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The Tennis Thread (Part 31)
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Jenny1986
07-10-2016
Some horrible errors from Rafa today. Just basic stuff not working.
dduk
07-10-2016
I think if Jo Konta wins the China Open she would go up to 6 in the race for Singapore. http://live-tennis.eu/en/wta-race
Mike Teevee
07-10-2016
Originally Posted by tennisman:
“Mike, I couldn't remember when Henman's dramatic rise took place specifically and looking at this page (see link below), it was when he was around Kyle's age now (21) that he won a Challenger in Korea and reached the q/f at Wimbledon.

From then on, he rose into the Top 20 and the Top 10 and stayed there for pretty much the next 10 years before a gradual decline (influenced by a number of injuries).

Ultimately, every player is different and I just don't talk about players' potential anymore or say that they haven't reached their potential, as how do we know where that potential would have taken the player?

I've yet to see any predictive model that can forecast where a player might end up.

So I don't know about Kyle's or anyone else's potential. The only thing I look at is the reality of their results and as long as they are working hard and doing the right things, that's all they can do.

The media and fans love to look forward and make speculative estimates on what will happen. It's all fun and that's fine but its sport soothsaying to me.

In fact, before that Seoul Challenger win, if I remember it right (I was 2-3 years into my job as a coach then and remember Henman wandering around our club (it was the one he did all his training at whilst at Reeds School in Cobham), Henman was regarded as really just another British player but not necessarily anything special.

But maybe to prove the point about pre-judging players and their 'potential', all in a rush, he escalated his performance and once up there, stayed there for a long time, despite all the perjorative and frankly ill informed views of him and his niceness etc..

He had a fine game but no big weapons and that hurt him when playing the very top guys. people forget that he was the #4 in the World and a top ten player for many years. And if that's being a failure, I wish I was one too.


Good luck to Kyle.

http://www.eurosport.com/tennis/time...08/story.shtml”

Here, here
BigBmad
07-10-2016
Originally Posted by dduk:
“I think if Jo Konta wins the China Open she would go up to 6 in the race for Singapore. http://live-tennis.eu/en/wta-race”

Yeah she would be near enough gaurenteed a place in Singapore if she won
tartan-belle
07-10-2016
Tennisman and Mike Teevee - I third the Tim Henman comments.

Dimi has really come back this second part of the year. Shame Rafa lost though
Mike Teevee
07-10-2016
Originally Posted by tartan-belle:
“Tennisman and Mike Teevee - I third the Tim Henman comments.

Dimi has really come back this second part of the year. Shame Rafa lost though ”

Okay I completely misread some tweets I saw earlier, though Rafa won in straight sets.

At least he's fresh for Shanghai.
Jenny1986
07-10-2016
I agree with Rafa's assessment of that match 'disaster'. He said he lost confidence in his forehand and had the breaks of serve stuck in his head. He looked near ready to give up, well as near to it as he can get anyway. He's really disappointed in himself He said the only positive thing he is taking from Beijing is 90 points. I don't like mopey Rafa, its weird.
dduk
07-10-2016
We could have a double header of a brit male and brit female winning the same tournament on the same day. Never thought I'd ever be able to say that.
Jewels501
07-10-2016
Originally Posted by MissAyrshire:
“Yes Jewels, Tomas is being coached by Goran now”

Thanks.

Originally Posted by Mike Teevee:
“Jewels501 - I take fangirl (or fanboy) to mean that a person is dedicated hardcore fan of said person. Not necessarily to do with looks. more to do with the fact that there's support that will stick up them no matter what.”

Originally Posted by Ginger Daddy:
“Correct. And for some reason I get the impression most of the regular contributors to this thread are female rather than male!!

Murray on the verge of dropping the first set against Edmund on a tie break.

EDIT - then again maybe not, its back to 5-5”

Thanks for the clarification of your comment Ginger Daddy. I think I was aware that the term is often used in dismissive terms (especially on MTF....but let's not go there!) to suggest an obsessive fan who really doesn't know anything the game but is fuelled by something such as looks.

