|
||||||||
The Flash Season Three (US Pace spoilers tagged) |
![]() |
|
|
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
|
|
#176 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Gloucestershire, England
Posts: 4,798
|
I am somewhat glad that I'm not the only person left underwhelmed by the crossover episode (yeah, just the one) thus far. Barry travels to Earth 38 (was that it?) to enlist the help of an actual alien to fight ... aliens. At no point did Kara consider that John might be a better candidate? Surely he knows a bit more about other aliens than she does, and he's (arguably) more powerful than Kara. I get also that there's financing and all that, but it's like Flash focused on the Flash characters with some of the Arrow & Legends cast, Arrow will focus on the Arrow characters (what's the bet we don't see Wally, Joe, Wells or Iris?) and Legends will focus on the Legends (so we probably wont see the missing Arrow characters that were vacant on Flash). I am stupidly hopeful that there's a complete timeline merge at some point, bringing all the Earth's together (maybe this is what happens that leads Barry to create and send that message in the first place?) but we could have easily had John Jones, Superman, Wild Dog, Ragman, a suited up Wally West, Jay Garrick, Jessie Quick and everyone else on board for this. It could have been a truly epic FOUR way crossover, instead it's a mediocre three way crossover. Quote:
Spoiler
Quote:
Meh. I was left decidedly uninspired. All I could think was
Spoiler
Quote:
By the way I did fast forward so might have missed a mention; where is Superman?
Quote:
Supergirl was adorable and was generally handled great but that fight between her and The Flash could have been a lot better than "Catch Me If You Can".
Quote:
Why the hell was everyone so pissed at Barry?! The only person who has a right to complain to Barry about his time meddling is Caitlyn, who - ironically - was one of 6 people NOT giving Barry hell. Why is Cisco still such a prick about it? And why did Dig get so annoyed when he still has a son? And the Legends? What the hell was their reasoning?
Quote:
And ironically, it didn't seem to pay off, as Diggle, Canaray and Speedy still couldn't hit Oliver running in a straight line with Wally on his back. And then they were nice enough to stop shooting when they actually got within range.
So is this two crossovers in a row, where Oliver and Diggle would have been killed by one of their villains, if Wally hadn't raced in and pulled them out? I guess that guy had better aim than Diggle, Canary and Speedy. Maybe they should have recruited him. Quote:
Speaking of Wally, not that I in any way want to see more of him, but I don't quite follow the logic that he isn't ready, yet nobody has any issues with Barry, the dumbest man alive, constantly making a mess of things, when pretending to be a hero.
Quote:
Although they have made some improvements in season 2, if you thought season 1 was too awful to even watch, I doubt it's enough to really win you over.
Quote:
As for Supergirl, I'm not sure as I don't watch it, but I've heard the general consensus is that it's gotten much better since it moved to the CW for Season 2, I may have to check it out now as I thought she was one of the few bright spots of this crossover episode.
|
|
|
|
|
Please sign in or register to remove this advertisement.
|
|
|
#177 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Kingston Upon Thames
Posts: 1,863
|
Quote:
I got Sara, cause she's got that vendetta against Darhk, and she's been told no. I was surprised at Ray though.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#178 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Gloucestershire, England
Posts: 4,798
|
Quote:
No way, even Sara didn't deserve to have that rant at him when she has to basically be physically restrained by the rest of the team every time she even sees Darhk. And in fact, last time Darhk appeared didn't she even go so far as to tell him his future just for the sake of gloating? Yeah THAT wouldn't have any consequences on the timeline I'm sure.
It was odd/interesting too how much of a minor role she played in this episode. I know it was a Flash episode, but it was almost as though Sara (and the whole of the Legends team for that matter) were extras; they weren't even supporting cast really, that was more Leila, Diggle and Stein. |
|
|
|
|
|
#179 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Kingston Upon Thames
Posts: 1,863
|
Quote:
My point here is that Sara, like Barry, has lost a loved one that was killed by someone they'd met, and had the chance to stop. Sara telling Darhk that he's one day going to die wasn't exactly a spoiler; she never told him when, where or how.
