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An open letter to Kate Oates


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Old 10-08-2016, 22:39
soap-lea
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You don't need literally every part of one storyline to happen for it not to be a rip off.
well no of course not but other than it being two gay men there isn't much similar.

I still don't buy robert as gay at all


Lawrence was/is but his whole story with prison and the aversion therapy makes it very different.

I don't think we will see Emmerdale style stories in Corrie, I think she appreciates they are different shows with different styles
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:40
James J
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yet you ganged up on me, one of the few being nice and ignored the haters.
Why are you coming back again now, I thought we'd drawn a line under our particular chapter of this story? You aren't exactly blameless, your first post being just like the others in disregarding the content of my post and simply saying I should PM Daniel as per his pinned post.

You edited your post to add a quick 5 second thought on disagreeing on the whole with little else in the way substance - after I'd responded to you, irritated. You later said "did you post it because you wanted everyone to agree or did you post it so people would discuss?" I say that's deliberately provocative. You also said my post was faffy, which is insulting as it took so long to write and I felt happy with it - later clarifying that as being about copying and pasting/quoting on your iPad being difficult due to its length - but that's a cop out and an excuse for not constructively addressing anything I wrote. Just because a post is long does not mean it's impossible to debate parts of it. And if you're not capable of doing it due to its 'faffiness', why contribute at all?

Despite all this I apologised to you, admitted I was defensive and felt like shit from the early responses.

Yet here you are again chiming in!


So ONCE AGAIN I will repeat: "It would be nice to actually have in depth discussions about the topics I listed in the first post.. production, set, pacing, episode structure, characterisation, and so on - rather than ad hominem and criticising Kate's work on Emmerdale."
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:46
dennisboy
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So ONCE AGAIN I will repeat: "It would be nice to actually have in depth discussions about the topics I listed in the first post.. production, set, pacing, episode structure, characterisation, and so on - rather than ad hominem and criticising Kate's work on Emmerdale."
Ok boss!
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:47
James J
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Anyone else want to come at me with a pitchfork then play the victim when I don't just let them stab me or...?
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:48
albiex
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As I said earlier I am not saying I am 100% right with my views in the OP, my opinion is the only opinion or x y z. What I do hope for though is a constructive discussion on the points I've raised in my post, rather than dragging it off topic and being nasty to the OP when it's clear they've put some thought into the post and wanted to have a dicussion about ideas.

I have brought up a range of issues and fleshed them out with reasoning in my post, from the show's production, to characters, to episode structure and more. Very little in the responses even bothered to talk about the points I'd raised.

Disappointing.
Then perhaps you should just have posted your thoughts without addressing them to Kate Oates who doesn't have a very good record/reputation after demolishing Emmerdale but thinks she's perfect and doesn't listen to anyone anyway
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:49
claremonts
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Anyone else want to come at me with a pitchfork then play the victim when I don't just let them stab me or...?
I thought your letter was so well thought out, and you have obviously put so much time into it. I do agree with some of your comments, especially the section about spoiler alerts 🙂
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:50
soap-lea
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Why are you coming back again now, I thought we'd drawn a line under our particular chapter of this story? You aren't exactly blameless, your first post being just like the others in disregarding the content of my post and simply saying I should PM Daniel as per his pinned post.

You edited your post to add a quick 5 second thought on disagreeing on the whole with little else in the way substance - after I'd responded to you, irritated. You later said "did you post it because you wanted everyone to agree or did you post it so people would discuss?" I say that's deliberately provocative. You also said my post was faffy, which is insulting as it took so long to write and I felt happy with it - later clarifying that as being about copying and pasting/quoting on your iPad being difficult due to its length - but that's a cop out and an excuse for not constructively addressing anything I wrote. Just because a post is long does not mean it's impossible to debate parts of it. And if you're not capable of doing it due to its 'faffiness', why contribute at all?

Despite all this I apologised to you, admitted I was defensive and felt like shit from the early responses.

Yet here you are again chiming in!