I accept that this wasn't what was meant. I must be getting sensitive in my old age! Although with the boy Rafa, the term might be more apt for me......

It is interesting that this thread does seem to be dominated by females at the moment. It hasn't always been thus I don't think. When I first started posting, I think it was pretty 50/50.
*Sparkle*
07-10-2016
As far as I can tell, everything is used as a term of abuse on MTF.

I think fanboy/girl is open to interpretation, and it's all in the context. I'd say it can go from someone who is a fairly dedicated fan, some of whom will get the t-shirt, right through to the sort of fan who takes things far too seriously. I'd be more tempted to presume the former unless there was some context to suggest otherwise.

I had to follow on LiveScores, but a great day for Jo, predictably good for Andy, and very promising for Kyle. I hope he feels good about his performance. There was obviously a lot he did right today.
Cherry-choc
07-10-2016
Originally Posted by Jewels501:
“3. Talking of favourites, happy to see the boy Rafa in Beijing. Today, he made unnecessary hard work of the 2nd set against Mannarino but still, I thought he played well yesterday in particular. I really need him to have good couple of weeks so I can decide about the WTF - I feel it is a rip-off in terms of prices but still.....”

I'd have thought that Rafa fans would avoid the WTF like the plague? Rafa's a poor indoor player and the crowds are always rather...Helvetian.

Quote:
“4. I also wanna know about the alleged match fixing at Wimbledon - bet it involved two or more players I have never heard of.”

Could be. Without a big name player in the match they were probably hoping it'd be on the down-low. I'd be looking for a match where a player lost the first set heavily and went a break down in the second, before magically coming back to win. That is when the odds are juiciest.

Quote:
“5. Thiem - why?”

It may well be his coach Bresnik who is behind it. Either way, he/they need to wise up.

Quote:
“7. Kei, talk about China In Your Hands (80s music reference for you young ones...).”

Don't push too far.

Y'know, that song was #1 when I was born. I'm on the young side but I still listen to a fair bit of 80s stuff.

Originally Posted by Ginger Daddy:
“Correct. And for some reason I get the impression most of the regular contributors to this thread are female rather than male!!”

Yes. Pretty obvious with the focus on outfits and the half naked shots of male players popping up with regularity. I make up for it though by perving over the laydeez. Fair's fair.

Originally Posted by tartan-belle:
“It's funny when you think of all the excitement/disbelief earlier on in the year at Queens when the press were all "OMG, Andy is going to play another British player which is the first time since 19 dickety" and here we are the tail end of the year with Andy playing another Brit - again! It speaks well of Kyle this year, as well as Dan and to a lesser extent, the other British players.”

I'd still rather it didn't happen too often though. On one hand, he doesn't want to impede his brother/countrymen, but on the other he's a fierce competitor who hates losing. Internally conflicted.

Originally Posted by tartan-belle:
“I wonder if Goran is single-handedly trying to make us like his players - first Cilic and now Tomas!! (Boredych works for both players...)”

At least Tomas has eye candy with Ester in the box. Cilic is monotone, monobrow...you'd have to pay me to watch him.

Originally Posted by Ginger Daddy:
“Far too late for Shanghai, cutoff was weeks ago and Edmund is scheduled to be in the qualifiers (he is seeded 3rd, win two matches and you are in the main draw)

Paris is only a draw or 48 and Edmund is ranked 48th as it stands. Once you take into account qualifying then only the top 42 get in by right and then you have the wildcards which takes it down even more again. And I think the cutoff for it is this weekend. So he will have to qualify for it.”

Pretty accurate. Paris Bercy is a very compact Masters to say the least. They probably don't have enough courts to justify a larger draw.

Originally Posted by Lisa.B:
“Virtual double bagel, that'll do nicely, especially when Keys had to slug it out in a 3-set war with Petra.”

It's certainly handy. Keys's match with Petra went 2½ hours and was mentally and physically draining.