It was odd/interesting too how much of a minor role she played in this episode. I know it was a Flash episode, but it was almost as though Sara (and the whole of the Legends team for that matter) were extras; they weren't even supporting cast really, that was more Leila, Diggle and Stein. But yeah, honestly the Legends showing up had only one purpose: Cisco finding that recording of Future Barry to cause a rift in the team. If it wasn't for that little plot point (the worst part of the episode by a good margin), the rest of the Legends' scenes like Stein meeting his daughter, really could have just featured on a normal Legends episode. |
|
|
|
|
|
#180 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Gloucestershire, England
Posts: 4,798
|
Quote:
But yeah, honestly the Legends showing up had only one purpose: Cisco finding that recording of Future Barry to cause a rift in the team. If it wasn't for that little plot point (the worst part of the episode by a good margin), the rest of the Legends' scenes like Stein meeting his daughter, really could have just featured on a normal Legends episode.
That scene with Stein annoyed me too. His concern was that Clarissa had been replaced by another woman, right? Well, last I checked, Caitlyn wasn't protected from timeline changes, so why didn't Stein just ask her (or anyone else for that matter) "what is the name of my wife again?" and see what she answers, at least then Stein would have not been walking home blind. |
|
|
|
|
|
#181 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Kingston Upon Thames
Posts: 1,863
|
Quote:
Well, I guess we should actually be thankful to Cisco. If he hadn't caused that rift, Ollie and Barry would have been under mind control too, then there would have been no hope for the team, apart from maybe those two left on the ship.
That scene with Stein annoyed me too. His concern was that Clarissa had been replaced by another woman, right? Well, last I checked, Caitlyn wasn't protected from timeline changes, so why didn't Stein just ask her (or anyone else for that matter) "what is the name of my wife again?" and see what she answers, at least then Stein would have not been walking home blind. Its a shame that Stein scene was so poorly handled, why did they feel the need to cram that in there? It was so glossed over they really should have saved it for LOT so they could explore it in more detail |
|
|
|
|
|
#182 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 37,002
|
Quote:
Well, I guess we should actually be thankful to Cisco. If he hadn't caused that rift, Ollie and Barry would have been under mind control too, then there would have been no hope for the team, apart from maybe those two left on the ship.
That scene with Stein annoyed me too. His concern was that Clarissa had been replaced by another woman, right? Well, last I checked, Caitlyn wasn't protected from timeline changes, so why didn't Stein just ask her (or anyone else for that matter) "what is the name of my wife again?" and see what she answers, at least then Stein would have not been walking home blind. |
|
|
|
|
|
#183 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Gloucestershire, England
Posts: 4,798
|
Quote:
Yeah but if Barry and Oliver were put under mind control then we could have had Wally, Captain Steel and Vixen save the day and that... could have been fun?? I still completely hate the direction they're taking Cisco in now, I feel like he's being set up to be the one that leaves and becomes a villain; like Killer Frost but Caitlyn's arc is just a fake-out.
Quote:
I took it not as his wife had changed but he thought he was having or had an affair at some point.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#184 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Scotland
Posts: 4,059
|
I think if you had Ollie and Barry there the outcome wouldn't have been the same.
For starters I doubt Ollie would have had them walking into and unknown Alien HQ in one big welcoming committee that screams "attack us. Easy targets here" They'd have been split up and covering different areas and so wouldn't have all got hit with th mind control doodah. |
|
|
|
|
#185 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Gloucestershire, England
Posts: 4,798
|
Quote:
For starters I doubt Ollie would have had them walking into and unknown Alien HQ in one big welcoming committee that screams "attack us. Easy targets here". They'd have been split up and covering different areas and so wouldn't have all got hit with th mind control doodah.
Speaking of speed, that's another thing that's irritated me (at the moment; it may be brought up later), but the Legends team know that they're got a Speedster causing trouble in history, and they know he's not a friendly one. Did none of them think to speak to Barry about this? Maybe even enlist his assistance? I know they can't suddenly bring Barry into the Legends show, but would it have hurt them to at least give a reason, or explanation for that? |
|
|
|
|
|
#186 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 37,002
|
Quote:
Depends on the radius of the mind control wave? Then again, I suppose it's possible Barry is fast enough to have got everyone out of the proximity.
