Why would Simon want Matt to win, good looking boyband types never sell records after, in fact male winners generally never do well. They are only going to do well if they have more than good looks and an average voice, they need to be an artist, like James Arthur and Olly Murs who had the pop ska vibe when he first started out. If he wanted Matt to win, Simon would have given himself the boys. I think he wants one of the girls as another Louisa, Ella henderson type could do ok and there is room in the market for a few different girls. Unfortunately I don't think any of the girls have got strong enough personalities,stage presence or voices as yet, but early days.

X Factor whinge time

The show is just a mess, i mean Honey G and Ottavio and Bradley on the show is undefendable by the X Factor producers/judges and presenters.

Sharon turns away two good singers for Honey G?. I mean seriously?. Louis Walsh bins a group for Ottavio and Bradley.

They state that they need variety/entertainment?. Who finds them acts funny?

Is that what the producers call entertainment?. Non of it makes any sense and i just think its wrong.

If anything all it will do is stop people from watching the show and atm the X Factor can ill afford poor viewing figures again.

The joke acts are all about generating publicity for the show, they know it will get people talkin, just like we are doing on here lol.


I think you gotta take the show with a pinch of salt and just embrace the madness.

X factor was first heard on this morning in 1999 by Kate Thornton .They had a competition to find a new boy band and from 75 they whittled down to the final 9 boys including Will Young , Lee Ryan , Antony Costa and Declan Bennett . Will and Lee were picked for the group along with 2 other boys .The judges were Kate Thornton ,Ray Hedges and Simon Cowell .I don't know the name of the boy band but it was managed by Simon and didn't last long. We next saw Will Young winning pop idol in 2001/2002 with his ex Manager Simon as a judge .At the time pop idol was all about Gareth Gates who was the clear favourite and Will was in the back ground . Looking back now its clear that Simon Knew Will before pop idol but at the time there was no mention of this. This is how the X factor is today and always has being with the judges knowing the singers before they enter the show .Many of the singers past and present have been on tv as actors and in commercials or on the X factor before or other talent shows .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psBIxC3pWx4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lvz0sCtpSCA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MF-G0KfRyiQ

This is why I think X Factor should be moved to the soap operas section of this forum

Its easy

There is already an act who is chosen for the final who they can groom for the charts

competition to this act is sabotaged

if an act is considered competion by popularity on social media or by news outlets they are gotten rid of early at chair challenge or judges houses

then in the weeks to come song choices and wardrobe will help get the competition eliminated

chuck in the joke acts who are never out in the first few weeks and the average singers getting put through the competition for the chosen act is whittled down from a dozen or so to four or five

Simon doesnt need his chosen act to win he just needs to get them as near to the final night as possible for exposure and for them to be remembered

Simon and his chosen act have won befor the final is anywhere near, from the competition being in the thousands he has gotten the competition down to single figures

I think people are missing the bigger point. It will of course put off some people watching but it will also put off good singers from entering the competition.

It's not even disguised this year. It's so obvious it makes you wonder whether they have lost the plot.

I can only wonder whether this week will purely be a competition for the good people they chucked out. Doesn't make much sense though.

I'm sure they are living the shit storm but it's such a short term mindset. I have a feeling they are going to struggle to recover from this one. When people watch the first shows and there are no great performances from the likestart of Louisa johnson etc then people will stop being bothered about watching the show. It won't be something they must watch anymore

said this quite a few times

we have a few posters that every year go on about wanting serious acts and acts from other genres etc etc but the simple fact is that acts know how the X Factor works and anyone who wants to be taken seriously wont go near it

everyone knows that if you are from a "niche" genre that the XF wont take you seriously, so the only acts we get from outside of mainstream pop are ones that are pretty crap and desperate

so it ends up becoming a self fulfilling prophecy

OMG I never knew any of this

Just goes to show you that even way back then, it was all secrets and lies

I do think Kelly Clarkson talent spotted as well for American Idol

I don't agree as every now and then the X factor finds someone or a band that does really well and makes a lot of money. Are you telling me that the young kids don't go on hoping to be the next Olly Murs, Louisa, Ella Henderson, One Direction etc. Someone like James Arthur, would have done well if he hadn't cocked it up and he was a proper artist who could write songs (on his way back now of course with a No 1.)