Originally Posted by Mike Teevee:
“Some fightback by Konta!”

I turned over at 0-4. Jo shut me up in style...

Originally Posted by tartan-belle:
“Tennisman and Mike Teevee - I third the Tim Henman comments.

Dimi has really come back this second part of the year. Shame Rafa lost though ”

Dimi is slowly figuring it out. He still has major flaws in his game (topspin BH, ROS), but he can conceal them better with an aggressive mindset and playing most of his shots at/inside the baseline. Grinding 3-4m behind the baseline is a poor strategy for most OHBHs. The ones that make it work either regularly generate huge power (Stan, Thiem) or have bucketloads of spin/angle (Gasquet, CSN). Gas can also flatten out his BH DTL when need be.

Originally Posted by *Sparkle*:
“As far as I can tell, everything is used as a term of abuse on MTF. ”

At least it's not the t word with four letters. Dunno if you could even use it on DS without censure.

I've said before, but MTF/TF are like ghost towns atm. Even during big tournaments.
dduk
07-10-2016
Does anyone know if the Hong Kong Open is televised next week? Jo Konta is competing in that tournament. I know Linz is on Eurosport, which Suarez Navarro is competing in (and she's competing in the Kremlin cup in Moscow too), so I will be keeping an eye on that closely. Kuznetsova is in Tianjin next week and Cibulkova is in Moscow the following week, but Jo is not playing the following week. Garbine is not competing in any more tournaments until Singapore, so she needs to hope she can hang on to her spot. It looks like Madison Keys also has no more tournaments until Singapore.
BigBmad
07-10-2016
Originally Posted by dduk:
“Does anyone know if the Hong Kong Open is televised next week? Jo Konta is competing in that tournament. I know Linz is on Eurosport, which Suarez Navarro is competing in (and she's competing in the Kremlin cup in Moscow too), so I will be keeping an eye on that closely. Kuznetsova is in Tianjin next week and Cibulkova is in Moscow the following week, but Jo is not playing the following week. Garbine is not competing in any more tournaments until Singapore, so she needs to hope she can hang on to her spot. It looks like Madison Keys also has no more tournaments until Singapore.”

Hopefully Jo brings her A game and manages to win this tournament. That will put her 10 points from the qualification cut off line, realisically will mean she will be qualified
dduk
07-10-2016
Originally Posted by BigBmad:
“Hopefully Jo brings her A game and manages to win this tournament. That will put her 10 points from the qualification cut off line, realisically will mean she will be qualified”

Would that mean she would only need to get to Round 2 in Hong Kong to get past the qualification cut off line?

I do fear that if she gets to the final and meets Aga, then that would be a tough contest for her to win.
Lisa.B
07-10-2016
Originally Posted by dduk:
“Does anyone know if the Hong Kong Open is televised next week? Jo Konta is competing in that tournament. I know Linz is on Eurosport, which Suarez Navarro is competing in (and she's competing in the Kremlin cup in Moscow too), so I will be keeping an eye on that closely. Kuznetsova is in Tianjin next week and Cibulkova is in Moscow the following week, but Jo is not playing the following week. Garbine is not competing in any more tournaments until Singapore, so she needs to hope she can hang on to her spot. It looks like Madison Keys also has no more tournaments until Singapore.”

Garbine is in as the WTA would use their clause to make her the 8th qualifier as a slam winner. In the past few hours it's all change for Linz. Pliskova has withdrawn, Garbine is in, and Keys and Cibulkova have taken WCs.
dduk
07-10-2016
Originally Posted by Lisa.B:
“Garbine is in as the WTA would use their clause to make her the 8th qualifier as a slam winner. In the past few hours it's all change for Linz. Pliskova has withdrawn, Garbine is in, and Keys and Cibulkova have taken WCs.”

Thanks, I didn't know about the update for Linz. I was just going by the info on here http://live-tennis.eu/en/wta-schedule
BigBmad
08-10-2016
Originally Posted by dduk:
“Would that mean she would only need to get to Round 2 in Hong Kong to get past the qualification cut off line?

