Yeah, that's my thinking too. Although, I don't think all households with people under the age of 10 would be watching Frozen, it might make up the majority but not all I don't think. Brave managed a rating of 5.5m last year, and that wasn't as huge as Frozen was. Frozen was huge at the time, and continued to be for another year or two - more so than most of the Christmas Day premieres.

It's a difficult one to call. One thing I will say is I think they'll be relatively close in the ratings.

I can see why you might think that, but traditionally Sunday if anything seems to hinder viewing figures on the big day.

In 2005 for example, the top 3 (consolidated) looked like this:

EastEnders - 10.6m
Doctor Who - 9.8m
Two Ronnies - 7.9m

Compared to 2004 when it fell on a Saturday:

EastEnders - 12.8m
Vicar of Dibley - 12.5m
Harry Potter - 8.4m

And 2006 when it fell on a Monday:

Vicar of Dibley - 12.4m
EastEnders (9pm) - 11.6m
EastEnders (6:30pm) - 9.4m

Then more recently when the 25th fell on a Sunday in 2011, EastEnders (-1.3m) and Doctor Who (-1.3m) were down markedly on the year before. So I wouldn't be at all surprised if this year confirms that the dreaded numbers of last year were no fluke and continues the downward trend.

Also, had anyone else forgotten Harry Potter had started life on BBC One? Because I certainly had. Good luck Frozen beating that figure!

Hassaan comes back and the thread rattles through the pages! I tell you this thread was a wasteland between the end of Britain's Got Talent and the start of GBBO

It's hardly down bucket loads - only 340k yoy and a few episodes last week were up.

Is there any change to EE's ratings in February 2016 when BBC3 TV closed? Did those 300k viewers switch to BBC 1?

My kids won't see any TV after about midday and I'm sure many other families will be similar. If we weren't out and about, I would stick Frozen on for them though I'd be tempted to try out the TV premiere of Jungle Book on Xmas Day.

All good points. I notice the total audience being up in 2011, vs the previous year. All Star Family Fortunes did manage 6m up against Strictly that year which it might not have done any other year.

It would be nice to be able to see some improvement but it might be a big ask with this year's line up. I suppose if Frozen & Bake Off do really well in the early evening and boost the rest of the line up then that's something.

I think we might have another year where the biggest rating of the Christmas period isn't on Christmas Day (fireworks aside).

No they didn't.

It was indeed on a Wednesday that year, though the high rating is not too much of a surprise because in that era the test card would have got ten million viewers on Wednesday at eight on ITV, straight after Corrie and opposite BBC1's weakest night of the week by miles.


Yes, and a bit of a shame, this, because this must be the first time that ITV haven't had a double headed news programme since, presumably, the launch of the original News at Ten in 1967. And I like double headed news presentation, you get a bit of variety during the programme and it seems a friendlier format, which is why it seems perfect for that slot. I know these days we all have to look at the cost of everything and the value of nothing but it doesn't necessarily mean that double headed presentation is double the cost, you can make savings elsewhere. So quite big and sad news, I think.


Indeed, they were very similar to the BBC Music Awards for the two years they ran in 2001 and 2002. It was basically an attempt to create a British version of the MTV Europe Awards, but they were all a bit unconvincing. They didn't have much credibility, most obviously when they gave Jennifer Lopez a made-up award in the first one clearly just for turning up. They were quite boring as well.


I think Frozen and The Lion King are going to be miles apart. There's an argument everyone's seen Frozen but everyone's definitely seen The Lion King in the cinema, on VHS, on the stage and of course on its previous TV appearance when nobody seemed that bothered about it. And also, it's on BBC1 on Christmas Day, the one day of the year when you can justifiably suggest BBC1 had a bit of a default audience (earned, of course, over many years).


Indeed, the last time BBC1 had a film in the evening of Christmas Day. I never liked it when they did that, though, it seemed a waste because primetime Christmas Day should be the showcase for new, British programming. They showed the first Potter film again on Christmas Eve 2005, then that was it for Potter on the Beeb.

I wouldn't suggest Christmas on a Sunday has anything to do with the ratings, it's Christmas Day. They don't go down because everyone's in church or up because nobody's in the shops. You can't extrapolate much from previous years, it depends on the schedules. Christmas Day 2005 was especially weak, Doctor Who aside the big attractions were The Green Green Grass, My Family and The Two Ronnies, it was a pretty poor line-up. Indeed, that was probably the last year before BBC1 reinvented itself around Strictly, Who and a big comedy special which is the pattern that it's more or less kept to for every Christmas Day since.

As for 2011, again it depends on the quality of the shows themselves. Who was a bit less of a draw because the year before it had been Matt Smith's first Christmas show. Also Christmas 2010 was of course absolutely bloody freezing and there was snow everywhere.

