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BBC Loses Great British Bakeoff


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Old 04-10-2016, 07:16
mossy2103
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Channel 4 (and ITV and the rest of the industry) knew that offers were likely to be invited for GBBO but no formal offers were made until after LP had notified the BBC that they did not wish to continue negotiations with them.
No formal offers? So LP demanding that the BBC match or exceed £25 million per year (the sane figure that C4 had come up with) was just coincidence?

Or is someone playing with words here regarding what constitutes a "formal offer"? We can rightly assume that talks with C4 had reached such an advanced stage that not only did LP have a "closure" figure laid out, all parts of the contract were ready to be signed off within a couple of hours.

The long & short of it was that LP had been in an advanced stage of negotiation with C4 long before the talks with the BBC had irretrievably broken down (or, in accordance with the BBC's public statement at the time, broken down but hopefully could be picked up again). At that stage LP had a taxi ready & waiting to zip across town to tie up the deal with C4.
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Old 04-10-2016, 07:31
eggchen
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Where did this whole betraying the BBC thing even come from?
One poster's quasi-religious and obsequious deference towards their beloved BBC.
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Old 04-10-2016, 09:05
Janet43
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It was cancelled early by the BBC because of poor ratings, but if the BBC were in contract for the life of the programme they would not have been able to cancel, which was the point being made.
The life of a programme is as long as the broadcaster wishes to air it, usually due to ratings. If viewing numbers drop, then they are within their rights not to continue with it and declare it's life over as far as they are concerned. So the broadcaster would be able to cancel.

It's then available for other broadcasters to take it if the production company wishes to continue making it and they can find someone to take it.

Taking into account catchups and recordings, Bake Off is pulling in 13plus million viewers for each episode on the BBC. Therefore it is nowhere near the end of its life on the BBC. Channel 4 will attract a fraction of that. The BBC made it as successful as it is, not Love Productions. Therefore it will not be as successful and will come to the end of its life sooner than it would with the BBC.
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Old 04-10-2016, 09:17
lundavra
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Nobody is saying that M&S have said anything untruthful. It's perfectly possible that they could have a golden handcuffs deal with the BBC and actually be unable to go to C4 even if they wanted to, while remaining consistent with their public statements that they will not be going to C4.

Obviously it's hard to prove a negative, especially if a confidentality agreement is in place, but it's not a completely implausible suggestion.
I would think that if they had a golden handcuff deal with the BBC then we would be seeing them used a lot more by the BBC particularly on the spin-off from Bake Off. I am inclined to believe them more than anything said by Love Productions.
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Old 04-10-2016, 09:18
Janet43
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[/b]
Totally agree with this. Sue Perkins is currently filming a new series of her BBC2 panel show. Nothing against them but I think the whole 'going with the dough' thing may not be quite so clear cut as it's been made out to be. Regardless I have nothing against celebrities looking around for a better deal on another channel if they could get it. Why on earth wouldn't you? The BBC are hardly any more of a cosy organisation than C4 is, it's just business. Where did this whole betraying the BBC thing even come from?
But Sue and Mel are both freelance and not tied to any channel. Although most of their work is with the BBC, they both appear on other channels from time to time, including Channel 4 and More 4.

So the claim that they are tied to the BBC is nonsense.
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Old 04-10-2016, 11:24
Aftershow
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they have destroyed a show enjoyed by millions.
It hasn't even been produced yet, let alone you or anyone else having seen it, so the contention that it has been 'destroyed' is utterly laughable hyperbole.
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Old 04-10-2016, 11:42
Straker
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It hasn't even been produced yet, let alone you or anyone else having seen it, so the contention that it has been 'destroyed' is utterly laughable hyperbole.
Depends whether you believe the audience watches for the format - A baking show in a tent in a field or is it the exact mix of presenters + judges + channel + format? Bearing in mind Hunt's bogus assertion that they'd keep it "exactly the same" then yes, GBBO as we know it is effectively cancelled/destroyed.
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Old 04-10-2016, 11:46
Night Crawler
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The life of a programme is as long as the broadcaster wishes to air it, usually due to ratings. If viewing numbers drop, then they are within their rights not to continue with it and declare it's life over as far as they are concerned. So the broadcaster would be able to cancel.

