[KIIS102]

Hi guys, just need some advice.

Was on the Tello Network (running on 3) for a month. Then joined Life Mobile (EE). Got my PAC code from Tello and gave it to LIFE expecting my number to come over within 2days.

3weeks later the number hasn't really moved over. I can send texts and make calls (and use data) while my LIFE mobile sim is in my iPhone. They are going out from the number I requested to move over. I can't however receive calls or texts.

When I put the Tello sim card in my phone, I can receive calls and texts sent to the number i requested to move to LIFE.

Using my landline I called my number:
While LIFE mobile sim is in: Goes to voicemail
While Tello mobile sim is in: Rings

It's as if it's half ported over. Tello are telling me my number has transferred over and my account is closed and my sim card isn't active on their network......and LIFE have spent 2weeks looking into it. Each time I contact them, I have to wait 5days for a reply! I've kept my Tello sim in for pretty much since I requested to port my number over as it's the only way to receive calls/texts.

LIFE have told me I have to have 3 outgoing calls in the space of 24hrs so their operations team can track my account (or something), even though I told them outgoing texts and calls are fine! It's the incoming I'm not getting.

Can anyone help? I don't know what to do. I have 1 sim I can't have any outgoing stuff on. Another 1 where I can't have any incoming stuff on which I'm paying for and a number stuck on 2 sims. No one seems to have a clue what's going on.

[Aye Up]

The gaining provider has responsibility to handle the porting once the request has been made. In this case Life Mobile should be dealing with it on your behalf, its not the first time I have heard problems with number porting, I had a similar issue yet it resolved after 5 days.

Clearly for you something is a miss, get on the blower to the CEO of EE, clearly you are not getting the service you pay for.

marc.allera@ee.co.uk

You will likely get a reply within 24 hours.

[KIIS102]

Will do, thanks. It's so annoying that I been in this mess almost 3weeks now!. Suppose I'll have to stick my Tello sim back in if they're going to call me.

[Resonance]

I had exactly the same problem when I moved to Life from EE the other month. They called it a "split port". They managed to sort it after about a week though.

[randomelement]

I've having the same issue going from O2 to Voda. Although originally the number came from EE.
I'm receiving appalling customer support from Vodafone so I don't know what the situation is

[KIIS102]

Quote:

Originally Posted by randomelement

I've having the same issue going from O2 to Voda. Although originally the number came from EE.
I'm receiving appalling customer support from Vodafone so I don't know what the situation is

It's very frustrating isn't it. The network says they're 'looking into it' and to wait 5days for a reply. You wait 5days, call up and the response is basically "have you tried turning your phone on an off?". Then you reply saying you did everything, wait a further 5days and get a similar response.

You'd think it would be a simple case of changing some settings or something, don't need a full blown investigation into what's wrong.

I've emailed the EE boss advised a few hours ago so we'll see if I get a reply in the next day or so.

[Thine Wonk]

Why do people go to these no name little providers with very little in the way of customer support when things go wrong?

[Aye Up]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

Why do people go to these no name little providers with very little in the way of customer support when things go wrong?

Cost is a hugely influencing factor, for £5.95 a month, 1.5GB of Data, 1000 mins and 5000 texts where else are you going to get that?

[errea]

The porting will probably be handled by the host network anyway - Life is a EE owned.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

Why do people go to these no name little providers with very little in the way of customer support when things go wrong?

[d123]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

Why do people go to these no name little providers with very little in the way of customer support when things go wrong?

Why would you describe EE as a no name little provider?

[Lyceum]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

Why do people go to these no name little providers with very little in the way of customer support when things go wrong?

Life are owned and run by EE. In what way are EE a no name little provider?

[Gaz82]

It sounds to me like Tello haven't released your number yet which is why Life can't port it in.

If your account had been closed down as Tello are saying then your SIM would be inactive and you would get "No Service" when you put it in your phone.

Life can set your account to the correct outgoing number for calls and text as that's just a CLI presentation setting on their system but they cannot do anything for incoming calls/texts until the donor network has released the number.

[KIIS102]

Little update but nothing positive.

The EE CEO's dept tried calling me earlier (I had my Tello sim in so it rang), I was at work so they left me a voicemail. Got an alert on my phone saying 1 voicemail. Rang the Tello VM number, says no voicemails in inbox.

Put the LIFE mobile sim in, went to the VM and there was 2 voicemails left. EE had also sent an email, both basically saying they own LIFE but they can't do anything as it's all on LIFE's systems which they don't have access to and I need to get them to sort it.