So ONCE AGAIN I will repeat: "It would be nice to actually have in depth discussions about the topics I listed in the first post.. production, set, pacing, episode structure, characterisation, and so on - rather than ad hominem and criticising Kate's work on Emmerdale."
I was saying that it takes too long and is faffy to cut and paste to quote bits on my Ipad not that the post was long and faffy!

but yet again you seem to be going for the easy target on who to pick on.


you can't have it both ways you either want a discussion or you don't. You seem not to given that you are being aggressive to everyone who does not fawn over your post and agree with what you say, so yes, I am. chiming in, I came in to respond to posts within the thread. there is a great discussion going on you just seem to have bypassed it
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:51
James J
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Then perhaps you should just have posted your thoughts without addressing them to Kate Oates who doesn't have a very good record/reputation after demolishing Emmerdale but thinks she's perfect and doesn't listen to anyone anyway
Or perhaps people could have criticised Kate if that's their opinion, then focused on the wide range of ideas and topics raised in the first post?

Even if I hadn't used the writing style of addressing it to Kate Oates, we'd still have had responses akin to "well it doesn't matter anyway because Kate Oates will turn it into the Sopranos meets Sex and the City". Responses like these are at least vaguely on topic though, if uninspiring and not all that constructive.
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:54
James J
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I was saying that it takes too long and is faffy to cut and paste to quote bits on my Ipad not that the post was long and faffy!

but yet again you seem to be going for the easy target on who to pick on.


you can't have it both ways you either want a discussion or you don't. You seem not to given that you are being aggressive to everyone who does not fawn over your post and agree with what you say, so yes, I am. chiming in, I came in to respond to posts within the thread. there is a great discussion going on you just seem to have bypassed it
What are you talking about easy targets for? Honestly don't know what you're talking about. I've not picked on any individual, but responded to people throwing bricks at me and being disrespectful after I spent hours writing a post of ideas. I have said repeatedly I felt hurt by people not even addressing a single word of my post.

I do not want fawning over my post, for the umpteenth time. People can go through each and every paragraph and tear it to shreds for all I care, if they back their points up with a bit of f****ng substance!

How many more ways can I get that across? I wanted a good debate about Corrie here, all I got was slagged off. I've responded and now all the aggressors are playing the victim. You couldn't make it up.

I might not be in one of the many forum cliques on here and that may be why I'm not protected by an army of people but at least I think I post constructive posts and opinions. People just seem to want to put me down rather than have a chat with me which is why I come on here in the first place

It's no wonder so many good posters have given up on this place.
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:55
albiex
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well no of course not but other than it being two gay men there isn't much similar.

I still don't buy robert as gay at all


Lawrence was/is but his whole story with prison and the aversion therapy makes it very different.

I don't think we will see Emmerdale style stories in Corrie, I think she appreciates they are different shows with different styles
Nor do I, I don't think anyone that watched all that the previous Robert got up to would.

I think when Lawrence was in prison 'aversion therapy' would have been gay bashing. Literally.
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:57
James J
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I thought your letter was so well thought out, and you have obviously put so much time into it. I do agree with some of your comments, especially the section about spoiler alerts 🙂
Thank you very much. The spoilers are so annoying, aren't they? I know a lot of it is ITV's doing but I hope there can be a discussion or meetings to figure out ways to continue to tease episodes but not give every single plot development away.
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Old 10-08-2016, 22:59
soap-lea
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What are you talking about easy targets for? Honestly don't know what you're talking about. I've not picked on any individual, but responded to people throwing bricks at me and being disrespectful after I spent hours writing a post of ideas. I have said repeatedly I felt hurt by people not even addressing a single word of my post.

I do not want fawning over my post, for the umpteenth time. People can go through each and every paragraph and tear it to shreds for all I care, if they back their points up with a bit of f****ng substance!

How many more ways can I get that across? I wanted a good debate about Corrie here, all I got was slagged off. I've responded and now all the aggressors are playing the victim. You couldn't make it up.

I might not be in one of the many forum cliques on here and that may be why I'm not protected by an army of people but at least I think I post constructive posts and opinions. People just seem to want to put me down rather than have a chat with me which is why I come on here in the first place

It's no wonder so many good posters have given up on this place.
cos you keep talking about cliques and I am definitely not in any ED or corrie clique as well you know given you have all but named the posters you feel are.


You don't seem to realise you are acting in the very way you are accusing others of. Maybe consider how you are coming across and then you might see why no one wants to "chat" with you.