It's then available for other broadcasters to take it if the production company wishes to continue making it and they can find someone to take it.

Taking into account catchups and recordings, Bake Off is pulling in 13plus million viewers for each episode on the BBC. Therefore it is nowhere near the end of its life on the BBC. Channel 4 will attract a fraction of that. The BBC made it as successful as it is, not Love Productions. Therefore it will not be as successful and will come to the end of its life sooner than it would with the BBC.
So basically you want the BBC to have full control, so if ratings drop the BBC can cancel at any time, if ratings soar they can keep it indefinitely, yeah, I can see all the production companies signing up for that.
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Old 04-10-2016, 12:41
niceguy1966
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So basically you want the BBC to have full control, so if ratings drop the BBC can cancel at any time, if ratings soar they can keep it indefinitely, yeah, I can see all the production companies signing up for that.
That is exactly the deal most production companies expect.

Popular shows get repeat commissions, unsuccessful shows don't.
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Old 04-10-2016, 14:46
Night Crawler
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That is exactly the deal most production companies expect.

Popular shows get repeat commissions, unsuccessful shows don't.
I can see the BBC having more favorable contracts for commissioned programming, not so much for content bought in like GBBO. I would have thought contracts for these types of programmes (production owned formats) would have favored the production company.
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Old 04-10-2016, 14:51
Ginger Daddy
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Wow, how are you lot still finding things to talk about on this subject? Kudos!
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Old 04-10-2016, 15:43
lundavra
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It hasn't even been produced yet, let alone you or anyone else having seen it, so the contention that it has been 'destroyed' is utterly laughable hyperbole.
Are any bookmakers taking bets on the size of the audience for the Channel 4 Bake Off? That is usually a good test of whether people think it will be a success.
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Old 04-10-2016, 15:43
Object Z
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One poster's quasi-religious and obsequious deference towards their beloved BBC.
Ah, yes, that poster.
Who IMO, is not too well at all.
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Old 04-10-2016, 15:47
lundavra
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Depends whether you believe the audience watches for the format - A baking show in a tent in a field or is it the exact mix of presenters + judges + channel + format? Bearing in mind Hunt's bogus assertion that they'd keep it "exactly the same" then yes, GBBO as we know it is effectively cancelled/destroyed.
How can it possibly be "exactly the same" with it being a shorter programme with adverts and only one of the original cast taking part then there is it being Channel 4 which is sure to affect the whole 'feel' of the programme. Many people will not watch on principle, it is unlikely to attract many from Channel 4's normal viewers.

If the BBC can get their new version on first then the Channel 4 one is going to a big failure.
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Old 04-10-2016, 16:42
mossy2103
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Options might be running out for Channel 4:

Alan Carr rules himself out of Great British Bake Off job

Alan Carr says he won't be the next presenter of Great British Bake Off.

"I love Channel 4 but no-one has approached me," he told Nick Grimshaw during the BBC Radio 1 Breakfast Show.

"But I don't think I could do it. I think it [Great British Bake Off] is too loved. I'm like Marmite."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/articl...h-bake-off-job
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Old 04-10-2016, 17:33
mossy2103
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And some food for thought in this opinion piece in the Guardian:

Last season we had brilliant art installations in creme pat; now we’re reduced to lurching sponges and acid-casualty icing. Maybe it’s a good thing the BBC is losing Bake Off after all
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Old 04-10-2016, 18:02
Straker
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Options might be running out for Channel 4
And French and Saunders as well. Jen's done the celeb one before and I reckon they would've been C4's best bet to replicate Mel and Sue but that seems unlikely at this point, particularly seeing as the four of them are mates apparently.

I have a little more respect for Carr after that comment - He demonstrates a self-awareness that most lack in his line of work.
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Old 04-10-2016, 18:20
eggchen
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Probably is on its way out, in which case Love Productions may just have done very well indeedy thankyou very much..

Look at The Apprentice, a prime example of the law of diminishing returns. Staying on the BBC hasn't stopped that show becoming a parody of itself, and inferior to early series.

Dragon's Den is another.
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Old 04-10-2016, 18:36
Janet43
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So basically you want the BBC to have full control, so if ratings drop the BBC can cancel at any time, if ratings soar they can keep it indefinitely, yeah, I can see all the production companies signing up for that.
No. Under accepted practices ALL channels (not just the BBC) keep broadcasting a programmes until it's clearly come to the end of its life, usually when ratings drop below a certain level. Then it's available for other channels to take if they think they can breathe more life into it.

