No actually, just folks like you, scared of their own shadow, you know the ones the corrupt establishment count on, the frightened little Sheep terrified of change.

You can look at 2 ways either the 45% of Scots who stood up to the British establishment started the trend that delivered Brexit and Trump, or the Scots were the only people to frightened to vote for change.

The Scottish Police Authority's budget includes a reform fund.

The fund provided support for VAT liability for three years.

That support ceased on 31st March 2016.

Fairly certain that's one of the first claims in the newspaper article you used to introduce this whole SNPban rant. The article which you wanted us to not bother reading other than the headline.

The point here is that Westminster are abusing their control of VAT to maintain a scenario where the greatest savings, and indeed loss to the exchequer, is the one they rather than devolved administration responsible for the decisions want made. That's a direct interference into a devolved matter.

The point is Holyrood did it with this knowledge to save money.

Or you could look at the independence question objectively and come up with a real plan to alleviate the real pain it would cost us economically.

Most sensible folk wouldn't vote for increased austerity and reduced services just to say look how free we are.

Independence has to be financially attractive to most of the people that you would need to vote for it, if not, who is going to vote to be less well off for a decade at least?

There are some really hard questions to be addressed on the independence issue, the NHS being one of them that no one likes to talk about but under independence I cannot envisage a universally free NHS for example.

I think you'll remember that 52% of the UK voted for that in June. Hopefully the sensible will vote to become independent from the rest of the UK in the next few years. It seems to have worked out pretty well for every other country that's become independent (although the USA seems to have lost its way recently).

It looks like the only person holding up the next referendum is.....Nicola Sturgeon! Why is she not pushing for it especially since she is so certain that is the best thing for Scotland. Scared it might go through perhaps ?

We are now learning that some senior SNP'ers actually voted for Brexit which was unexpected and many of the same will be pushing her towards announcing another Indyref date.

Im going to sit back and watch what happens for a while I think. Cracks are beginning to appear that's for sure. And I don't only mean in her makeup.

I think your simply putting your head in the sand and ignoring economic reality.

The sensible folk aren't the ones voting for more division, especially now that we see Brexit is so bad for Scotland.

It's not independence that's wrong, it's the plan to get there that is, that's what you Nationalists forget every time.

I've always found that insulting people is a way to win them over to your argument.... keep going.

What kind of plan would meet your approval? How would you like to see the Scottish Government approach the currency and the issue of the border etc?

Neither. The 55.6% who rejected independence were the silent majority who recognised they were being sold a dead parrot and took the sensible action at the ballot box.

The trouble the independence movement has in Scotland is that it has become a wholly leftwing crusade, and that makes the job of convincing more centre right leaning parts of Scotland to back independence all the harder. Policies like the council tax rebranding which penalises tax payers in Aberdeenshire and similar areas and sends what is meant to be local taxation to Glasgow only hardens opinion and its no surprise the Tories have been the biggest benefactors of hardening opinions. 21% Tory swings in the NE must be causing panic in SNP HQ as well as the house of certain MP from Strichen...

Well for starters a measured and practical plan that actually addresses some of the fundamental problems that the transition to Independence would bring.

Essentially it would mean a gradual transfer of powers together with a gradual reduction in Barnett and a realistic approach to revenue and spending that Scotland could afford.

This would have to involve some serious discussions about things like the NHS and it being universally free. An in depth look at how other similar sized countries approach these issues would be essential.

At present I just dont see the appetite to tackle any of these major issues before they arrive because they might not be vote winners.

I would say that its becoming a left wing cause but at the moment the SNP are talking left and mostly acting right.

I notice that this debate is also being had on some Independence Blogs with some debaters getting quite heated about left wing independence policies.

As mentioned in my post above, some serious questions surrounding affordability of Health and social care will need to be addressed concerning independence. We could not have the status quo that we have now and we certainly couldn't afford to increase these costs substantially without higher taxation. Something the SNP realise is a vote loser and from the increased Tory vote it seems has been happening in some areas.

Well as I am not Scottish I fear nothing my only thought is that with a dearth of political talent both in and leading the SNP independence with them in charge would be a disaster.

The Scottish paper on independence wasn't able to even tell Scots what currency they would have in their pocket and guess what two years later they still can't tell you!

These people are amateurs and out of their depth and rational Scots saw it for themselves and voted accordingly.

All the SNP have now is a leader who makes herself look even more foolish than Salmond did and does it on a near daily basis.

Talent like Cameron, Osborne, Boris the clown, Teresa May, Miliband, Balls, Corbyn, Murphy, Truss, those geniuses?