Speaking of speed, that's another thing that's irritated me (at the moment; it may be brought up later), but the Legends team know that they're got a Speedster causing trouble in history, and they know he's not a friendly one. Did none of them think to speak to Barry about this? Maybe even enlist his assistance? I know they can't suddenly bring Barry into the Legends show, but would it have hurt them to at least give a reason, or explanation for that? There are rumours he may join the JSA as in the comics he is a founder member. |
|
|
|
|
|
#187 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Gloucestershire, England
Posts: 4,798
|
Quote:
I've got a feeling Jay may join The Legends to take down Thawne.
There are rumours he may join the JSA as in the comics he is a founder member. |
|
|
|
|
|
#188 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 37,002
|
Quote:
That would be cool and all, but hasn't he got his own Earth to worry about? Besides, if anyone is likely to take down Thawne (for good, which has proven difficult) it would (should) be Barry.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#189 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Gloucestershire, England
Posts: 4,798
|
Quote:
TBF with time travel he can go back to Earth 3 minutes after he left even if from his POV he was gone years.
![]() If they're going to have Jay join the JSA, I'd rather wait until Crisis happens, and do it that way.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#190 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 37,002
|
Quote:
Considering his speech to Barry about time travel, he'd be a bit of a hypocrite.
![]() If they're going to have Jay join the JSA, I'd rather wait until Crisis happens, and do it that way. ![]() And while going against the LOD he would be just putting the timeline back to how it should be. Jay is in next week's episode
Spoiler
|
|
|
|
|
|
#191 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: In sunny (hah!) Yorkshire
Posts: 13,940
|
Quote:
Hmm, guess all I can really say without going into spoilers is that I very much enjoyed the crossover episode.
![]() Nothing counts as spoilers once the episode has aired
|
|
|
|
|
#192 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,299
|
Quote:
I am somewhat glad that I'm not the only person left underwhelmed by the crossover episode (yeah, just the one) thus far.
The Arrow night left me cold and the rest was a bit of a wet fish. And Supergirl was barely in it! |
|
|
|
|
|
#193 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 151
|
Quote:
Absolutely bloody loved it! So many individually good buts but the team up bit from the promo was great, as were the mind control fight scenes and the CGI was pretty impressive too.
Nothing counts as spoilers once the episode has aired ![]() If so maybe next year they could all go to Supergirl's Earth this time & maybe the Big Bad can be these guys https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_...ate_of_America That way Flash, Arrow & Supergirl could get to play evil versions of themselves |
|
|
|
|
|
#194 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: In sunny (hah!) Yorkshire
Posts: 13,940
|
Quote:
So will the crossover be an annual thing then?
If so maybe next year they could all go to Supergirl's Earth this time & maybe the Big Bad can be these guys https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_...ate_of_America That way Flash, Arrow & Supergirl could get to play evil versions of themselves There's a The Flash/Supergirl musical crossover in the second half of the season.
|
|
|
|
|
#195 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Gloucestershire, England
Posts: 4,798
|
Not a bad mid-season final that one, considering some of the episodes thus far this season have left much to be desired. Presumably the idea of tossing Savitar into the speedforce isn't going to have the desired effect either. It also seems that Future Barry is incapable of not pissing off future speedsters; firstly Eobard, and now Savitar?
![]() Curious too, but in the current timeline, Iris is going to die. That (presumably) means no Bart Allen? Obviously this won't quite come to pass, because time travel shenanigans. Glad we've finally got Kid Flash on the team, though obviously he's got a lot to learn. How much faster is he compared to Barry in the comics? If Savitar feels that Barry is fast enough to challenge him, and Wally appears to be catching up, then surely Wally also poses a threat to Savitar too? Will further be interesting to see where they go with Julian here too. Is he done being Alchemy? I can't imagine he'll just fall back to being a background character, so I figure he'll either get powers, or he'll somehow go full evil. There's got to be more to Garrick and what he knows about Savitar too... I wonder whether he's had some sort of interaction with him in the past (or future?) |
|
|
|
|
|
#196 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Gloucestershire, England
Posts: 4,798
|
Another thought; why would a Speedster (Savitar) need to eject blades from his arms to kill people when he is capable of vibrating into someone and killing them that way? What possible reason do ejected blades serve to a speedster? Still not getting the suit either; it's implied (if not stated directly) that Savitar is/was a person, yet the suit really does imply otherwise. It's too mechanical, and whilst humanoid, doesn't quite look like a human would be within.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#197 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Kingston Upon Thames
Posts: 1,863
|
Decent episode I suppose.