I do fear that if she gets to the final and meets Aga, then that would be a tough contest for her to win.”

Yeah thats right, but with only 10 points away from the cut off line it would also mean cibukova and keys more then likely would need to win their remaining tournaments.

Its going to be so tough against Keys, she maybe tired from match with Kvitova though
Irishguy123
08-10-2016
Not really sure why that nonsense was posted about Delpo getting the wildcards. He's hugely popular, and he's getting the wildcards because he's a former slam champion and would probably have won a few more if he hadn't been so injured. That's it, end of discussion.


Originally Posted by Jenny1986:
“Possibly, but I think we should all remember that we all agree she was wrong and deserved punishment. Its the severity of the punishment and the seriousness of her misconduct that we all differ on.”

Oh absolutely, I agree.

Originally Posted by Aftershow:
“The Twitter post from Head about the reduction in her ban must be one of the most cringeworthy pieces of marketing I've ever seen.”

Yeah, even as a Sharapova fan I rolled my eyes multiple times reading it.

Originally Posted by Jewels501:
“Just a few random thoughts:
2. I guess with Maria, if you're a fan, some of her comments (eg re the carpet at the hotel where she announced the drug issue and her comment on travelling to places like Wuhan, can be taken as sass and confidence. I'm not a fan, so I take it as disrespect but hey, we all have our favourites.

7. Kei, talk about China In Your Hands (80s music reference for you young ones...).”

Oh I completely agree about the Wuhan comments, rude and arrogant. I still laughed though I just think it's hilarious that she's come back all guns blazing as if this year hasn't happened. Like, it hasn't humbled her at all.

And no need to explain the T'Pau reference, I'm sure a lot of us young ones like 80's music too


Anyway, happy to see Kvitova won't make it to Singapore, wouldn't deserve it based on this terrible season. Not too surprised to see Kerber lose today either, she must be running on empty at this stage. She must be getting a big appearance fee from Hong Kong cause I can't see any logic to her playing it next week.
seansnotmyname@
08-10-2016
What annoys me about the entire Maria-farce, is now people saying she's gotten away with it, she got 15 months, Cilic got 4 months for taken a banned substance. Beezus, Gasquet et cetera all got much more lenient sentences, people saying other sentences don't matter, just is pretty ridiculous, no-one lives in a vacuum.

She's not been accused of being a cheat by either ITF or CAS, so no reason why BJK Martina and Chris Evert shouldn't back her, like they have.

Heads comment was hilariously stupid, but Eliasch clearly wants Maria to leave Nike for him once her contract is up. Would kick-start their line of dresses and whatnot massively.

Oh and practically every player hates having to go to Wuhan, Stacey's China thing is pretty much universally hated, thought that was well-known.
dduk
08-10-2016
Amazing performance from Jo. A top ten player!
Get Den Watts
08-10-2016
Sharapova's interview reminded me of that time Princess Diana was interviewed by Martin Bashir. All doe-eyed, butter wouldn't melt. I wonder if she had an onion in her pocket.
benjiman_LFC
08-10-2016
Another great result. It's just a shame that every article BBC Sport posts on Facebook is littered with nasty comments about her right to be classed as British.
MissAyrshire
08-10-2016
Murray vs Klizan/Johnson in Shanghai
Tsonga v Mayer
Nadal vs Trocki/Qualifier
Djokovis vs Ramos Vinolas/Fogini
Delpo vs Goffin

Potential quarter finals in Shanghai
Djokovic vs Berdych
Nadal vs Cilic
Wawinka vs Raonic
Murray vs Monfils
vaslav37
08-10-2016
Congratulations to Jo Konta - she thoroughly deserves her Top 10 place. Go Jo.
vaslav37
08-10-2016
Originally Posted by Mike Tevee:
“Okay I completely misread some tweets I saw earlier, though Rafa won in straight sets.

At least he's fresh for Shanghai.”

I love Rafa but he still seems vulnerable now to unsuspecting losses
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