Me, personally I am putting you on ignore. I thought your post was in depth and just what Daniel and DS were looking for and all its got me is grief.
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Old 10-08-2016, 23:04
James J
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cos you keep talking about cliques and I am definitely not in any ED or corrie clique as well you know given you have all but named the posters you feel are.


You don't seem to realise you are acting in the very way you are accusing others of. Maybe consider how you are coming across and then you might see why no one wants to "chat" with you.

Me, personally I am putting you on ignore. I thought your post was in depth and just what Daniel and DS were looking for and all its got me is grief.
Do what you want.

I think you're being unreasonable and wrongly taking everything I say as a personal direct attack at you, but I couldn't care less anymore. You clearly won't miss my "faffy" posts when I'm on ignore and it'll save me the irritation of having to have tedious circular discussions like this with you.

For the record I've had a couple of PMs about this issue from people who think the response has been ridiculous. I suppose they don't want to muddy themselves by entering this thread, which was created with the best of intentions before being systematically ruined by a few people - some of whom are, as I said, bedfellows in forum cliques I am not part of.

Hopefully some good soul comes along and maybe - GASP - quotes even one tiny part of my OP and discusses what I said, rather than perpetuating this ghastly debacle of thread derailment and mud slinging.

The victim act is quite wearing - seen you at that in loads of other posts and arguments you've often started. Stands to reason you've posted 6 times more than me (a day) in 5 fewer years...
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Old 10-08-2016, 23:05
claremonts
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Old 10-08-2016, 23:06
James J
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Yes-teasers are fine, and even if we are thrown a few red herrings in for good measure along the way then that helps to keep a plot interesting (well for me anyway)!
I remember the time when it was revealed Steve called social services on Becky. That wasn't in the spoilers and it was a real jaw dropper. Would love more scenes like that dropped in here and there.
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Old 10-08-2016, 23:07
claremonts
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Thank you very much. The spoilers are so annoying, aren't they? I know a lot of it is ITV's doing but I hope there can be a discussion or meetings to figure out ways to continue to tease episodes but not give every single plot development away.
Yes-teasers are fine, and even if we are thrown a few red herrings in for good measure along the way then that helps to keep a plot interesting (well for me anyway)!
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Old 10-08-2016, 23:39
eastboy1980
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OP, Why didn't you just send this letter to Kate Oates instead of posting it here. You say you wanted to open discussion etc but after reading through 4 pages of comments and your replies it's evident that you are one of those people who is always right and everyone else is wrong. You expected praise because As I said earlier you thought you were speaking for us all and didn't like it when you realised that you were not.
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Old 10-08-2016, 23:47
James J
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OP, Why didn't you just send this letter to Kate Oates instead of posting it here. You say you wanted to open discussion etc but after reading through 4 pages of comments and your replies it's evident that you are one of those people who is always right and everyone else is wrong. You expected praise because As I said earlier you thought you were speaking for us all and didn't like it when you realised that you were not.
I'm still waiting for someone to actually debate something I wrote in the OP about writing, production, the sets, the filming, the character development, the pacing, the episode structure. The ideas, rather than the past or notions I want smoke blown up my arse.

If someone disagrees with me and gives their reasons, I'm delighted to have that debate. Unfortunately that's not happened and that's disappointing. As of yet the bulk of what I wrote has been completely ignored. I hold out hope some Corrie fans will come along and chat about the original post and we can have a really constructive, interesting and in-depth discussion, which is why I made the thread.

It's more disappointing than anything because I think I offered up so much to talk about with the show and discuss, never once proclaiming my word to be gospel (the open letter style was of course up for debate hence the thread and clearly I do not profess to speak for everyone as you're insinuating, it's just a writing style). Constructive debate is somewhat lacking on this forum, unfortunately.
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Old 11-08-2016, 16:36
boogie woogie
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James J, thank you for posting a very perceptive, thought-provoking and- in my opinion- relevant summary of what areas you hope Oates improves. The point that probably stood out most to me was the one about the structure of the episodes. Corrie has become quite lazy and pedestrian by not giving big stories the pay-off they deserve by discarding of surrounding filler and narrowing the focus to the principal characters directly involved. Take Hayley's final episode, for example. It was undeniably powerful and gut-wrenching to see a long-serving and beloved character take her own life, watched by her soul mate, but what about that bloody hammering on the door? Why on earth did we need Carla and Anna intruding upon this legendary couple's final moments together? It spoiled what was otherwise heartbreaking to watch, and was completely unnecessary. Kylie's final scenes recently were- arguably- more powerful because the outside world was filtered out with the clever use of the close-ups as we saw Kylie and David's final exchange. It was just them, with a helpless Bethany and Gail looking on, and Roy make a fleeting appearance. The emotional impact lay in the fact that at that point it was just them.