Most don't succeed, but some make a fortune. If you are a serious act, where would you go to try and make it in the business? The Voice - whats the point without the record label backing and marketing spend. There used to be a great show on Sky called Must be the Music which had really credible acts, but that only lasted one series and again without the record label backing, no-one really succeeded.

It is hard to make it in the business, so having 8-9 weeks on TV is a great platform for someone to try and make it, so those good singers will still try every year in the hope they make it through and become the next Harry Styles!

going on XF hoping to be famous =/= going on XF hoping to be a credible musician

can you point out to me where i said people dont go on XF to be successful ?

can you point out to me where i said XF haven't produced successful acts ?

I think James Arthur, Ella Henderson, Rebecca Ferguson, Matt Cardle and Lucie Spraggan were all pretty credible musicians actually - all write their own music, some play instruments, so I think you can have a credible musician on there. I don't think any of those acts are "desperate and crap" - might not be mine or your cup of tea, but the are neither desperate or crap. Both the guys from the overs were outside of the normal genre, and if Sharon wasn't forced to take through joke acts, then one of them would definitely have got through.

i think when you have judges like Simon, Louis and Sharon, then they will never allow anything other than joke acts and popstars through, but with different judges, you might stand a chance of getting credible people to audition.

Kelly Clarkson was definitely not TCO on S1 on American Idol.

They didn't air her audition and Simon literally didn't remember her when she first appeared in the next round.

The winner was expected to be either Justin Guarini (who was runner-up) or Tamyra (who went out at 4th in the first ever "shock boot").

American Idol never had a B2 sing-off and judge vote. The one with the least number of votes went home. Less opportunity for outright producer interference. They had to be more subtle!

i thought we were talking about the direction the show is moving in not what it maybe once was , and its fairly obvious that the direction its moving in is more towards what i posted

the very fact you raise the issue of the overs and how the choices were made will put people off going on the show in future as they will think whats the point even trying when i'll just get rejected over a farce like Honey G

there will always be exceptions and people who get desperate after not getting a break and will see the XF as an opportunity, there will always be youngsters who dont know any better and have been brought up watching the XF that will think its the "natural" way to get into a career in music

none of that changes what i said in my post that every year the talent pool is diluted because serious acts wont go near it, every year we see less diversity in the styles of music as "niche" genres aren't given a chance. how often do we see a really good rock singer auditioning for XF, and the rare occasion when they do they get binned over a mediocre but good looking pop act or a joke

I partly agree about the way the show is going but at the same time, the two older rocker guys are probably playing pubs with 20-30 people attending, but for a little while at least, people will know Christopher Peyton and James Wilson name and they might just get a bit of success, rather than having no chance whatsoever. So why wouldn't people audition.

All we can do is hope that the new version of The Voice will bring us more diversity and a better calibre of act that what we have to endure on XF.

The key thing to look at with The Voice is whether they keep or scrap the live house band. That will be a test of how they intend to run the show.

That is a good point.

The only series that was diverse under Simon was series 7, and look at how many people watched the show that year and it was because the alternative acts stole the show for alot of people.

Gary Barlow's time had a few unusual acts that were talented that Simon won't allow to be on the show ever again since his returned, ashame really.

I don't claim to think or know what Simon wants. I *know* what the producers want, though. That is what matters.

*notice* If you just watch the show for a bit of fun, the rest of this post may bore you, and it's okay to stop reading. If you want to know how it looks from the other side of the screen, or care what happens to those artists who were good enough but not chosen, read on.