I'm so annoyed at this point. I have to keep changing sim depending on what I need to do. I contacted Tello 2/3days ago, they done another investigation for about the 5th time in 3wks. Came back to me and said my number sucessfully ported to LIFE and my sim was now inactive, I asked them how I'm able to call their CS number from the Sim then and they can't explain it and told me that LIFE hasn't completely moved my number over.

LIFE are currently spending the next 3 possibly 5 (depending on if they finish before Friday) on yet another investigation into what's going on. At this point, I'm considering getting a PAYG sim card and porting out from LIFE and seeing if that works, can't be much worse at this point :\

To make things worse, I'm going on holiday to Asia in 2wks for half a month, so this may potentially drag on into mid/late September.

[Aye Up]

Quote:

Originally Posted by KIIS102

Little update but nothing positive.

The EE CEO's dept tried calling me earlier (I had my Tello sim in so it rang), I was at work so they left me a voicemail. Got an alert on my phone saying 1 voicemail. Rang the Tello VM number, says no voicemails in inbox.

Put the LIFE mobile sim in, went to the VM and there was 2 voicemails left. EE had also sent an email, both basically saying they own LIFE but they can't do anything as it's all on LIFE's systems which they don't have access to and I need to get them to sort it.

I'm so annoyed at this point. I have to keep changing sim depending on what I need to do. I contacted Tello 2/3days ago, they done another investigation for about the 5th time in 3wks. Came back to me and said my number sucessfully ported to LIFE and my sim was now inactive, I asked them how I'm able to call their CS number from the Sim then and they can't explain it and told me that LIFE hasn't completely moved my number over.

LIFE are currently spending the next 3 possibly 5 (depending on if they finish before Friday) on yet another investigation into what's going on. At this point, I'm considering getting a PAYG sim card and porting out from LIFE and seeing if that works, can't be much worse at this point :\

To make things worse, I'm going on holiday to Asia in 2wks for half a month, so this may potentially drag on into mid/late September.

Its been shit for you, that much is clear.

A porting should be simple, if you can send another email to the CEO and tell them to sort it, there is nothing you should be doing. Its all at their end quite frankly, you have done everything requested. I would also push for a refund on the service you have had. Life take 2 days to port a number, yours has went behond that, you are entitled to a refund.

YOU have done nothing wrong, only the networks have.

[Icaraa]

How long does a port usually take? I'm trying to go from Three to EE and it's taken 3 days so far.

[Thine Wonk]

Quote:

Originally Posted by errea

The porting will probably be handled by the host network anyway - Life is a EE owned.

Quote:

Originally Posted by d123

Why would you describe EE as a no name little provider?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lyceum

Life are owned and run by EE. In what way are EE a no name little provider?

Quote:

Originally Posted by KIIS102

EE had also sent an email, both basically saying they own LIFE but they can't do anything as it's all on LIFE's systems which they don't have access to and I need to get them to sort it.

Case in point, you buy cheap you get limited or basic service and you can't go to the host network and ask for premium support when it goes wrong.

Just because a network is owned by a parent group doesn't mean you get the service of the parent group. Try calling o2 about a giffgaff issue and see how far you get.

I'd always recommend spending an extra few pounds and going to a main network. For £5 a month the overheads are going to be trimmed to the bone and the support will be basic. Even if they did refund for 1 weeks lost service your only looking at £1.25.

Cost should be a factor, but just going for the very cheapest can lead to getting more basic support and a lower priority service on the host network.

[Analogue Alex]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

Case in point, you buy cheap you get limited or basic service and you can't go to the host network and ask for premium support when it goes wrong.

Just because a network is owned by a parent group doesn't mean you get the service of the parent group. Try calling o2 about a giffgaff issue and see how far you get.

I'd always recommend spending an extra few pounds and going to a main network. For £5 a month the overheads are going to be trimmed to the bone and the support will be basic. Even if they did refund for 1 weeks lost service your only looking at £1.25.

Cost should be a factor, but just going for the very cheapest can lead to getting more basic support and a lower priority service on the host network.

I went to a supposedly premium network, Vodafone, and had a similar port in problem (a "split port") - in fact I posted about it on here - in the end it took almost a week to resolve, despite getting the UK based customer relations team on the case. I'm afraid I didn't chase up Vodafone for a refund/compensation as life was very busy at the time.

(And I never thanked those who replied, in particular neilybealy who provided the number to call for the UK based team, who were helpful - certainly more helpful than the offshore, outsourced VF customer support - though they did suggest it would be fixed faster than it actually was.)

