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An open letter to Kate Oates


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Old 10-08-2016, 19:37
thejoyof_pat
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I will agree with you on one thing the spoilers are shocking. Tina's exit week was the worst with releasing the 4 scenes the night before...why?
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Old 10-08-2016, 19:46
James J
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But I think they are necessary otherwise what do we have in soaps? People chatting and sh*gging?
I think the distinction lies in whether a story grows from character or an issue. I remember on that ITV show Moving Wallpaper the producer had a list of issues on a tick list that had to be ticked off. It parodied the issue-lead concept.

Stories that come from character will naturally explore issues, and they don't have all to be chatting or shagging. The issues seen that grow from character roots will be authentic; it's obvious when an issue's been slapped onto a character. That is the distinction. Blackburn spent too much time doing the latter.
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Old 10-08-2016, 19:49
sorcha_healy27
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Sorry but you've mixed two separate points I made. I said the awards/press/social media reflected praise for the SL. Also the SL won panel awards as well as viewer ones so your whole post has fallen apart 😂

I separately said that the idea sexual abuse was used solely (or "flippantly" as you put it) as a cheap device to reunite Robron, is spurious.
I disagree. It was pretty clear the sexual abuse storyline was done solely to get them back together.

Otherwise why on earth would Aaron get back together with Robert given the Katie killing.
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Old 10-08-2016, 19:51
Ben96
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Awards are pretty meaningless unless their panel voted -the public are going to vote for their favourites so it's not spurious to say that at all.
Emmerdale won best continuing drama at the Broadcasting awards this year which is 100% panel voted.
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Old 10-08-2016, 19:51
James J
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I disagree. It was pretty clear the sexual abuse storyline was done solely to get them back together.

Otherwise why on earth would Aaron get back together with Robert given the Katie killing.
Robert could have saved Aaron's life in some way. Robert could have sacrificed himself for Aaron in some way. Loads of ways he could have shown his caring side and redeemed himself.

The way it happened, Aaron's past was fleshed out in a way that seemed very true and Robert was able to show he had a heart.
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Old 10-08-2016, 19:52
sorcha_healy27
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Emmerdale won best continuing drama at the Broadcasting awards this year which is 100% panel voted.
Yes so I take those ones seriously. It was long overdue especially for 2014/2015. However after the helicopter crash it went downhill in my view.
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Old 10-08-2016, 19:52
Ben96
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She has absolutely NO sense of humour, is totally obsessed with pregnacy, has no original ideas and had no idea of Emmerdale history although she rehashed (badly) old storylines instigated by others. Watch out for some of her old Corrie scripts reappearing.
I agree awards are meaningless, voted for by the adherents of whatever fad is fashionable, not by genuine followers of the programme who don't need all the awards claptrap to know what they like.
Lawrence/Ronnie stuff is completely original to my knowledge.
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Old 10-08-2016, 19:53
Ben96
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Yes so I take those ones seriously. It was long overdue especially for 2014/2015. However after the helicopter crash it went downhill in my view.
I agree that as an overall product It's gone downhill, but I think there has still been some excellent storylines since last summer.
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Old 10-08-2016, 20:36
sheepiefarm
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Lawrence/Ronnie stuff is completely original to my knowledge.
Eh?

Closeted gay man gets violent and abusive about his sexuality.

Its just a re-run of Robert & Aaron
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Old 10-08-2016, 20:48
soap-lea
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Eh?

Closeted gay man gets violent and abusive about his sexuality.

Its just a re-run of Robert & Aaron
yes cos Aaron had aversion therapy in prison

I don't think it's a re- run its a completely different story
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Old 10-08-2016, 21:39
sheepiefarm
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yes cos Aaron had aversion therapy in prison

I don't think it's a re- run its a completely different story
No its not - its just a re-hash of a closeted gay man.

Aaron - hates his sexuality & batters Jackson in the process of coming out

Robert - goes around attempting to kill people so they don't find out (shock horror) he's having an affair with a guy.

Now we have Lawrence - running around with a shotgun because of his "closeted" sexuality.

Sorry - but as a gay man, this endless repetition we've had in ED of gay men who get emotionally & physically violent towards their future partner has become beyond tedious.
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Old 10-08-2016, 21:43
Andybear
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No its not - its just a re-hash of a closeted gay man.

Aaron - hates his sexuality & batters Jackson in the process of coming out

Robert - goes around attempting to kill people so they don't find out (shock horror) he's having an affair with a guy.

Now we have Lawrence - running around with a shotgun because of his "closeted" sexuality.

