Her eyes were closed and asleep when he started kissing her neck. Did you see her consent at any point before that?

No, cos she didn't.

The storyline is not just about having sex when drunk and not remembering it.

It is about the fact he never got her consent which makes him a rapist.

Now unless Ellie's memory is suddenly going to come back and confirm she gave consent off-screen (which would render the storyline pointless) there is no confusion or anything else. It is not drunken sex with no consent it is rape

In scenes like these I always ask myself the question "if the sexual roles of the characters were reversed would it be acceptable?". In the case of this episode it would not be.

Why is it ok for a female to slap a male when it isn't ok for a male to slap a female?

Why is it ok for a female to invade the male's person space eg force a kiss on him when it is wrong for the male to invade or grope a woman?

Marnie (and Cindy on occasion in the past) is the worst current example of acceptable double standards. Ok Marnie isn't popular but if it were a male character doing all that there'd be riots to get rid.

She was awake from what I saw. Maybe i need to rewatch. I did see her eyes close a couple of times but isn't that common practice when a guy is kissing your neck? It doesn't neccassarily mean she fell asleep. However it may well turn out that's exactly what happened and in that case, I won't disagree with you.

About the argument of consent... How many people in this day and age, tell the other party it's ok for us to have sex? Be honest here. I'm genuinely not trying to be clever or sarcastic here, really but like I said before, we live in a culture where two members of the opposite sex meet, drink, flirt and go back to his or her place without verbalising that very question. A lot of consent nowadays comes from body language and signals you give off. Now disagree with that all you want but that the reality. And no, I'm sure this doesn't apply to everyone and certainly not me but it DOES happen. I'm not neccassarily saying that this is the right way either and certainly, by verbalising you avoid situations like this. However people do often get caugh up in the moment, especially when both parties are intoxicated. I was speaking to my freinds about this story and even they said they've had one night stands where passion has just taken over and they've regretted thier actions the following day. If every woman or man for that matter cried rape for every time verbal consent wasn't given, police stations would be filled with men and women on a daily basis.

Corrie did a storyline with Tracy convincing Roy he had slept with her and treated it very lightly indeed, mocking the funny old man and lapping up the soap bitch rather than treating it as potential rape.

I knew Hollyoaks would do this badly and said all along they should have played it the other way round - consent needs to come from both people so why not play it that the bloke didn't remember having sex.

it definitely showed her eyes closed and unresponsive or at least that's how I viewed it

I agree with what you say on the argument of consent. There was a thread on GD a while back and the men who hate women brigade were all saying that responding to a kiss or touch or whatever is consent but it isn't that is why it is so topical and being pushed as an issue because it isn't. You might respond to a kiss but not want to go any further

I have been that person and had drunken sex but can always remember consenting verbally even after being caught up in the moment you still exchange words.

I think it is about differentiating between regretting your actions the next day and whether you gave permission and consented to those actions beforehand.

You see girls in a right state nowadays barely able to stand up never mind do anything else. If everyone was better educated on consent there might be less victims.

I agree. I hate seeing this on tv

I'm not sure this storyline is doing anything though to educate or inform on consent. It basically suggests you can get as drunk as you like, do what you like and then decide later whether you gave consent or not.

I agree this is going to scare people really, especially men.

Agreed, great post

Why should it scare anyone?

Surely it doesn't hurt to ask the person you are getting passionate with whether they actually consent or not ?

BIB: Yes, I saw it the same way.

They hadn't got on the bed together. Ellie lay down on the bed - on her own - as she said she was feeling unwell, the room was spinning. She appeared to be falling asleep, or lapsing into a state of drunken semi-consciousness. At this point, Nick got onto the bed and started kissing her neck. She didn't exactly respond, just seemed too drunk to forcibly object or ask him to stop.

This isn't about Ellie willingly agreeing to have sex while drunk, and regretting it the next morning. She hadn't at any point agreed to sex (unless people think that once a man has entered your bedroom, he has an automatic right to sex!) and Nick only got onto the bed and started kissing her after she'd said she felt unwell and was clearly lapsing into semi-consciousness.

