Under that basis, you'll end up with a vicious circle. Don't introduce DAB+ stations or transitions due to cost, perceived low number of sets and high number of satisfied listeners with DAB which then disincentives people to upgrade (now that radios are predominately DAB+ ready and produced for pan-Europe and Australia where DAB+ is established) which then feeds itself around. You'll always have DAB and DAB+ will be the underling.

Oh, quite.

Matt is far more qualified to pass judgement on this and has basically said it's not ready for mainstream commercial uptake right at this moment in time. The mini-muxes are starting to fly the DAB+ flag and that's brilliant. It's a trial, nobody has lost anything, just something extra to gain.

The UK dived in to DAB really early and ultimately slow uptake in vehicle manufacturers and portable devices either not being DAB+ activated or enabled (of which the public have gone out and bought millions of) has stunted the shift more than the big boys stifling it.

It's a slow burner, but I'm sure it'll happen. Just not quite as fast as us geeks would like.

Sounds like the vicious circle regarding mono DAB and single-speaker sets...

Yes.

The odd thing is, there wasn't the same level of antagonism and reservation with multiplexes being launched outside of 11B-12D or even the switch from 2K to 8K on DTT in a much shorter timeframe. Fine to junk them but DAB+ is a different kettle of fish for some reason.

Indeed, and the switch from DVB T to DVD T2 which is on the cards in a few years time and will render many older TVs and STBs completely obsolete as well.

DAB+ can't come soon enough. 48 kbps aac stereo would surely sound great compared to 80 kbps mono on D1, with Classic FM at 96 kbps aac. ? Heck, even 32 kbps aac stereo sounds better than 80 kbps mono.

Still, given the track record of "the big boys", they'll likely subject us to 24kbps mono DAB+ if it does happen

The DVB T2 isn't a certain yet, suspect it could be even further away or a slow phase in. It's not a big issue at the moment for the Gov who now have Brexit to sort out.

The DAB+ will happen at some point, when it's commercially logical. You can't blame the stations as there are so many now and I suspect the move to SDL has actually killed listeners to most of those stations. I bet Heart Extra and Magic are massive winners and they are still old school DAB. Lol

We'll find out at midnight. One of the contributors to this thread already knows the answers.

Is this data going to show up the changes? Or is it too early for them still?

Also do we get magic DAB and heart extra as stations in the data?

I have given up trying to listen to DAB+ @ 32kbps HE-AACv2. They have pushed it too far - this CODEC is optimal at 48kbps and at 32kbps the metallic swishing artefacts are all too evident, although it's worse on some radios than others. Very tiring on the ears

There is sufficient spare space on SDL to run the three DAB+ stations at 40kbps which might just be enough to kill these artefacts, but of course that would require Arqiva to admit they were wrong (it is in their interests long term to promote 32kbps because they will make more money by shoehorning in more stations).

As for Radio X the obvious solution to retain listeners and go stereo is just to bump up the bitrate using original flavour DAB by 32kbps to 112kbps. They could do this right now is they really wanted as there is 160kbps spare on Digital One.

I listen to one radio station that is only on dab+. It does sound better than the other stations on dab. More depth and clearer. I only bought a dab+ radio because of this station, and I got a 40 quid one from john Lewis. All my other listening including the car is LW MW and FM. There's a lot to listen to round here so the dab+ radio is just used for that 1 station. If it had been on fm I wouldn't have bothered, but I was getting a bit fed up listening on my phones tunein app

Yeah it's awful. 32kbps sounds really, really bad in my car. But this is what I keep saying, you can't get away with going that low in a car.

They won't increase them to 40kbps unfortunately.

well here you go rajar figures

Magic Chilled : 233, 000
Magic Mellow : 380, 000

Thats a small difference than I expected.

Jazz FM:

First full quarter on Sound Digital (June 2016) using DAB+: 597,000, a rise of 91,000 on the last quarter.
First full quarter on Digital One (June 2011) using DAB: 592,000, a rise of 97,000 on the last quarter.