- I liked that they brought Tom Felton into the Flash Team despite knowing he's Alchemy, that felt like a nice plot point. - That CGI scene where Savitar is running around with Jay and throwing him about was hot garbage. - I really, really grow weary of Wally, Joe and Iris' constant back-and-forth flip flopping emotions so it was nice that Wells seems to have put a stop to that once and for all by convincing Joe to let Wally do his thing. - THANK GOD we're no longer in "Cisco With A Grudge" territory... for now...? - Seeing the 90s' Flash and Trickster share the same scene even if only for a minute was a great touch. - Iris' death much like Laurel's in Arrow seems to have been dropped early and. in much the same way as Laurel's. I imagine won't be prevented. - So according to Savitar one member of Team Flash dies (Iris?), one member of Team Flash betrays the rest of the team (either Tom Felton, Cisco or an unwitting Wells), and one member of Team Flash suffers a fate worse than death (Barry, and I think because...) - Conspiracy Theory time; Future Barry = Savitar. I think this because: a) Savitar knows EVERYTHING about the team, including the fact that Wells is "fake" (not from their Earth) but Savitar isn't some all seeing all knowing entity so surely he'd have had to have experienced these events before from another perspective. b) Barry is constantly pushing himself to get faster and faster so surely it'd stand to reason that in the future he'd be so fast it'd seem like he could teleport; just like Savitar. c) In Legends of Tomorrow, Stein and Jax discover a tape recording from Barry saying that Barry altered the timeline and as such they couldn't trust anyone; not even Barry himself. d) Why would Alchemy and Savitar have any cause to be involved in any of this? Savitar isn't Zoom or Reverse Flash, he's not out to take Barry's speed. So why get Alchemy to try and recreate Flashpoint? e) Barry would need a motivation to become Savitar of course but if Iris really does die as a direct result of him meddling with the timeline then that probably pushes him over the edge with grief. f) The Flash comic Out of Time basically covers all of these plot points as Future Flash travels back in time to kill his past self in order to restore the speed force, so perhaps this season is a loose adaptation of that. g) The suit. The suit is HIGHLY mechanical which would obviously hint at future equipment, but even then, it still seems like the kind of thing that only someone that had access to Star Labs would be able to create... |
|
|
|
|
|
#198 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Gloucestershire, England
Posts: 4,798
|
Quote:
Iris' death much like Laurel's in Arrow seems to have been dropped early and. in much the same way as Laurel's. I imagine won't be prevented.
Quote:
So according to Savitar one member of Team Flash dies (Iris?), one member of Team Flash betrays the rest of the team (either Tom Felton, Cisco or an unwitting Wells), and one member of Team Flash suffers a fate worse than death (Barry, and I think because...)
Iris being the one to die is a given, but she'll be restored. Cisco will (likely) be the one to betray the team, likely for the return of his brother. I was going to say Caitlyn, but that's already been teased too much, and is too obvious. Then again, Alchemy was too obvious too, and we know how that turned out! ![]() Barry, as stated, will be the one to suffer said fate; cause he'll have to live without Iris. Quote:
a) Savitar knows EVERYTHING about the team, including the fact that Wells is "fake" (not from their Earth) but Savitar isn't some all seeing all knowing entity so surely he'd have had to have experienced these events before from another perspective.
Quote:
b) Barry is constantly pushing himself to get faster and faster so surely it'd stand to reason that in the future he'd be so fast it'd seem like he could teleport; just like Savitar.
Quote:
c) In Legends of Tomorrow, Stein and Jax discover a tape recording from Barry saying that Barry altered the timeline and as such they couldn't trust anyone; not even Barry himself.
Quote:
d) Why would Alchemy and Savitar have any cause to be involved in any of this? Savitar isn't Zoom or Reverse Flash, he's not out to take Barry's speed. So why get Alchemy to try and recreate Flashpoint?