At least they have done until now, when Love Productions broke the unspoken rule. They decided they didn't care that they wouldn't have had a programme without the BBC because no-one else would take it, and now that the BBC had built it up to be the success it is they'd hold the BBC to ransom and stick two finger up at them and take it elsewhere with a "Thanks for working to make it so successful, but tough - we can get more money elsewhere."
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Old 04-10-2016, 18:47
Ash_M1
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It hasn't even been produced yet, let alone you or anyone else having seen it, so the contention that it has been 'destroyed' is utterly laughable hyperbole.
No Mel, Sue or Mary + adverts/product placement/sponsorship/full-on commercialisation = destroyed (in my opinion).
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Old 04-10-2016, 18:58
skp20040
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That's certainly possible, but, like the 'Golden Handcuffs' deals that are sometimes negotiated with particularly high-profile talent, limiting them to only one broadcaster, such an arrangement carries with it a significant cost in order to fully compensate the talent (or the producer) for the significant loss of opportunity of being able to work elsewhere.

For an indie to sign a life of series deal gives enormous control (and scope for abuse) to the broadcaster. No one in their right mind would sign such a deal without an enormous amount of money being on offer to make it worth the risk.

On the subject of Golden Handcuffs, given that the BBC has previously signed such agreements with low wattage presenters like Nick Knowles, comedians like David Walliams and Matt Lucas, and middling talent like Michael McIntyre, and offered such deals when trying to poach talent like Davina McCall from C4, (because remember it's OK when the BBC do it, but not when anyone else does), how much do you want to bet that Mel and Sue don't already have such an agreement preventing them from 'going with the dough' even if they wanted to?
Mel and Sue both held contracts with Love for each series not the BBC , Mel has done work for other channels during her time on GBBO as has Sue, so neither have a handcuffs deal with the BBC and most if not all former such deals with others have ended
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Old 04-10-2016, 19:19
Janet43
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Mel and Sue both held contracts with Love for each series not the BBC , Mel has done work for other channels during her time on GBBO as has Sue, so neither have a handcuffs deal with the BBC and most if not all former such deals with others have ended
Problem is that some people would rather believe their prejudices than bother to find out the truth about things such as that Mel and Sue are not exclusive to the BBC, but in this instance decided that in their view Bake Off belongs on the BBC so they didn't want to go elsewhere with it.
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Old 04-10-2016, 19:34
David_Flett1
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So basically you want the BBC to have full control, so if ratings drop the BBC can cancel at any time, if ratings soar they can keep it indefinitely, yeah, I can see all the production companies signing up for that.
The commercial sector refused the opportunity to take up the GBBO and if the BBC hadn't then it would probably never seen the light of day. The first series only received 2 million viewers and again a commercial broadcaster such as ITV would most likely have dropped it. The BBC is unique in that it can persevere with a format like GBBO and try and tweak it and make it better. If however the BBC continued to invest in a format that wasn't working then not many licence payers would happy if they didn't cancel.
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Old 04-10-2016, 19:59
ftv
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It hasn't even been produced yet, let alone you or anyone else having seen it, so the contention that it has been 'destroyed' is utterly laughable hyperbole.
Agreed it hasn't been produced yet (and won't be for two years) but it is obvious it will not be like the BBC original and that will disappoint millions of viewers.
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Old 04-10-2016, 20:13
Steve9214
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How can it possibly be "exactly the same" with it being a shorter programme with adverts and only one of the original cast taking part then there is it being Channel 4 which is sure to affect the whole 'feel' of the programme. Many people will not watch on principle, it is unlikely to attract many from Channel 4's normal viewers.

If the BBC can get their new version on first then the Channel 4 one is going to a big failure.
Some years ago I recall hearing an interview on BBC Essex Radio about a local '60's band that were "reforming" and going to start gigging again.

It turned out that the only 2 "original members" were the base player and the drummer, and instead of 2 other male artists - as per the band's original all male lineup - they were using the drummers teenaged daughter and her friend as vocalists.

Hardly "reforming" the band !!
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