Look at the supposed "big" weeks that we've had served up of late. This year's BGT week was provably the worst one yet, largely due to the terrible pacing, which resulted in Carla's rushed exit. Why is it that the show only attempts to do anything different with time frames only once or twice a year? Why can't we have climaxes to stories play out in real time like the day of Liam Connor's death, the tram crash etc. I love the idea of single episodes playing out in the early hours of the morning, with many characters in dressing gowns. Why don't we have episodes centred around lock-ins at the Rovers? Phil Collinson, to his credit, did attempt to play about with episode structure occasionally with the episode that centred around a day in the life of Peter Barlow being a great example. We haven't had a two-hander since 2007, for crying out loud! Other soaps have responded to the audience's desire to see new forms and styles of storytelling: Emmerdale had the rewind episode, EastEnders did the Lucy flashback, Hollyoaks will soon have their Point of View week. In an era where we see shows that have ambitious storytelling involving multitudes of characters, e.g. Game of Thrones, Damages etc. soap need to up their game to remain relevant and fresh.

James J, thank you for presenting us with a very eloquently written post on what Cirrie needs to do. I agree with virtually all of it, but particularly the points about storylines intertwining and structure of narrative.
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Old 11-08-2016, 17:03
Danny_Francis
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Some fans are just too fusy, Oates not perfect but did a fine job at Emmerdale overall they're more positives that can be reflected on than negatives. CS is in the dumps and has been for a reason, Oates has a vision for the show and needs time to turn it around. One thing that Oates brought to Emmerdale was surprise, twists and suspense can you say that CS has really had that for a while?
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Old 11-08-2016, 17:53
Andybear
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Some fans are just too fusy, Oates not perfect but did a fine job at Emmerdale overall they're more positives that can be reflected on than negatives. CS is in the dumps and has been for a reason, Oates has a vision for the show and needs time to turn it around. One thing that Oates brought to Emmerdale was surprise, twists and suspense can you say that CS has really had that for a while?
I agree with what you say about her work on ED, particularly as regards twists etc. One of my favourites was Rachel turning up at Charity's trial and her evidence resulting in Charity going to prison. I think most people had guessed that Emma was pregnant by then so she would be going on maternity leave but I think I wasn't alone in cheering when Charity got sent down
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Old 11-08-2016, 18:16
James J
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James J, thank you for posting a very perceptive, thought-provoking and- in my opinion- relevant summary of what areas you hope Oates improves. The point that probably stood out most to me was the one about the structure of the episodes. Corrie has become quite lazy and pedestrian by not giving big stories the pay-off they deserve by discarding of surrounding filler and narrowing the focus to the principal characters directly involved. Take Hayley's final episode, for example. It was undeniably powerful and gut-wrenching to see a long-serving and beloved character take her own life, watched by her soul mate, but what about that bloody hammering on the door? Why on earth did we need Carla and Anna intruding upon this legendary couple's final moments together? It spoiled what was otherwise heartbreaking to watch, and was completely unnecessary. Kylie's final scenes recently were- arguably- more powerful because the outside world was filtered out with the clever use of the close-ups as we saw Kylie and David's final exchange. It was just them, with a helpless Bethany and Gail looking on, and Roy make a fleeting appearance. The emotional impact lay in the fact that at that point it was just them.