Sorry - but as a gay man, this endless repetition we've had in ED of gay men who get emotionally & physically violent towards their future partner has become beyond tedious.
Ronnie isn't Lawrence's future partner though, he's his past one.
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Old 10-08-2016, 21:43
Coldwater2020
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Gay storylines aren't treated in particularly original ways in soaps, true, neither are abuse storylines. I'm kind of over the way that every guy who admits an attraction to another guy, no matter what his previous relationships were like with women is automatically expected to label themselves as gay and only like men from then on as if the writers don't really believe bisexuality exists or that it sometimes can't be just about this particular person, for instance.

I actually think it would have been interesting if they'd made Sandra the abuser. Female abusers are rare, but it does happen although I can't remember it ever being touched on in a soap. And it might have been another explanation not just for Aaron's initial misogyny and anger and lashing out and self-destructive tendencies and self-loathing, but for how they basically went from being so close to him physically assaulting her in the space of a couple of years.

I'm pretty sure they didn't initially plan for Aaron to have been sexually abused, but for the Aaron we meet in 2008/9 I thought it fit as part of his backstory. And while I thought there were things that were kind of weak (I doubt Gordon would have been convicted on that evidence in the real world and they should have either committed to Sandra actually witnessing the abuse and saying nothing or come up, but I guess they didn't want to make her completely unsympathetic and court cases in soaps are generally pretty laughable), I don't think it was handled flippantly or used solely to reunite Robert and Aaron and it's not as if a storyline can't serve more than one purpose.
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Old 10-08-2016, 21:46
nightwish1990
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That's quite mean, I spent quite a long time writing this post.
Yeah too long. She aint gonna read it so you have wasted your time.
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Old 10-08-2016, 21:49
sheepiefarm
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Ronnie isn't Lawrence's future partner though, he's his past one.
Really - why is Ronnie still in the show - he has no other purpose as a character beyond being hooked up with Lawrence
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Old 10-08-2016, 21:51
Coldwater2020
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No its not - its just a re-hash of a closeted gay man.

Aaron - hates his sexuality & batters Jackson in the process of coming out

Robert - goes around attempting to kill people so they don't find out (shock horror) he's having an affair with a guy.

Now we have Lawrence - running around with a shotgun because of his "closeted" sexuality.

Sorry - but as a gay man, this endless repetition we've had in ED of gay men who get emotionally & physically violent towards their future partner has become beyond tedious.
Lawrence only started running around with a shot gun recently though. When Robert outed him previously in front of Viv and co. he didn't turn violent or decide to kill everyone to keep his secret. His whole attitude this time around just seemed to be there to give Lucky a reason to shoot him. Especially since he got over it just in time for Chrissie to frame Andy and for Lawrence to suddenly care enough to go along with it.
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Old 10-08-2016, 21:53
Ben96
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No its not - its just a re-hash of a closeted gay man.

Aaron - hates his sexuality & batters Jackson in the process of coming out

Robert - goes around attempting to kill people so they don't find out (shock horror) he's having an affair with a guy.

Now we have Lawrence - running around with a shotgun because of his "closeted" sexuality.

Sorry - but as a gay man, this endless repetition we've had in ED of gay men who get emotionally & physically violent towards their future partner has become beyond tedious.
But that's not relating to what I said. My point was that the actual storyline of Lawrence having an affair in the 1960's whilst married to a woman, at a time where homosexuality was illegal being explored is completely original for a soap, also the whole Bernice & Lawrence sexless marriage was a soap first to be explored properly as a storyline to my knowledge as well and this has tied in with Lawrence's story.

To the poster that said that there was no original material, Chas' PTSD was also oringial and It was a good storyline as It tied in with all the traumatic events from her past.

But that aside, It shouldn't be about whether material is "original" or not, It's how it's delivered and portrayed that counts in my opinion.
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Old 10-08-2016, 21:55
sorcha_healy27
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yes cos Aaron had aversion therapy in prison

I don't think it's a re- run its a completely different story
You don't need literally every part of one storyline to happen for it not to be a rip off.
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Old 10-08-2016, 21:56
Andybear
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It's just a writing style but sure, slag me off like everyone else seems to be for trying to contribute something


I hadn't seen it, no.

I started writing this about a week ago.