Again, my biggest issue with the show is the way they lead acts on, some of whom are actually good enough to make it without the show, a couple who had offers from more legit talent competitions like the Voice.

It is easy to say they could have said no, but only if you have never experiences something like this or seen people you care about struggle with the secision (yes, for those who are about the music and not just easy fame, it is a struggle, the big factor being will they be represented fairly and will it help them achieve their M*musical* goals). I walked away(and never regretted it) years ago from a similar situation, and did fine on my own . I know several others who can say the same, and yes, some who did well partly thanks to the show. I also know too many who were screwed over (strong words and heard echoed through the years such a show has been in operation)and had their time wasted.

This is not a whinge. Some acts could have gone a slow steady route, but were convinced by the show that it offered a quick boost in exposure.(convinced a lot, many of the better acts were scouted, not least because they already have an audience they gained themselves) Sounds great, right?


...Sure, until they learn that "exposure" could easily involve making them come across to millions as uninteresting or far less talented than they are or even unlikeable. They are under contract to say nothing.They are afraid that they could end upon Sony's shit list, which is a very bad place to be if you are talented and on the verge of breaking mainstream.



I am not going to presume to say those through deserved it less. What I will presume to say is they are the lucky ones who, because they were needed to fill roles in this seasons script, will get to show who they are(as long as they continue to be useful).

For those who are cruise ship/Butlins/novelty type acts, this show can offer a huge boost in career, because , frankly, they don't need to be great, just entertaining,For those who have the level of talent and dedication to draw a bigger audience on their own merrit, who put their heart and soul into their music with love every day, who are serious about it, to be painted as "boring" "unlikeable" "oversinging" "no personality" "out of tune" when those things are not the case(if they were, they would not have already had a following as the acts who fall into this category almost always do) is a devistating blow, a betrayal, leaves them feeling they should have known better, and , at best, they come out of it about where they already had been, maybe with more followers on Twitter or Youtube.At worst...Imagine only being allowed to use the 5 worst photos you ever saw of yourself when you use online media. Imagine an Internet app could cut and paste everything you type , including work emails, to make you seem to say whatever , and it is all negative, and you are not allowed to contradict or it's eternal offline damnation for you.

Go on and watch the show. Enjoy it. I genuinely like many acts through, and am happy for them. One of the few good things is that in the process of market testing acts and screwing over acts not suited to the theme, they so help artists like Matt, Relley C, Emily, to be heard , and that is wonderful!

That doesn't make how the show operates okay. Look at the view counts, even on this forum, or YT videos, etc. You will notice that the more popular an act not through , the worse an edit (and mix/song choices if they can really sing) they will have gotten.

The whole show is just controlled too much from start to finish. It would be so much better if every acts was given the same amount of exposure.

That would be ideal, but not gonna happen, because the show does understandably promote those they will most benefit off of. However, having bennefitted off the talent not through that keeps people watching at the start,it wouldn't kill them and might even draw a better calibre of auditionees if they gave them not the same, but something..The same amount of time wasted showing them at their worst, but showing them as they actually are and sound would not cost them anything in time or money. They imagine it seems, a need to make the cast asides non entities, but really, it makes no sense. A fair representation of their sound and self would be enough. That is all real talent needs.

Surely in the balance between ensuring their chosen one/cash cow gets to the final and still having a viable show there must be a tipping point before diminishing returns sets in ,or they will end up with neither and that's not smart. Killing the goose that lays the golden eggs!
Always knew the interference went on. Never seen so little effort to disguise it.

Not eccentric??? A woman of her age that dresses that way and pretends to be "gangsta" doesn't come much more eccentric than that if you ask me!

When i talked about marketing i was referring to show marketing not Honey G.

And yes Honey is pretty grim but she will make a fortune from PA's once she is finished on the show mark my words!

There is a balance you are 100% right and that is exactly the reason why I'm not convinced anyone on DS has guessed / predicted the correct "script" as yet!