I think the underlying problem is that the UK has a daft, inefficient system for mobile number porting - we should have a central database, but instead we use "indirect routing" - see:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_number_portability#Technical_details

[moox]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

Cost should be a factor, but just going for the very cheapest can lead to getting more basic support and a lower priority service on the host network.

In no way is "please fix the port that you screwed up" a demand for "premium support". EE own the MVNO, EE supply the network, EE should fix it.

You expect the service to work, no matter how cheap it is.

[binary]

Quote:

Originally Posted by moox

In no way is "please fix the port that you screwed up" a demand for "premium support". EE own the MVNO, EE supply the network, EE should fix it.

You expect the service to work, no matter how cheap it is.

I haven't got a lot of time for Thine Wonk's arguments on this matter either I must say.

I can however kinda understand the reason for the response to the OP from the EE executive office - they are set up to deal with EE systems, and LIFE mobile, whilst owned by EE, runs on its own separate systems (similar to Talkmobile and Vodafone, the later own the former but it is a distinct operation).

The thing here is trying to make direct contact with someone who can help. I've had a quick search around and the best suggestion thus far is perhaps Fotis Karonis, who is the EE MD for "IT and Mobile", he seems the best option from the EE Leadership Team. I suspect that Nick Lane, MD of Customer Service, is just responsible for EE branded services.

The other possibility I suppose would be to contact the BT Chief Executive. However both these routes might just result in the problem being passed back to the EE executive office.

[moox]

Quote:

Originally Posted by binary

I haven't got a lot of time for Thine Wonk's arguments on this matter either I must say.

I can however kinda understand the reason for the response to the OP from the EE executive office - they are set up to deal with EE systems, and LIFE mobile, whilst owned by EE, runs on its own separate systems (similar to Talkmobile and Vodafone, the later own the former but it is a distinct operation).

The thing here is trying to make direct contact with someone who can help. I've had a quick search around and the best suggestion thus far is perhaps Fotis Karonis, who is the EE MD for "IT and Mobile", he seems the best option from the EE Leadership Team. I suspect that Nick Lane, MD of Customer Service, is just responsible for EE branded services.

The other possibility I suppose would be to contact the BT Chief Executive. However both these routes might just result in the problem being passed back to the EE executive office.

But the EE exec office could (or should) know who to contact to get things moving - a complaint from on high carries far more weight than a complaint from you or I. They can't just shirk responsibility because of some "computer says no" bs.

My understanding of MVNOs is that the level of separation could be anything from slightly different tariffs on the same platform (Sainsbury's Mobile appeared to be a reskinned/cheaper Vodafone PAYG) to operating a separate core network. I don't know where Life Mobile falls on the spectrum.

[Aye Up]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

Case in point, you buy cheap you get limited or basic service and you can't go to the host network and ask for premium support when it goes wrong.

Just because a network is owned by a parent group doesn't mean you get the service of the parent group. Try calling o2 about a giffgaff issue and see how far you get.

I'd always recommend spending an extra few pounds and going to a main network. For £5 a month the overheads are going to be trimmed to the bone and the support will be basic. Even if they did refund for 1 weeks lost service your only looking at £1.25.

Cost should be a factor, but just going for the very cheapest can lead to getting more basic support and a lower priority service on the host network.

Thats rather odd, there is a network where many people are paying premium prices, yet not getting premium services. Slow rollout of 4G, VoLTE that doesn't even work properply. 3G services becoming incredibly congested, not having as large a footprint of the other 3.

Which completely contradicts what you have just said, Life Mobile gives me signal and service virtually everywhere, visiting towns and villages in Yorkshire or Lancashire on this other network doesn't.

For once it isn't a case of pay peanuts get monkeys.

[Aye Up]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Analogue Alex

I think the underlying problem is that the UK has a daft, inefficient system for mobile number porting - we should have a central database, but instead we use "indirect routing" - see:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_number_portability#Technical_details

There was a proposal in about 2008/9 where Ofcom wanted to move all numbers to central database like you mention. For one reason or another it didn't happen, apparently the networks felt it didn't allow them the chance to save customers from leaving amongst other things.

Porting done in the way you say often means if the original issuing network goes down, so do the calls and texts being rerouted to your phone. This rarely happens, however from a technical standpoint the original network sort of still controls the number.

A move to a central database would avoid that happening of course.