Quote:
g) The suit. The suit is HIGHLY mechanical which would obviously hint at future equipment, but even then, it still seems like the kind of thing that only someone that had access to Star Labs would be able to create...
Also, somewhat unrelated, but Barry stated he's never travelled into the future before; only that he's gone into the past, and back to the present (back to the future?) why can't he just push on a little further? What's stopping Barry running into the future to see what goes wrong? Heck, why can't he just hop on the Wave Rider and catch a ride? |
|
|
|
|
|
#199 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 151
|
Quote:
Decent episode I suppose.
- I liked that they brought Tom Felton into the Flash Team despite knowing he's Alchemy, that felt like a nice plot point. - That CGI scene where Savitar is running around with Jay and throwing him about was hot garbage. - I really, really grow weary of Wally, Joe and Iris' constant back-and-forth flip flopping emotions so it was nice that Wells seems to have put a stop to that once and for all by convincing Joe to let Wally do his thing. - THANK GOD we're no longer in "Cisco With A Grudge" territory... for now...? - Seeing the 90s' Flash and Trickster share the same scene even if only for a minute was a great touch. - Iris' death much like Laurel's in Arrow seems to have been dropped early and. in much the same way as Laurel's. I imagine won't be prevented. - So according to Savitar one member of Team Flash dies (Iris?), one member of Team Flash betrays the rest of the team (either Tom Felton, Cisco or an unwitting Wells), and one member of Team Flash suffers a fate worse than death (Barry, and I think because...) - Conspiracy Theory time; Future Barry = Savitar. I think this because: a) Savitar knows EVERYTHING about the team, including the fact that Wells is "fake" (not from their Earth) but Savitar isn't some all seeing all knowing entity so surely he'd have had to have experienced these events before from another perspective. b) Barry is constantly pushing himself to get faster and faster so surely it'd stand to reason that in the future he'd be so fast it'd seem like he could teleport; just like Savitar. c) In Legends of Tomorrow, Stein and Jax discover a tape recording from Barry saying that Barry altered the timeline and as such they couldn't trust anyone; not even Barry himself. d) Why would Alchemy and Savitar have any cause to be involved in any of this? Savitar isn't Zoom or Reverse Flash, he's not out to take Barry's speed. So why get Alchemy to try and recreate Flashpoint? e) Barry would need a motivation to become Savitar of course but if Iris really does die as a direct result of him meddling with the timeline then that probably pushes him over the edge with grief. f) The Flash comic Out of Time basically covers all of these plot points as Future Flash travels back in time to kill his past self in order to restore the speed force, so perhaps this season is a loose adaptation of that. g) The suit. The suit is HIGHLY mechanical which would obviously hint at future equipment, but even then, it still seems like the kind of thing that only someone that had access to Star Labs would be able to create... The conversation he had with them can also be interpreted 2 ways if you remove the comma's : "I am the future, Flash." - "I am the future Flash." "You did this to me. You trapped me in eternity, your future self, you did this to me, Barry." - "You did this to me. You trapped me in eternity your future self you did this to me Barry." |
|
|
|
|
|
#200 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Gloucestershire, England
Posts: 4,798
|
I think there's a lot of straw clutching here.....
Didn't some people speculate that Zoom was a version of Barry at some point too? Savitar will be Savitar, not Barry. Savitar is a character that exists in the comics, similarly to Flash, Kid Flash, Reverse Flash, Zoom (though his entire attire and backstory were changed(?)), Jay Garrick, the Rival and now Savitar. Edit: Speaking of the Rival, surely that's not the last we've seen of him? Seems incredibly lame if that's it; so much potential wasted, in addition to an awful suit. Savitar killed him because he (the Rival) failed to kill Barry, yet Barry only got the attention of Savitar because he was deemed worthy(?). I'm not quite understanding why Savitar would have allowed the Rival to make an attempt on Barry's life, when it is Savitar that wants to fight and defeat him. Seemingly a wasted character in the Rival if you ask me. |
|
|
|
![]() |
|
All times are GMT. The time now is 22:19.