Take the caveats of coverage into account, but there isn't much difference in listening figures for both instances where Jazz FM went national.

They do target different markets so that comparison is a bit silly. You need to look at something like Jazz FM to Jazz DAB ( if they publish it?).

That's still 63% ish more listeners, which is quite large.

So Jazz got nearly 100k extra listeners then. If we assume every one of these is on DAB+ then it's hardly the massive break through and Industry shocking figures some on here want.

I guess the real question is will those 100k listeners result in more revenue than the actual cost to broadcast on DAB+?

Of course D2 has more variables. What would be interesting is seeing how a DAB+ station was to do on D1. Suspect these figures mean we will be waiting a while to find out.

The two magic stations only differ by the genre of music they play and they target the same market. Magic pointed that out from the start and advertise both same magazines etc.

For me tho, this would suggest that dual illumination on the same mux is now worth considering.

Jazz FM was due to broadcast on Sound Digital at 80kbps mono MP2. I'm at odds as to how a 100k rise in listeners for a multiplex with 84.61% coverage in 2011 is a success whilst a similar rise for Sound Digital is a relative failure purely down to the use of DAB+?

DAB+ is not a deterrent to listeners and is here to stay, I say.

ETA: My sentiments appear to be shared by a very knowledgeable contributor to this thread: http://www.mattdeegan.com/2016/08/04/rajar-q22016/

To back that up, I do know a few people that work at Jazz FM and all the weekly stats have not been released, but on some weeks the listening figures was lower then last year, which suggest issues with the station rather then DAB+

They are never the same target market. The playlists are totally different. Chilled is more young and mello is definitely older. Magic is the middle of the road mix.

Absolute Radio at 80 kbps mono is a travesty, considering they had a campaign some years back (when the station launched as Virgin Radio) to put the network on FM at 106-108 MHz nationally, when that part of the spectrum was largely unused.

Since Absolute Radio is one of the three national commercial networks, I'm surprised it didn't go back to 112 kbps stereo as soon as space became available, but that's the big boys for ya'. Presumably they think everyone listens to music in 1950's style mono format.

I still think 32 kbps aac stereo DAB+ sounds a damned sight better than 80 kbps mono. 80 kbps mono is flat and lifeless, whether it be a car stereo or hifi. Obviously 48 kbps DAB+ would be better, but I suppose beggars can't be choosers at this stage.

I think once the BBC adopt the technology it'll speed the introduction of DAB+ on a national scale much quicker. I can't understand what's preventing the BBC from using it, especially for Radio Three for example. Usually, they're pretty innovative when it comes to new technology.

Unfortunately that suggests that the station may have lost some listeners who preferred the station when it played less jazz. Those of us who like jazz are probably enjoying the music more now but maybe there are fewer of us.

Also, are people assuming that the DAB+ audience are all new listeners? Wouldn't it be more likely that at least some of them are existing mono listeners who have switched to stereo?

Well that's the problem that no one really knows.

The figures can be viewed from whatever angle people prefer. I guess the next few sets will be interesting as they will show any growth in the DAB+ stations.

I suspect today's results will not create a surge or kill off DAB+ in the UK.

The truth is that the BBC has to take the plunge and move their stations onto dual broadcast of DAB and DAB+. They are under the least commercial pressure to do so and it would be a shot in the arm the move to DAB+ needs.

Where the BBC leads the others follow.

Well they shouldn't be selling them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digita...Kingdom#DAB.2B

Scoll down to:

58


The Department of Culture, Media and Sport published minimum specifications for digital radio receivers in the UK in February 2013 which states that a receiver sold in the UK must be capable of decoding a DAB+ stream of up to 144 capacity units[nb 4].[58]

The BBC should at the very least trail some of their stations on DAB+, may be even using some of the local muxs. With DAB+ now being fitted in most cars this platform will see significant growth.