[Thine Wonk]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aye Up

Thats rather odd, there is a network where many people are paying premium prices, yet not getting premium services. Slow rollout of 4G, VoLTE that doesn't even work properply. 3G services becoming incredibly congested, not having as large a footprint of the other 3.

Which completely contradicts what you have just said, Life Mobile gives me signal and service virtually everywhere, visiting towns and villages in Yorkshire or Lancashire on this other network doesn't.

For once it isn't a case of pay peanuts get monkeys.

Why do you troll by turning every thread (even if it has zero to do with Three) about Three and then start the same broken record rants.

[Thine Wonk]

Quote:

Originally Posted by moox

In no way is "please fix the port that you screwed up" a demand for "premium support". EE own the MVNO, EE supply the network, EE should fix it.

You expect the service to work, no matter how cheap it is.

Your contract as a customer (even PAYG) is with the company which you took it out under, it is their legal duty to provide services within the contract and each party is bound by it.

When the OP took out his contract (or PAYG), it was with Life Mobile that he entered into the agreement with. Life Mobile are a company that were part of Phones4u and went into liquidation and EE bought the Life Mobile company, but it is still a different company, different brand etc. There is an MVNO agreement and ownership of shares by the parent, but the OP's service agreement is with Life.

It's the same with Giffgaff, although fully owned by Telefonica (as is O2), trying to complain to O2 will get you nowhere. The same if you had a problem with Seat and try complaining to VW, or you have a problem with VW and try complaining to Audi.

EE's executive office have told him they won't help, which is proving my point. You can't take out a contract for £5 a month on a very budget MVNO and then expect EE to step in when there are issues, part of EE's pricing includes the premium support.

Whilst split ports can happen, you just have to wait for them to be resolved, and as somebody said earlier it could happen with any network. This still doesn't give the OP the right to transfer the complaint / issue over to EE's head office. In general you get what you pay for and cut to the bone MVNOs are likely to have lower service levels and may take longer to escalate issues up to the host network.

It is common for reseller networks to have a partner portal or to have their own systems which connect to EE's API to process order related requests, life will now likely have to speak to EE and act as a go between, you can't skip life and go directly to EE as the authorisation for validating a customer could be in a different system, and it's also not the way the processes are designed to work.

[moox]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

Your contract as a customer (even PAYG) is with the company which you took it out under, it is their legal duty to provide services within the contract and each party is bound by it.

When the OP took out his contract (or PAYG), it was with Life Mobile that he entered into the agreement with. Life Mobile are a company that were part of Phones4u and went into liquidation and EE bought the Life Mobile company, but it is still a different company, different brand etc. There is an MVNO agreement and ownership of shares by the parent, but the OP's service agreement is with Life.

You're arguing against something I'm not.

I know that it's a separate company, but when you fully own the subsidiary, you control it. Obviously EE's exec team can't press a few keys and bring up an account, but they will (or should) know the exact person within Life mobile to send the complaint to, or perhaps they can send it to the network team since it's a network fault. They'd probably do the latter if it was a pure EE account.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

YIt's the same with Giffgaff, although fully owned by Telefonica (as is O2), trying to complain to O2 will get you nowhere. The same if you had a problem with Seat and try complaining to VW, or you have a problem with VW and try complaining to Audi.

EE's executive office have told him they won't help, which is proving my point. You can't take out a contract for £5 a month on a very budget MVNO and then expect EE to step in when there are issues, part of EE's pricing includes the premium support.

I would expect VW (as in the corporate parent, not "Volkswagen Cars") to help, actually. They own Seat and Audi and they're still responsible for their activities.

If I emailed Telefonica O2 UK Ltd I would expect a similar response. If I emailed "O2", maybe not.

A better example is BT. I can email the BT CEO and get results. e.g. I have a problem with my BT Retail account, which is in the Consumer business unit and has its own CEO. I don't get told "well actually that's one of our subsidiaries, so you'll have to talk to them". It automatically gets passed onto someone who can help.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

Whilst split ports can happen, you just have to wait for them to be resolved, and as somebody said earlier it could happen with any network. This still doesn't give the OP the right to transfer the complaint / issue over to EE's head office. In general you get what you pay for and cut to the bone MVNOs are likely to have lower service levels and may take longer to escalate issues up to the host network and resolve.

3 weeks is simply unacceptable no matter how much or how little you pay. When you aren't getting anywhere with the subsidiary, you take it to the top - who also happens to supply the technical side too (and will have someone who can resolve the issue)

I am not buying your "premium support" bollox. Like I said, expecting a successful number port is basic stuff, and the price you pay is simply not relevant here.