Because lots of people when they are drunk and on a night out don't automatically think too and If they respond and kiss you back then that is consent and its not right that they are branded a monster and have thier lives ruined because of it. . Take what also happened to Jay on EE IS THAT FAIR?? Do you know many Men have commited suicide over awful allegations like rape and sexual abuse, do you think thats fair??

and its not right that they always show double standards and show women as victims all the time.

Denise and Phil got drunk and slept together, Phil was a lot drunker and cant remeber a thing and Denise can, Now whats the betting that when Phil finds out he slept with her and got her pregnant that hes going to shout rape?? I DOUBT IT VERY MUCH. And there is no difference between that scenario and this scenario except the roles are reversed.
Sorry if You get upset by this response, and I sincerely hope I haven't upset you. But its just how I see it.

Kissing someone back is not giving consent that is the whole point!

I am not upset, I will never ever ever agree with your view but you are entitled to your opinion as much as I am.

There is no consideration from either Phil or Denise that it was non consensual?

There two scenarios are not really comparable because we didn't see as much with Denise and Phil as we did with Ellie and Nick.

She wasn' coherent she was mumbling about pandas. She wasn't kissing him once she got on the bed her eyes were closed and she didn't respond to him kissing her neck, where is the consent?

I don't think that is necessarily a bad thing, if it makes people think twice about having sex with very drunk people not capable of giving consent.

He was drunk too

So the answer seems to be folks don't leave the house without a breathalyser and a written contract for your would be conquest to sign. If you're going out to get smashed don't get flirtatious, either go on the pull or go out to get drunk but not both.

Yes but he wasn't about to pass out like Ellie was and has a much clearer memory, so couldn't have been as drunk as her.

Or maybe, when somebody is passing out on the bed, just refrain from starting to have sex with them. Or continuing to have sex with them. They're no longer capable.

It's not like Mastermind - "I've started so I'll finish!"

We didn't see enough with Ellie and Nick either, we never actually see her fall asleep, we don't know enough to make a conclusion, why don't you just accuse every one who has a one night stand of rape. why don't you just say Denise is one, oh thats right because Denise is a woman and Phils a man, actally how many times in the past 10 years have we seen Mercedes wake next to a stranger after a drunken night out Kris Tony etc the issue of concent or rape never came up then. As Katrina says if it turned out Ellie passed out and he had sex with her then, I will agree with you, but we didn't see enough.

Like I said JUST LIKE THE PHIL AND DENISE SITUATION.

he wasn't as drunk but I think he was pretty drunk he kept stumbling.

Im not sure who you are refering to.

This, exactly!

in EE I guess you dont watch, but pretty much the same thing happened, He was paralytic( Hes also an alcholic) and cant remember anything she was very drunk but she can.

What we have to remember is that Nick was drunk too. Did he appear as wasted as Ellie? No but he was legless and most probably not thinking coherently either. He was swaying and laughing at the same things. While I agree Ellie wasn't in a fit state to give consent, I don't think it was as plain as him taking advantage of her. It's not exactly like he was sober himself. I'm not making any excuse here but it's common that when under the direct influence of alchole your judgement becomes impaired so with Ellie kissing him, taking him to a room, I can see why a young lad, while intoxicated, assumed she wanted sex. I also don't see that he took her clothes of while she was unconcious because I didn't see that. However if did, that is rape point blank. I also think having memory of what happened doesn't make you less drunk or not drunk enough not to know better. I speak from experience. Last Thursday I went out and had 3 bottles of wine, shots, vodka you name it but still managed to get up the next day to work with memory of all the events the night before. I was steaming too and even now I don't know how I managed it. Point being, a lack of memory imo is no measure of how drunk or coherent you are. If Nick was sober but only had a little then I could understand the argument but they both spent hours in the same club getting absolutely sloshed, going back to Ellie's around 4pm.