Look at the supposed "big" weeks that we've had served up of late. This year's BGT week was provably the worst one yet, largely due to the terrible pacing, which resulted in Carla's rushed exit. Why is it that the show only attempts to do anything different with time frames only once or twice a year? Why can't we have climaxes to stories play out in real time like the day of Liam Connor's death, the tram crash etc. I love the idea of single episodes playing out in the early hours of the morning, with many characters in dressing gowns. Why don't we have episodes centred around lock-ins at the Rovers? Phil Collinson, to his credit, did attempt to play about with episode structure occasionally with the episode that centred around a day in the life of Peter Barlow being a great example. We haven't had a two-hander since 2007, for crying out loud! Other soaps have responded to the audience's desire to see new forms and styles of storytelling: Emmerdale had the rewind episode, EastEnders did the Lucy flashback, Hollyoaks will soon have their Point of View week. In an era where we see shows that have ambitious storytelling involving multitudes of characters, e.g. Game of Thrones, Damages etc. soap need to up their game to remain relevant and fresh.

James J, thank you for presenting us with a very eloquently written post on what Cirrie needs to do. I agree with virtually all of it, but particularly the points about storylines intertwining and structure of narrative.
Completely agree and I think your example of Kylie's death being 'the right way' to do it is spot on. While the first episode was a more standard episode, leading up to her death, the second episode was dedicated in its entirety to the fall out of her stabbing.

This was the first time in ages and really welcomed; but I'd like to see it for more storylines. Maybe one double a week or fortnight could focus intensely on the main thread in episode 2.

Totally agree re: the rewind episode, Lucy flashback and HO Point of View too. I'd like to see Corrie do this - they of course did the 'day in the life of Peter' episode which was really cool. I'd love an episode set entirely in the Rovers during a character's birthday party, with storylines going on all over the place.

I'd also love a power cut storyline in the winter as well. Maybe Kate could do a storm on the street which cuts all the power, leaving the community to congregate by candle light and throwing in a few problems like a child going missing or something. Things which show the whole community rallying together and seem special. Doesn't need deaths or major disasters, just more ensemble episodes.
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Old 11-08-2016, 18:21
KornerKabin
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Hi James,

I started replying to each of your headings but then realised my main issue with Coronation Street is so critical that I've kind of just gone 'freestyle'. This isn't addressed to Kate Oates, it's more a general plea. I will reply to your points this evening but this is just my take on things more generally...

For me, all of Corrie's problems extend far wider than the capabilities of one person. I have never blamed Blackburn for the decline in the show, it's been slowly going on for years. Blackburn's weakness just highlighted Corrie's failings to many more viewers than had noticed it in the past. I think that KO is a strong force within British soap and she will make some improvements, but the entire production team needs a significant shake up to give the show a new sense of purpose.

First and foremost, Coronation Street needs to be about Coronation Street. Where is this street? What does it look like? Who lives there? Why do they live there? What are these people like? What are their worries and fears? What are their successes and triumphs? Where is Coronation Street?

This, for me, is the basis of the show. Coronation Street is the star, nobody else.

Sadly, Coronation Street has not been about Coronation Street for many, many years. It's now just a collection of random people inhabiting a random street that exists somewhere in a north of England imagined by ITV executives.

There needs to be a significant period of reestablishing Coronation Street as a place. Look back to the essence of Tony Warren's original scripts. He spent years in and around streets like Coronation Street, witnessing the characters who lived there. He was out there, getting muck under his fingernails. Coronation Street was born of the real world. Through the decades this essence was always at the show's core, right up until the early 2000s. Yes there were ups and downs but Coronation Street was always about Coronation Street. Now it isn't.

The biggest issue here is 'executive cosiness'. The entire production team are completely divorced from the real world and have no grasp over what the hell Coronation Street is actually about. This is illustrated on screen by the car crash of sets we now have as well as the revolving door of ridiculous characters (the laughable 'hardmen' Callum, Macca and Clayton are a prime example of the kind of characters that could only be dreamed up by a bunch of self-congratulatory middle managers).

Get all members of the creative team (storylines, script editors, writers, sets, costume) out onto the streets of Manchester, Lancashire and the north of England and make them see what is happening there NOW. This needs to fuel their creative practice and fuel the renaissance of Coronation Street. All of the elements of Corrie are out there in the real world - the warmth, humour, drama and tragedy - but they need a realistic context in which to thrive. That context is Coronation Street itself.
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Old 11-08-2016, 19:31
James J
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Hi James,

I started replying to each of your headings but then realised my main issue with Coronation Street is so critical that I've kind of just gone 'freestyle'. This isn't addressed to Kate Oates, it's more a general plea. I will reply to your points this evening but this is just my take on things more generally...
Ahhh this post made me squeal with delight, so brilliant KK! So happy that this thread is now finally focussing on Corrie and ideas and thoughts about it, so thank you to you and boogie woogie!