A gradual plan is sadly impossible because London wont allow it. How could we go about getting more powers.

Also there's nothing to suggest having a free nhs is unaffordable, or better than our current system which is still the best in the British Isles.

Believe me, a universally free NHS will have to be looked at very carefully. No other similar sized nation to Scotland has one. We spend 40% of our budget on it now and that doesnt include Social Care, Welfare etc.

Ireland

Not universal

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en..._services.html

Denmark

Universal with charges for prescriptions and some other services.

https://international.ucl.dk/files/2...are_system.pdf

Brexit gives us the opportunity to get more powers back from Europe and allocated to Scotland. If the FM concentrated on this aspect instead of constant adversarial-ism then perhaps we could get those devolved.

Despite not wanting Brexit, if its inevitable there are opportunities for Scotland there.

Don't think I ever accused politicians of being geniuses, no I'm sure I didn't, although you might say compared to Salmond and Sturgeon almost anyone is outstanding.

Two politicians who, it seems, constantly back the losing side, most recently slagging off the next president of the USA when they thought he was going to lose.

Sometimes, silence is the better bet in politics, playing to the gallery and your own noisy supporters is good fun but it can come back and bite you.

I seriously doubt, however, that Sturgeon is capable of holding her tongue even when that is the best option, politically.

Those last 2 words and little smilie show, your not here to be won over. Like Ruth Davidson who's position after Brexit was Scotland should at all costs remain in the single market even if it means retaining the free movement of people. Exactly what the SNP are fighting for, but where's Ruth now? as with people like you she's had her tune changed by headquarters.

Not interested in what's best for Scotland now but what's best for London and the UK Tory party. No autonomy whatsoever. Better together, but for who?

Professor McCrone produced a report in the early 1970s, that forecast a very prosperous economy for an independent Scotland. This forecast proved to be dead right, only it was an independent Norway which prospered and of course London. Westminster pissed down Scotlands back and told us it was raining.

Scotland was to small and could never generate enough taxes to sustain itself. There wasn't really that much oil it will be gone by 1980. Dont worry England will subsidise yous poor Scots, lets tell the world how lucky Scotland is to have such a generous neighbour. That's the reality you should be proud to acknowledge, unless you want to deny it.

During Scotlands referendum people like you argued away your countries wealth by using the volatile argument to rubbish oil at over $100 a barel, now at $40 a barel the volatile argument is ditched in favour of oil is near worthless, Scotland is a basket case. What happened to volatile? Oil is and will always be a volatile resource, but Scotland will remain the only country to have it as a resource while being an economical basket case. You can't even bring yourself to question the miss management of this resource by consecutive Westminster governmentso, why should you some poster from England will be along in a minute with a "fat controller" or "wee Jimmy Krankie" quip for you to cheerlead. Proud Scots.

Your mind belongs to Westminster I have no intention of trying to change that, your to far gone.

You still sound scared, well Ruth Davidson, Kezia Dugdale (who also flew out to campaign for Clinton) Willie Rennie and Patrick Harvey to name a few were all happy to publicly slate Trump. An A-hole yesterday is still an A-hole today no matter what job he's landed. Bit like a coward in that respect.

I'd agree with the cracks beginning to show. I know quite a few folk who did vote yes for independence who now say they have changed their minds whereas I know none who voted no who would now vote yes. Some of those have changed their mind because of Brexit, they want out and won't vote for a party who wants to stay or rejoin Europe, others have seen what's happened to the oil industry and this has changed their mind.

I think the SNP have peaked and now to add to this events have occurred outwith their control such as Brexit and oil prices, which is bound to affect some of their support too.

As I said previously, realistically should we be annoying two out of three of our biggest trading partners if we want independence?

Scottish leaders should be pragmatic enough to swallow their pride and deal with the issues at hand for the best deal for our country. Politics is all about deals.

Yes you are right what I should have said is the talent pool in Scotland isn't good enough.

Sorry for singling out the SNP perhaps they are all second rate.

Still not sure what I'm scared of. Puzzling that.

Same old rhetoric. What happened in the past cannot affect what we need to in the future. Independence can't be thought out in historical terms it has to be formulated going forwards.

So far I see no evidence of any plan for this other than endless rhetoric similar to yours.

The truth for you is that until that happens no more folk will vote for it than did last time. The Westminster is responsible for all bad things line is getting very very tiring.

Just heard Boris the clown who said publicly that Trump wasn't fit for office is now saying he's a great guy. Is this what you mean by talent?