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Old 09-12-2016, 11:47
blueacid
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Damn.. so my number (originally o2) is now at the mercy of o2's core network reliability?

Hm. That's less than inspiring
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Old 09-12-2016, 14:17
Mark C
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Yay ! Just had my first ever EE to 02 HD call !
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Old 09-12-2016, 15:32
mrMick
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Just had a call from a friend on Vodafone to my BT Mobile, definitely HD. About time too!
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Old 09-12-2016, 17:01
japaul
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Thanks, interesting !

Reading up on this, it seems in Portugal the caller receives a recorded message just before connection that the number they have dialed has been ported. What's the logic behind that ?!
I don't know anything about that but if so, I'd guess it's to warn callers that charges for numbers that might previously have been on-net could be higher if they've been ported off-net.

Here that wouldn't apply as end user charges are based on the original network assignment even if the number has been ported and now terminates on a different network.
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Old 09-12-2016, 17:13
japaul
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A far better system. Are there any plans, however vague, that we might move to a central database system in the UK, or are we set to continue with the inefficient porting arrangements we currenty have?
Unlikely as Ofcom ordered it to be done in 2009 (along with changing from a donor led porting process to a recipient led one) due to the risk it poses in the event of network failure but the networks (except Three who supported the proposals) took legal action against Ofcom.

Ofcom were ordered to think again and dropped the idea.

Recently Ofcom has been consulting again about changing to a recipient led porting process and this might happen but there aren't any proposals for a common or central database system so it looks like we are stuck with the current indirect routing arrangements.
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Old 09-12-2016, 17:50
nigelbb
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I don't know anything about that but if so, I'd guess it's to warn callers that charges for numbers that might previously have been on-net could be higher if they've been ported off-net.

Here that wouldn't apply as end user charges are based on the original network assignment even if the number has been ported and now terminates on a different network.
How does that work with those who still get Free Three to Three calls if one or both numbers had been ported to Three?
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Old 09-12-2016, 18:18
japaul
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How does that work with those who still get Free Three to Three calls if one or both numbers had been ported to Three?
They can probably handle that as they know the number is on their network. I was thinking more about 3rd party networks all charging as per the original assignment.
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Old 09-12-2016, 18:20
moox
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Unlikely as Ofcom ordered it to be done in 2009 (along with changing from a donor led porting process to a recipient led one) due to the risk it poses in the event of network failure but the networks (except Three who supported the proposals) took legal action against Ofcom.

Ofcom were ordered to think again and dropped the idea.

Recently Ofcom has been consulting again about changing to a recipient led porting process and this might happen but there aren't any proposals for a common or central database system so it looks like we are stuck with the current indirect routing arrangements.
Other than "too much effort" I can't think of a good reason why the telcos would oppose the idea. If I was a telco I'd be happy to see reduced demand for trunk capacity / signalling overheads since I'm not "tromboning" everything.
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Old 09-12-2016, 18:34
japaul
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Other than "too much effort" I can't think of a good reason why the telcos would oppose the idea. If I was a telco I'd be happy to see reduced demand for trunk capacity / signalling overheads since I'm not "tromboning" everything.
It mostly came down to a cost benefit analysis and they argued that Ofcom hadn't done its sums properly but you can read the arguments in the CAT decision here http://www.catribunal.org.uk/files/J...094_180908.pdf
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Old 09-12-2016, 19:04
DevonBloke
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@japaul I did not know any of this porting/HD stuff. Both brother and cousin have just gone from VF to EE. I'm (1996 / 0973) native Orange/EE (obviously, because I'm legendary), so if they call me it should be HD as there's no VF involvement, but if I call them HD might break? So even on a WC to WC call, my call will go from EE IMS to VF and then back again therefore f***ing everything up?
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Old 09-12-2016, 19:39
sills
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@japaul I did not know any of this porting/HD stuff. Both brother and cousin have just gone from VF to EE. I'm (1996 / 0973) native Orange/EE (obviously, because I'm legendary), so if they call me it should be HD as there's no VF involvement, but if I call them HD might break? So even on a WC to WC call, my call will go from EE IMS to VF and then back again therefore f***ing everything up?
That will be fine, as you are all on EE the call won't leave EE's network.

If you weren't on EE and called them, the call would go to VF first then to their phone on EE.
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Old 09-12-2016, 22:41
Greebo
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...I'm (1996 / 0973) native Orange/EE (obviously, because I'm legendary)...
March '95 0973 here - you can look forward to your 21st card from Hans Snook!
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Old 09-12-2016, 23:16
japaul
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@japaul I did not know any of this porting/HD stuff. Both brother and cousin have just gone from VF to EE. I'm (1996 / 0973) native Orange/EE (obviously, because I'm legendary), so if they call me it should be HD as there's no VF involvement, but if I call them HD might break? So even on a WC to WC call, my call will go from EE IMS to VF and then back again therefore f***ing everything up?
Exactly what sills said - there's no problem if you are both on the same network.

