and live and work here. For me it's not even about immegration through, it's about political control and accountability and the fact that despite trying to get reform from within the EU we've not managed to make it more politically accountable and democratic. I think we're better off out of the EU and focusing on trading globally, now able to reach trade agreements with anyone we wish (previously we couldn't, we were locked into the EU). I say lets get Boris in, he did a good job of promoting London on the international stage, he attracted a huge amount of investment into the city, get him out selling the UK globally without the restrictions and red tape of the EU. Now we can buy and sell from who we like, we can make our own rules that suit us, we can fund what we want, not what the EU thinks is best for us. We've got a golden opportunity ahead of us, if we choose to take it. Our best days are yet to come, vote Boris in November and you won't regret it! |
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#60 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Sandy Heath, Beds. UK
Posts: 10,379
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Quote:
It does seem unfair for some employers to deliberately look to bring cheap labour in, rather than hire here. In some cases that can be labourers who come here to earn money, stay in very cheap accommodation and then go back to Europe where that wage means considerably more in a poorer country.
Meanwhile somebody here who could do the job just can't compete and have any kind of living standard. We have also suffered real crowding in areas on the roads, the trains, the schools and generally struggled in certain areas of the country due to the masses of people choosing to come and work in the UK for economic reasons, 300,000 net additional people each year, or enough to fill a city the the size of Bristol every 3 years, that isn't really sustainable. We have had mass uncontrolled immegration due to the success of the U.K.and many from Europe wanting to come and live and work here. For me it's not even about immegration through, it's about political control and accountability and the fact that despite trying to get reform from within the EU we've not managed to make it more politically accountable and democratic. I think we're better off out of the EU and focusing on trading globally, now able to reach trade agreements with anyone we wish (previously we couldn't, we were locked into the EU). I say lets get Boris in, he did a good job of promoting London on the international stage, he attracted a huge amount of investment into the city, get him out selling the UK globally without the restrictions and red tape of the EU. Now we can buy and sell from who we like, we can make our own rules that suit us, we can fund what we want, not what the EU thinks is best for us. We've got a golden opportunity ahead of us, if we choose to take it. Our best days are yet to come, vote Boris in November and you won't regret it! If you want to talk politics there is a forum for that. |
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#61 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 105
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Quote:
It does seem unfair for some employers to deliberately look to bring cheap labour in, rather than hire here. In some cases that can be labourers who come here to earn money, stay in very cheap accommodation and then go back to Europe where that wage means considerably more in a poorer country.
Meanwhile somebody here who could do the job just can't compete and have any kind of living standard. We have also suffered real crowding in areas on the roads, the trains, the schools and generally struggled in certain areas of the country due to the masses of people choosing to come and work in the UK for economic reasons, 300,000 net additional people each year, or enough to fill a city the the size of Bristol every 3 years, that isn't really sustainable. We have had mass uncontrolled immegration due to the success of the U.K.and many from Europe wanting to come and live and work here. For me it's not even about immegration through, it's about political control and accountability and the fact that despite trying to get reform from within the EU we've not managed to make it more politically accountable and democratic. I think we're better off out of the EU and focusing on trading globally, now able to reach trade agreements with anyone we wish (previously we couldn't, we were locked into the EU). I say lets get Boris in, he did a good job of promoting London on the international stage, he attracted a huge amount of investment into the city, get him out selling the UK globally without the restrictions and red tape of the EU. Now we can buy and sell from who we like, we can make our own rules that suit us, we can fund what we want, not what the EU thinks is best for us. We've got a golden opportunity ahead of us, if we choose to take it. Our best days are yet to come, vote Boris in November and you won't regret it! |
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#62 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,377
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Exactly, if we could actually elect the EU commission, id not have such an issue. I find the fact we can only elect MEP's who have no power to introduce legislation and have less power than the house of lords ridiculous and an affront to democracy.
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#63 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Sandy Heath, Beds. UK
Posts: 10,379
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Exactly, if we could actually elect the EU commission, id not have such an issue. I find the fact we can only elect MEP's who have no power to introduce legislation and have less power than the house of lords ridiculous and an affront to democracy.
And this is still off topic. |
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#64 |
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Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,377
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I know enough about the fact that where I grew up receives an awful lot of money from the EU and know that the money is very unlikely to be replaced by money from Westminster. I also know that some of my friends have jobs that rely on us being the EU. While they still may be safe if we do end up in the EEA, they still have the stress of not knowing if their job is currently safe or not at this moment in time. And I also know that even if we do end up in the EEA and everything is fine and dandy, we will then be subject to EU rules and regulations that we no longer will have a say in (at least in the EU we do have some kind of say) and will have to agree to at least some degree of freedom of movement (which will obviously mean a sizable chunk of the leave voters will not be happy). So please, less of the attack on us youngsters..
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#65 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 105
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You can't elect the UK government, or the cabinet. You can only elect your local MP.
And this is still off topic. |
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#66 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 8,099
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How old are you? its NATO that has kept the peace. giving credit to the EU is ridiculous.
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#67 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 875
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Quote:
The honest answer is no one knows.
Just looking at this from the other angle. Some would welcome it as it could mean prices fall domestically. It's long been suspected that "free" roaming has been paid for by price hikes in contracts, as the networks need to get the profits somehow. However like I say, that is just looking at it from another angle |
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#68 |
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Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 8,099
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Out of interest, how old where you when Mrs T came into power?
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#69 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 8,099
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no you know who will be prime minister and you know who you are electing. its totally different. The average wage in switzerland is £125.000 american dollars, wow how ever do they cope outside the EU.
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#70 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 8,099
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Quote:
I think what you are seeing is the left being left behind in a world where sadly money talks. It's also become more about champagne socialism and forgetting its core members. You now have other parties like UKIP (let's not get into this debate) who are / have filled the void and speaks the language of the traditional Labour core voter.
. Still they say you can't argue with stupid. |
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#71 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 8,099
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Quote:
I
When younger people throughout Europe start rising up at an ever increasing anti-democratic system, especially in the next recession, we'll be looking and thinking - I'm glad we voted out. |
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#72 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 720
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Isn't it obvious
The working class are far more affected by uncontrolled mass immigration. They have to compete for jobs, school places, nhs waiting times....etcQuote:
no you know who will be prime minister and you know who you are electing. its totally different
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#73 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: a land filled with trolls
Posts: 12,014
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Quote:
I would argue that we will still have some say in the initial draughting of regulation, as Norway do. Let's not forget that the UK has constantly been voted down on just about everything as a full member. Agree a lot of leave voters will not get what they wanted. As for young folk, sorry if I came across as negative but I've been getting an awful lot of 'you old gits have destroyed the UK you are going to die in 2 years and we are going to have to deal with it.' Some even suggesting an upper age on this vote. Anyone of voting age has the right to cast their vote and should be respected for their opinion, young or old.
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#74 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Portsmouth
Posts: 787
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It's quite likely that more left wingers voted leave than right wingers actually. Including Corbyn. I'd have loved to have been a fly on the wall in that polling booth. : )
Stop blindly believing the press and actually research it. |
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#75 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Cheshire/Shropshire Border
Posts: 590
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I'M A VEGAN!!!.*
*Not really, just pretending to be a youngster... **Am I the only person over the age of 40 who was for remain?
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The working class are far more affected by uncontrolled mass immigration. They have to compete for jobs, school places, nhs waiting times....etc