Wish I hadn't bothered now. Hate this forum sometimes, a bunch of largely spiteful people. Mods close the f**ing thread
Having read this thread you're the one who's coming across to me as spiteful, not the posters of the responses - I think they're being very reasonable. If you want the thread closed ask the mods to do so.
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Old 10-08-2016, 21:57
sheepiefarm
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Lawrence only started running around with a shot gun recently though. When Robert outed him previously in front of Viv and co. he didn't turn violent or decide to kill everyone to keep his secret. His whole attitude this time around just seemed to be there to give Lucky a reason to shoot him. Especially since he got over it just in time for Chrissie to frame Andy and for Lawrence to suddenly care enough to go along with it.
Viv - how closely you follow the show eh - it was actually Val

But he had no-one to be violent towards - cue Ronnie enter stage left (an ex lover) and hey-ho - we've got the tired old cliche of gay man behaving violently towards a partner (ex or otherwise)


Like I said - as a gay viewer - this one note represenatation of gay relationship behaviour has got beyond tedious
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:14
Coldwater2020
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Viv - how closely you follow the show eh - it was actually Val

But he had no-one to be violent towards - cue Ronnie enter stage left (an ex lover) and hey-ho - we've got the tired old cliche of gay man behaving violently towards a partner (ex or otherwise)


Like I said - as a gay viewer - this one note represenatation of gay relationship behaviour has got beyond tedious
Sorry Val. He was aggressive with Ronnie because he didn't want the fact that he was gay and had an affair with a man to come out. My point was that Lawrence being gay had already come out in a past storyline, more than one time in fact, without Lawrence feeling the need to be violent about it even though he obviously wanted to keep that part of himself a secret as much as possible. The choice to make him violent and overreact to Ronnie's arrival and Chrissie outing him seemed to be there more to facilitate the current shooting and frame up storyline, hence him conveniently being ok with Ronnie and being ok with Chrissie and Lucky the moment the plot needed him to be on side.
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:22
James J
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Having read this thread you're the one who's coming across to me as spiteful, not the posters of the responses - I think they're being very reasonable. If you want the thread closed ask the mods to do so.
Wouldn't expect any other sort of response than this from you. Nah I'm happy with the thread, I'm sure some people will have appreciated the time I spent and decided to stay out of responding with all the mudslingers and poopooers!

I think any more posts taking things off topic should just be reported from now on, I admit I shouldn't have responded but it takes two to tango and I felt a bit ganged up on. That way this can go back to being a thread about ideas for Coronation Street which is why I wrote it.

It would be nice to actually have in depth discussions about the topics I listed in the first post.. production, set, pacing, episode structure, characterisation, and so on - rather than ad hominem and criticising Kate's work on Emmerdale.
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:31
Pandora.
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Wouldn't expect any other sort of response than this from you. Nah I'm happy with the thread, I'm sure some people will have appreciated the time I spent and decided to stay out of responding with all the mudslingers and poopooers!
How rude!

I'm sure everyone appreciate the work you put into that, but as soon as you started getting responses that weren't the ones you imagined you threw a hissy fit. It doesn't really instill sympathy in anyone..
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:35
James J
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How rude!

I'm sure everyone appreciate the work you put into that, but as soon as you started getting responses that weren't the ones you imagined you threw a hissy fit. It doesn't really instill sympathy in anyone..
Nope.

I threw a "hissy fit" because a troupe of posters (some of whom are bedfellows in forum cliques) decided to be disrespectful and rude. I didn't see a shred of appreciation of the amount of work I put into it; I wasn't asking for that, but to get people saying stuff like "If you want Coronation Street to continue being the success and amazing show it is, do the opposite of what this guy says" to me is just not very nice and not necessary. Furthermore slagging off the writing style etc just all I found hurtful. I repeat this is not anything to do with being upset people don't agree with me. I love and welcome a constructive debate with substance.

As I said earlier I am not saying I am 100% right with my views in the OP, my opinion is the only opinion or x y z. What I do hope for though is a constructive discussion on the points I've raised in my post, rather than dragging it off topic and being nasty to the OP when it's clear they've put some thought into the post and wanted to have a dicussion about ideas.

I have brought up a range of issues and fleshed them out with reasoning in my post, from the show's production, to characters, to episode structure and more. Very little in the responses even bothered to talk about the points I'd raised.

Disappointing.
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:36
soap-lea
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Wouldn't expect any other sort of response than this from you. Nah I'm happy with the thread, I'm sure some people will have appreciated the time I spent and decided to stay out of responding with all the mudslingers and poopooers!

I think any more posts taking things off topic should just be reported from now on, I admit I shouldn't have responded but it takes two to tango and I felt a bit ganged up on. That way this can go back to being a thread about ideas for Coronation Street which is why I wrote it.

It would be nice to actually have in depth discussions about the topics I listed in the first post.. production, set, pacing, episode structure, characterisation, and so on - rather than ad hominem and criticising Kate's work on Emmerdale.
yet you ganged up on me, one of the few being nice and ignored the haters.
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