Lots of villains in that line-up, I notice. But it's not like Diggle's child is the only issue with the show. Plot issues, repetitive villains, fauxmances and the superhero-fication of anyone they don't know what else to do with aside, the central problem is the way Barry is being portrayed. They have just made him an increasingly difficult character to like, because there's such a huge disconnect between his actions and how the show wants him to be perceived.


Agree. After season 1, I was really looking forward to season 2, but the way it turned out, it's just become a chore to watch. There are definitely good little moments here and there, but they somehow always end up being undermined in the most disappointing way possible.


Yep, I started mentioning this early last season, that it seems like every scene is written in complete isolation. Characters' motivations, even the plot itself, just arbitrarily change to service whatever the writers need for any given scene. Nothing is earned, they just do things, expecting people to love it, because it's "light and fun".

Big time! Tom Cavanagh has consistently been one of the best things on The Flash and I'm so glad he's now back on the scene.
Otherwise I didn't think it was as good an episode as the first two have been. While I get where they're going with with Alchemy, the powers, Magenta didn't really work as the big bad villain.

She would have been better as a side story which they could have used to give Jessie her first super hero outing like they did but have something else for Barry to concentrate on.
They never really properly explained how her powers were working so she came across as a second rate Scarlet Witch unfortunately. In the comics she much more of a magnetic Magneto type and she was an old friend/girlfriend of Wally West.
That's not to say that the actress wasn't good enough, I think she did do well to show the split personality without resorting to too much cliche.
Cisco's "meh" at her villain name was amusing though.

I'm still hoping they're making Tom Felton a red herring, it would be just seriously boringly obvious if he turns out to be Doctor Alchemy.

It was pretty much a textbook filler episode but it still did advance plenty of background plots so, for that alone, it did work within the show's narrative. Wally and Jessie's conversation, the dreams element, it's all building up to a Doctor Alchemy/Wally confrontation I bet.

Re missing baby Sara - so what, did anyone moan when they gave Diggle a son on LoT and made him the new Green Arrow? Where were the people complaining The Flash's Diggle didn't know he had a grown up son some time in the future?

They're alternative timelines, anything can happen, nothing is set in stone, it's a method for the story tellers to give different experiences for all four Arrowever shows until the point at which they choose to restore the timeline back to the point it was left at the end of Season Two before Barry went back to save his mum, because we all know that's eventually going to happen when the Flashpoint timeline ends.

And, on another note, very happy about this:

FINALLY SOME JOY

That was a great episode, least of all because it was just happy and funny and cute and not filled with the endless angst that's plagued the last season and a bit...

I find myself in agreement with Karis here, a bit more of a lighter tone, with plenty more laughter and some advancements with whatever is going on with Caitlyn. Shame we've lost Jessie (especially as she seemingly still has a lot to learn; it took Eobard/Wells a whole season to bring Barry up to speed).

I'm sceptical of this new Wells too (loved that scene mind; Tom is undoubtedly very talented) but I can't quite fathom why a person would come from one Earth to another one to help a team without some agenda of their own. Either this new Wells is escaping something, or he plans to use something from Earth 1 for his benefit. I will miss Earth 2 Wells though, and I'd still like an explanation for the (lack of) appearance from Earth 1 Wells (who shouldn't be dead).

The flash does its version of the weeping angels but couldn't the guy just move a mirror out of the way.

No, because Barry is fast enough to intercept him.

YAY!!!


You see now you've ruined it. I don't think I can take a THIRD season of Wells being up to something. Sigh. Give us a pool of established characters and stop screwing with them.

This was the first episode in a season and a bit that I've properly liked - I hope it continues.

Sorry!!

If there's one thing we've learnt from Flash though, it's that they like to recycle the obvious plots. There was no practical reason that Earth 2 Wells and Jessie couldn't stick around permanently; Wells for the team and Cisco, and Jessie for the team and Wally. Instead they had to get back to Earth 2.

In Jessie's case, they obviously can't have too many speedsters running around on Flash. It's a given that Wally will become one in the future (does that mean he'd finish early with Jessie) so that'll be two. To have Jessie as a permanent member of the team too, would likely be overkill. I think two (permanent) ones will be enough.

Jessie and Jay will no doubt make appearances throughout the season when a threat gets too much for Barry alone (or maybe even when they need help from Barry). It's obvious now that they can open up portals at will, so that'll explain Kara's inclusion; I figure she'll be brought in cause (rumour has it) they're battling actual aliens in the crossover, so Barry will probably figure who best to help defeat evil aliens than an alien herself.

Hopefully Crisis will happen at some point though, then we'll get Kara (and Clarke) on the same planet (along with the DEO and whoever else) in addition to (presumably) a brand new Wells. ... the only problem here is, as stated before, they're going to have to erase a lot of people from existence (all the populations of those other Earth's) so who gets to stay, and who doesn't will be an interesting question - if they ever fully go through with the merge.

How does Jesse Quick's mask stay on ?

Speedsters have sticky skin.

The same way her hair doesn't blow around at super speeds.

The way the team were talking about Wells in the latest episode it sounds like they all remember evil Season 1 Wells so I think we'll have to just accept that the events of Season 1 played out like we saw them.

So even though the current version of Thawne didn't disguise himself as Wells for years that history has still happened, making Season 1 Wells a Time remnant I guess.

STAR Labs developed a high-intensity hairband for her to wear.