Porting only causes a problem for cross net HD. Incidentally having an ex Orange EE number also seems to cause a few issues as in some respects it acts a bit like a ported number. So for instance a VF 3G to EE 3G call is likely to be HD if the EE number is from the T-Mobile range but has a lower chance of success it's from the Orange range of numbers. Presumably this is an issue EE will solve at some point.

Another issue with HD between VF and EE is that it only works if EE is 3G. Currently the call isn't HD if EE is on volte or wifi calling.

Early days for cross net HD. Lots of issues to fix.
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Old 10-12-2016, 09:19
moox
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March '95 0973 here - you can look forward to your 21st card from Hans Snook!
My dad was an fairly early Oranger too (though I think a botched upgrade technically screwed up the dates). He isn't anymore, but I think all he got for his years of custom was £10 off his next bill at 10 years.
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Old 10-12-2016, 18:46
thecjgcjg
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I am now able to use HD Voice between EE and O2 when the following are true
EE VoLTE -> O2 3G = Yes
EE VoWiFi -> O2 3G = Yes
EE 3G -> O2 3G = Yes
EE 2G -> O2 3G = No

I was just on the phone to someone on O2 and we had to keep recalling because the audio was not usable - it was an HD voice call and the call quality was inaudible for the person listening on the O2 side. I know that the other person has very strong O2 2G/3G/4G coverage in their area, of course O2 doesn't have VoLTE but it shows that they are in a well covered area.

We tried the call over
EE VoLTE -> O2 3G = Still sounded stuttery
EE VoWifi -> O2 3G = Same Problem

I feel like this was a problem with O2's network on the other end, or was it with the cross carrier connection? But i've never had issues calling this person when they are in this location before? Is the call quality not being lowered when the network is under load in that area?
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Old 11-12-2016, 09:39
jchamier
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March '95 0973 here - you can look forward to your 21st card from Hans Snook!
Nov '94 0973 here.... but I jumped to T-mobile after 11 years. My dad was April 94 and has only moved from Orange -> EE . Never had any recognition !
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Old 13-12-2016, 10:55
Mark C
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I presume it's too much to expect international HD calls at present ?
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Old 13-12-2016, 11:41
thecjgcjg
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I presume it's too much to expect international HD calls at present ?


I'd love this but presumably we'd need IP interconnect across international carriers - I'll assume that's what's just happened in the U.K. I can't see it happening internationally for a while unfortunately
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Old 13-12-2016, 19:28
moox
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I'd love this but presumably we'd need IP interconnect across international carriers - I'll assume that's what's just happened in the U.K. I can't see it happening internationally for a while unfortunately
This stuff is happening. e.g. this product from BT Global Service is used by many telcos to do IP interconnects: http://www.globalservices.bt.com/gtm...al_ip_exchange

Maybe with the ongoing absorption of EE into BT, we'll see them using stuff like this too
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Old 13-12-2016, 23:16
jo_m1
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This stuff is happening. e.g. this product from BT Global Service is used by many telcos to do IP interconnects: http://www.globalservices.bt.com/gtm...al_ip_exchange

Maybe with the ongoing absorption of EE into BT, we'll see them using stuff like this too
"Already 24 carriers already exchange High Definition Voice traffic via our Global IP Exchange" - so it does actually already happen!
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Old 21-12-2016, 12:53
blueacid
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How does that work with those who still get Free Three to Three calls if one or both numbers had been ported to Three?
I've been with Three for a few years now and all the people calling me have had the calls come from their Three to Three minutes, even though my number started out as an o2 number.
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Old 27-12-2016, 12:29
orudge
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I've definitely been receiving HD calls recently from EE (originally Orange) numbers to my 3 (originally T-Mobile) number. I think I've been able to make them too.
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Old 27-12-2016, 13:07
dslrocks
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My number's currently on 3 and was originally a Vodafone number and have noticed that most people I phone who are on other networks have HD voice now. It's pretty good, and the difference in sound quality is night and day.
.
But whenever they phone me, it isn't always HD. Does anyone find this happens?
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Old 27-12-2016, 15:48
moox
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My number's currently on 3 and was originally a Vodafone number and have noticed that most people I phone who are on other networks have HD voice now. It's pretty good, and the difference in sound quality is night and day.
.
But whenever they phone me, it isn't always HD. Does anyone find this happens?
I haven't noticed myself (I don't call enough people, and those that I do are on the same network as me) but perhaps it's because the routing isn't symmetric - the route calls take in one direction (or even the bearer - TDM vs IP) isn't necessarily how it works in the other direction.
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Old 28-12-2016, 16:18
The Lord Lucan
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Another issue with HD between VF and EE is that it only works if EE is 3G. Currently the call isn't HD if EE is on volte or wifi calling.

Early days for cross net HD. Lots of issues to fix.
Early days indeed, but i have received a HD call from someone on VF to my EE on 4G.. (my number is originally from VF... just to complicate). Pretty sure I've had it work on Wifi Calling too from the same person.
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