Can't wait to see your later post about the points from the OP but for now, my thoughts on this freestyle...

First and foremost, Coronation Street needs to be about Coronation Street. Where is this street? What does it look like? Who lives there? Why do they live there? What are these people like? What are their worries and fears? What are their successes and triumphs? Where is Coronation Street?

This, for me, is the basis of the show. Coronation Street is the star, nobody else.
I utterly agree. The show has somehow lost the sense it is set in Manchester - why this is, is hard to know. I'm not sure if the sets let it down, the characterisation or both, or precisely in what way. Watching old episodes I really get that 'feeling' but I don't feel it now.

Sadly, Coronation Street has not been about Coronation Street for many, many years. It's now just a collection of random people inhabiting a random street that exists somewhere in a north of England imagined by ITV executives.

There needs to be a significant period of reestablishing Coronation Street as a place. Look back to the essence of Tony Warren's original scripts. He spent years in and around streets like Coronation Street, witnessing the characters who lived there. He was out there, getting muck under his fingernails. Coronation Street was born of the real world. Through the decades this essence was always at the show's core, right up until the early 2000s. Yes there were ups and downs but Coronation Street was always about Coronation Street. Now it isn't.
Beautifully written. I think Tony's blood ran through the street, and his working class roots were really evident. He KNEW what the real world was like, and portrayed it at every level. It wasn't glamorous and clean, but mucky and dirty. Corrie's lost that sense of realism. It's all so clean, all the characters have nice hair and clothes (or wear unrealistic 'pawper clothes' like Beth, for example). The street itself is immaculate bar an unrealistic 'ripped poster on the wall' here and there. No litter, nothing. Immaculate cobbles, pavements and houses. Like a museum.

The biggest issue here is 'executive cosiness'. The entire production team are completely divorced from the real world and have no grasp over what the hell Coronation Street is actually about. This is illustrated on screen by the car crash of sets we now have as well as the revolving door of ridiculous characters (the laughable 'hardmen' Callum, Macca and Clayton are a prime example of the kind of characters that could only be dreamed up by a bunch of self-congratulatory middle managers).
Agree here, particularly about the sets. We've talked about this at length in the modernising Coronation Street thread but it really is a major issue I think which should be one of the main priorities.

Just how could these changes be brought about viably? And how would the show be affected by their amendment or removal? People speak widely of destroying the factory and whilst I fully approve of a move to lessen the number of businesses on the street itself, the factory is undoubtedly a good way of bringing a large group together in 'the workers'. But perhaps without the factory we'd see more community and family scenes and *gasp* maybe even people at work away from the street? Frescos coming back would be welcomed as some cast could work there, and others could just shop there. That could be a replacement for the Underworld setting, and perhaps they could even build some new houses where Underworld sits now. The interior sets as well could do with a refresh.

But would ITV allow such radical changes? They seem to have pressed pause on the development of Corrie any further, such that it is stuck in a time loop. The cladding must never come down from Fiz/Tyrone's house, the Kabin and Dev's shops will remain exactly the same for all eternity, the Rovers will never be updated ever again, etc. It's this preciousness which they mistakenly think keeps the show 'true to itself' but actually does the opposite. Corrie has a history of changing its landscape to suit the times.

In real life, the factory would have long gone out of business and been replaced with home developments, for example.

Get all members of the creative team (storylines, script editors, writers, sets, costume) out onto the streets of Manchester, Lancashire and the north of England and make them see what is happening there NOW. This needs to fuel their creative practice and fuel the renaissance of Coronation Street. All of the elements of Corrie are out there in the real world - the warmth, humour, drama and tragedy - but they need a realistic context in which to thrive. That context is Coronation Street itself.
Totally agree - and well done for such a great post.

Wonder if we can come up with a list of ways specifically to address the realism you're talking about here with.

In fact we could make this thread a collaborative effort to discuss in depth real ways TPTB could make great improvements in the topic areas outlined in the OP (we can add to or tweak those topic areas and make them comprehensive), then maybe when we've come up with all the ideas we can collate them and send them off to Kate or something?