That's one conclusive way of looking at it, though it would have been nice if it was actually addressed, if for no other reason than to put our minds at ease. They don't have to explain how, but maybe next time Thawne shows up (he will) Cisco can say something along the lines of "wait, didn't he die" and then Barry can chirp in and make the claim that the one who died was indeed a convenient time remnant.

It does put something out of perspective though, regarding time remnants; you can never truly kill a speedster if they've got time remnants dotted about all over the place. If Thawne can convince (himself?) to die for his cause time and time again, then there's simply never going to be any stopping him. Same applies to Barry, and any other speedster. If they're going up against such odds, they can essentially just fake their death each and every time so the villain (at least those who have a vendetta against (a) Flash) think they've won and go away.

I know that throughout most of the series you just have to ignore this, but so many times this episode, the speedsters stopped a few feet/meters away from the "baddie" and gave them time to use their ability. So many fights could be over before they start...but then it wouldn't be entertaining.

Haven't they already said Kara's Earth won't merge with all the others? I'm fairly sure I've read that somewhere so whatever number she's on will remain independent. There'll be some trick or twist for why it doesn't happen and she stays away from Earth-One (Terra Prime!).

I loved new Harrison Wells, Tom Cavanagh is such an amazingly talented actor, this is now the fourth incarnation of the same character (although original Earth One Harry didn't last very long sadly) and each one has been noticeably different. If you throw in the three other cameo Wells' that's seven different versions!

The whole episode was a delight, from Sam Scudder's Mirror Master and the re-appearance of Leonard Snart, albeit in a holographic format, brought the show right back to Season One and the important message that a lot of criminals are just criminals because they want loads of money not necessarily to take over the world

Old school crime, Silver Age comics feel, The Flash was really back on top form this week and the humour was pitched just right throughout. The chemistry between Grant and Jessie is brilliant, Candice's Iris didn't feel squashed in, just a natural extension of the three of them's relationship.

And once again huge props to Grant Gustin, he really is perfect as this true comic book interpretation of The Flash when he's not mithered in a pile of angst or unnecessary drama. I can't help contrast his portrayal of Barry with his role as Sebastian on Glee and how radically different they were.

Loved all the Easter Eggs, Den of Geek has a nice list of them for those interested but the Terra Prime was the best one as our Earth i.e. the one where we read about the comic book characters, is Terra Prime in the original DC Multiverse. Barry's Earth is Earth-Prime.

And the Broome warehouse where we saw the new Rogues at the beginning. John Broome co-created both Mirror Master and The Top and Captain Cold Another brilliant tribute to the original comic creators.

Do you believe everything they say? They've got to leave a few surprises. Regardless, I think the statement from them is that they aren't going to merge the worlds for the crossover. If the Crisis Event does happen, it'll likely either be the result of the invasion, or some other cause will make it happen. With all four shows on the same network, there's no way they're going to keep them (the Earth's) separate for long.

I do also wonder, but does Daxam(?) and Krypton exist from Earth 1's perspective?


Four? Wells #1 (killed by Eobard), Wells #2 (from Earth 2) and now this new one. Where did you get four from?

Edit: Unless you're including Imposter Wells (Thawne) in your numbering, I guess that makes sense.

Yes

1 Original Wells, didn't see much of him, murdered by Thawne
2 Imposter Wells
3 Earth-2 Wells
4 Hipster Wells

And yes, I do think they'll keep Supergirl's Earth separate from Barry's otherwise then they really are removing any element of why do all the heroes just stick to their own cities instead of pitching in when they have two virtually indestructible people in Kara and Clark to help out.

I think the twist will be they are all suspicious of (Earth 19) Wells but he is just what he says he is a good guy who just wants to help.

Maybe his Earth was overtook by evil metas and he just doesn't want it to happen to Earth 1.

That argument would hold more weight if they didn't already have heroes (Flash) that were capable of intercepting every villain on the planet.


It's possible he just wanted to escape Earth 1, but the general theme with (a) Wells is that there's a reason to their being, and it's usually somewhat personal. The first (or second) carnation was an Imposter, the next helped out (initially) to help his daughter, this latest incarnation will have a reason for his extended hand, believe me. It's not a theme I dislike for the record, I'm just stating the observation.

I wonder if we'll ever see any Earth 19 Heroes and/or Villains.

The Flash isn't indestructible though, he can be killed. It's pretty impossible - crap recent film nonwithstanding - to kill the Supers.

In theory just 1 Kryptonite Bullet could kill Superman.


But it is hard to kill Flash as death (Grim Reaper) is to slow to catch him in the comics when any Flash has "died" it always turned out they went into The Speed Force rather than actully die.

A recent film starring superman? Getting killed? I'm not sure what you're talking about.
You'll be telling us they made a 4th Indiana Jones movie next hahaha
This place!

I think if they did Doomsday and he didn't kill Superman it would be worse.


But that said Doomsday should have been done a lot better and waited for another film maybe JLA (As many know in the comic Doomsday beat the whole JLA expect Superman quite literally with one arm tied behind his back)

re-kryptonite, yes of course they can but it's already locked away and not in general circulation and the Supes know to prepare for it.

Re The Flash, I know, but these aren't really the comics, they're inspired by them sure, but they've already had this Barry almost dead multiple times and pretty much dead at least once.


Quite

(Although don't shoot me, I quite liked Indy 4 in a sort of "oh my lawd did they really go there" kind of way).

How scary was that hand on the desk scene with Caitlin and her mummy in her office?!
We haven't seen a dark side to her before, so that definitely took me by surprise.

I love the new HR, Harry. He's a total fraud but I think he's amazingly well acted out by Tom C that I just can't be mad.