Christmas has only been on a Sunday four times in 22 years, so it's hard to pick up patterns from that. Besides, it was on a Sunday in 1977 and that was the greatest Christmas Day in the history of British broadcasting. It doesn't matter what day Christmas Day is, nobody remembers what day it is. Christmas Day is Christmas Day.

Shouldn't we be on a new thread by now? 700 pages.

Yeah normally it turns over at about 450-600 pages.

Makes you wonder where these people went. I assumed they'd hit the EE consolidated number at least, if not the overnight.

A big big welcome back. You were missed. Now, if the mods could give SamuelW another chance,it will feel like our original family is back!

I really don't see the point of the BBC Music Awards. If they must do it, then I'd prefer it i they shoved it on at 9.30pm on the first September Saturday night when there's no MotD.

Although the 'big comedy special' element has been relegated a tad in recent years, now being just Mrs Brown at 10:30pm rather than a big special, often a remake, at 9pm.

I agree that what day Christmas Day falls on makes no difference at all, Christmas Day is like a big Sunday every year!

And it falls nicely because New Year's Day is definitely like a Sunday, but big in the more negative way, the ultimate Sunday night back to work feeling (although we do have the BH on Monday)

I also agree it's a shame the ITV Evening News won't be double headed anymore, hopefully it will return when they get a new editor, but then they'd have to justify the cost which is harder than justifying a saving. The double headed bulletin has moved from bulletin to bulletin on ITV it was at lunchtimes until they brought back News at Ten the first time round. The BBC News at Six was double headed until quite recently, maybe ten years ago.

He's on Michael McIntyre's Big Show on Saturday as well.

Good to see the forum thriving again. As for Samuel, the 'Itv Ratings Crisis' thread over in Broadcasting still gives me nightmares .

Imagine if ADP and SamuelW had both been around during the last few months of TXF discussions....

Give me a flavour?!


Was he Pro ITV then?

It was just a little piece in Radio Times magazine a year or so ago. It had the average age of a BBC One viewer somewhere in their fifties, and the average age of a (main channel) ITV viewer just one year below that.

No doubt BBC Two would push the BBC age up, and ITV2 would push the ITV group age down, but there was little between the two main channels.

Probably only sixteen weeks of "telebox programme X Factors" making the difference.

God no. If you can, search for the ITV Weekly Reach Crisis thread he created. Interesting stuff...

I know people "miss" him but there is only so much ITV bashing people can take before things get really heated. I was looking in the thread archives from December 2013 and it gave me a headache reading all the arguments.

I think BBC1 will win the film clash by a mile. Frozen is a big film, its on BBC1 Christmas Day and its ad free. From this forum, I've noticed many have stated they never watch commercial channels on Christmas Day.

But The Lion King should be more of a pull for older viewers than if ITV were showing another modern animation. We might find, it will split the audience. BBC1 has the family audience, while ITV has the older viewers. Perhaps this should be a future ITV stategy. While BBC1 show the modern animations, ITV should acquire the classic Disney films. I would love to see Snow White and the Seven Dwarves on Christmas Day.

But he last thing ITV should do is let it go past without promotion. They've good three great Disny animations they haven't shown before (Sleeping Beauty, 101 Damations and TLK), so it would be worth promoting these. Otherwise they won't stand a chance. I bet BBC1 are promoting their films.

Ah that's a shame, I'd like to have seen some detail. Nevermind, thanks.
BBC2 matches BBC1 with both averaging [probably now] 61. Emmerdale and Corrie both skew old, are on a lot and get big ratings so they'll bumping numbers.

That's assuming the RT was right in what it said. I agree with you that ITV2 and Be will have taken younger viewers away but then ITV3 must average pretty old. I'd love to see the numbers. Far more interesting data analysis than I used to get paid for.

There is of course nothing wrong with having shows that attract older audiences, ITV need a few more and maybe BBC1 need a few less.

I notice on ITV Press Centre, they have Ninja Warrior UK down from 7pm on Saturday 7th Janaury.

That will mean it will got head to head with Let It Shine. I think that means TVUK will be on Saturday, and Dance on Sunday.

And with it being their most popular and highest profile bulletin, the extra presenter is a good safety valve in the event of the other having a coughing fit or a sudden requirement to visit the bathroom!*

The BBC News at Six will at least have a News Channel presenter standing by, but ITV would be reliant on the Late News presenter being nearby and not having popped out for a snack.

(*or sitting on studio-invading lesbians.)

Welcome back Hassaan. You've been missed.

Thanks for all the ratings carried across to this thread. Much appreciated.