I'm fairly sure someone at the top would read these forums though so even if we didn't send them off it could be a good idea. I think focusing on real tangible things that could be done and clearly stating their benefit on the stories and show itself would be helpful. Some ideas are good in principle but need to work in practice and be viable etc etc

Yay can't wait to read more
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Old 11-08-2016, 21:19
KornerKabin
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Using all the cast, interweaving plots & interconnectedness
This is a big one for me. Ironically, stories do interweave, but they are always lumped onto one family or group of characters. Stories are so strongly concentrated towards certain characters/families that it becomes very tiresome. The Platts, for instance, have had so much going on in the past 6 months such as Nick/Carla wedding, Callum's murder, Sarah's mental health issues, Bethany's bullying and Kylie's murder. All of these stories have intersected at the same time, while the rest of the cast languish in the sidelines. It's very imbalanced. Share the stories out among the cast more widely and then weave them together.

As well as leaving most of the cast out in the cold, the other problem with basing so many stories around one family/group of characters, is that viewers begin to question the credibility of the show. Much has been made this week on DS about how cheerfully Nick has leapt into his new business venture a couple of weeks after his brother's wife and his former lover was brutally stabbed to death.

In terms of character interactions and community, I completely agree that the Rovers needs to be made the central meeting point in the show again, along with the corner shop and to a lesser extent the café.

Discussing ‘community’ makes me feel uncomfortable as I always envisage awkward storylines where the residents get involved a street party or a pantomime. They don’t need something OTT and outlandish, they just need to bring together characters from different backgrounds in places like the Rovers and corner shop. I sound like I’m obsessed with ‘looking back’ and in many ways I am, but Corrie always used to get characters and character interactions right, so why can’t they do that today with characters and dialogue relevant to viewers in 2016? One of the absolute staples of Corrie for the first 40 years of its life was the mixture of characters you’d get standing around the bar at the Rovers. Different characters would exchange views and opinions and be there to witness and discuss the drama or comedy when it happened. I can’t remember the last time we had a proper Rovers bar scene. The corner shop used to be used in a similar way, though interactions there were always much quicker and it was the main interchange of gossip and rumour. All we get today is scene after scene after scene that focuses on moving a plot from one point to the other.

I think a small scale ‘crisis’ would be just the thing that could bring the street together and kick start a new era of community-based interactions. I think your idea for a serious power cut or maybe even a flood could be just the thing. Right from the earliest days, Corrie has used disasters not only as a chance to have a bit of drama, but also as a means of bringing disparate characters together. They had all sorts in the 60s and 70s, from unexploded bombs and train crashes to gas leaks and warehouse fires. While the disaster itself provided the drama, the main focus of episodes was always the scenes of the residents pulling together (or in some cases not – Annie Walker got so fed up of being told what to do after the warehouse fire in 1975 that she stormed out of the evacuation centre and loudly proclaimed that she was going to: ‘do what I should’ve done hours ago, look after number 1!’) It was interactions like these that helped build individual characters and strengthen the popularity of the show.

Interactions raise another of Corrie’s issues, something which is a great point of ridicule on DS these days: every episode is based around a series of contrived ‘chance’ meetings. Last night’s episodes had half a dozen chance meetings within the first half, and Monday’s double had chance meeting after chance meeting. Viewers can see through it and it does nothing for the credibility of the show.

Make more of the day-to-day lives of the characters and build drama and comedy around that. By this I mean shopping, running errands, taking the dog for a walk. Characters need to be seen in locations where it is realistically expected they would be at a given point. Stop sending characters out on cake runs/for change/on a message or, even worse, have them appear in locations for no reason whatsoever just so a chance meeting can be contrived. For instance, if a character needs to be in a scene in the corner shop, then have them go in there to buy something specific, be explicit about what they’re doing there and then build the scene around that. To return to Tony Warren’s first episode, just remember that very first scene with Ena Sharples walking into the corner shop. She didn't just appear in the shop to suss out Florrie Lindley (though that was the basis of the scene), she had a full list of shopping that she needed (a packet of baking powder ... half a dozen fancies, and NO eclairs ... and a bottle of beach). The reason for Ena being in the shop was her shopping, but the drama came from her probing questioning of the new shop owner. Today all we get is characters appearing in locations for no apparent reason.
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