DS Forums

 
 

Did the key to time idea work?


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 13-10-2016, 07:49
allen_who
Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 2,049

Just wondering how ppl feel abwt Toms 5th series. They just about got away with it for me...

Another question though. Could they get away with a sequel now, but the vilain already has gathered all the pieces bar one. If he/she gets it then they have the power to control all of space / time, even minion timelords....
allen_who is offline   Reply With Quote
Please sign in or register to remove this advertisement.
Old 13-10-2016, 07:58
Pull2Open
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: The Id
Posts: 12,239
Just wondering how ppl feel abwt Toms 5th series. They just about got away with it for me...

Another question though. Could they get away with a sequel now, but the vilain already has gathered all the pieces bar one. If he/she gets it then they have the power to control all of space / time, even minion timelords....
The adventures had by the doctor and Romana in those stories could've easily worked without the key to time, there was always some injustice going on the they had to right. They simply arrived there because of the key, and had to find it, either of those could've been rewritten with ease.

It was simply a nice addition
Pull2Open is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2016, 08:13
Sam_Gee1
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 695
The idea i felt was brilliant, it wasn't executed that well though. It had a lot of potential.

But a sequel could definitely work, obviously not a season on it, but a couple of episodes.
Sam_Gee1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2016, 08:14
Theophile
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 1,830
I really enjoyed The Key to Time season; it is one of my all time favorites.
Theophile is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2016, 08:17
Mulett
Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Essex
Posts: 8,404
In a way, the Key to Time is the closest we have to a modern season of Who with a continuous story arc leading into a dramatic season finale.

I think the 'Key' theme itself is fairly light touch and, as Pull2Open says, each story would have been essentially the same without it, although perhaps the final story (and the clever reveal about Princess Astra) is more dependant on it.

I do rather like the idea of the Doctor and his companion turning up somewhere with a mission of their own rather than dropping into someone else's situation. And I enjoyed the search for each individual part of the key.

But overall they're not my favourite stories. I'm not sure the Tom Baker/Mary Tamm relationship was a great success, personally, and I think that's a little bit of the reason I'm not terribly excited by these stories.

That may just be a retrospective point of view, however, because I remember thoroughly enjoying the episodes when they were shown in 78/79.

I think it is just that I enjoyed the Lalla Ward/Tom Baker chemistry so much more the following year and that probably colours my opinion of these episodes.
Mulett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2016, 08:23
Theophile
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 1,830
I think it is just that I enjoyed the Lalla Ward/Tom Baker chemistry so much more the following year and that probably colours my opinion of these episodes.
LOL! That's not fair. Their chemistry was so good that they married each other. LOL!

I must agree with one point, though, Ward and Baker's chemistry was great. I had such a crush on Romana II when I was a teenager. Sigh. LOL!
Theophile is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2016, 08:24
Mulett
Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Essex
Posts: 8,404
LOL! That's not fair. Their chemistry was so good that they married each other. LOL!
Yes, not an easy thing for Mary Tamm to compete with
Mulett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2016, 11:34
Corwin
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 12,601
Got the Boxset of this a while back but haven't got round to (re)watching it yet.

Another question though. Could they get away with a sequel now, but the vilain already has gathered all the pieces bar one. If he/she gets it then they have the power to control all of space / time, even minion timelords....
Not heard it myself but Big Finish did do a Sequel a few years back.

It features the 5th Doctor and Amy (no not that one).
Corwin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2016, 11:53
Michael_Eve
Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 6,078
It's one of my favourite seasons, so definitely think it worked!

As others have said, the 'segments' aren't really a big part of the individual stories, they just provide a link and there is the unusual situation where The Doctor is visiting all the places in the season for a specific reason, which made for an interesting change.

Said before, I thought Tom was very inconsistent in the previous season, as if he'd started to lose interest in the part and the stories he was presented with. He has his moments, of course, but I'd say generally it's his weakest performance-wise and he seems to be phoning it in at times. Here he seems to be reinvigorated and has turned the charisma level up a notch. I love stories like 'Ribos...', 'Pirate Planet', 'Stones of Blood' and, an absolute favourite, 'Androids of Tara'.

Oh, and admit the first time I saw Mary Tamm as Romana on screen (would've been about 1985; my parents stopped watching Who around 1977!) my jaw dropped. What a beautiful, talented (and by all accounts lovely) person she was.
Michael_Eve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2016, 13:03
allen_who
Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 2,049
It's one of my favourite seasons, so definitely think it worked!

As others have said, the 'segments' aren't really a big part of the individual stories, they just provide a link and there is the unusual situation where The Doctor is visiting all the places in the season for a specific reason, which made for an interesting change.

Said before, I thought Tom was very inconsistent in the previous season, as if he'd started to lose interest in the part and the stories he was presented with. He has his moments, of course, but I'd say generally it's his weakest performance-wise and he seems to be phoning it in at times. Here he seems to be reinvigorated and has turned the charisma level up a notch. I love stories like 'Ribos...', 'Pirate Planet', 'Stones of Blood' and, an absolute favourite, 'Androids of Tara'.

Oh, and admit the first time I saw Mary Tamm as Romana on screen (would've been about 1985; my parents stopped watching Who around 1977!) my jaw dropped. What a beautiful, talented (and by all accounts lovely) person she was.

wasn't she just, wow, stunning. I think most people know she sadly died a few years ago. What few people may be aware off is her husband died on the day of her funeral ( probably of a broken heart ). A sad but poignient tribute to how much she would have been loved and missed I feel
allen_who is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2016, 18:44
Ian K Mc
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 186
I preferred the original key search serial - The Keys of Marinus
Ian K Mc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2016, 19:34
daveyboy7472
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Peri's Cleavage
Posts: 14,690
As an idea I think it worked, the theme was always kept to the background and explicit scenes until, as has been pointed out, the final story.

The only gripe I would have with it is it's resolution. It just seemed a little bit undramatic and the Black Guardian really should have had a bigger part in the final story, considering his presence had been threatening in the background all season. The fact he only showed up for five minutes seemed to be an under use of a potentially good character. Thankfully that was more than made up for during the 20th Season.

As for the stories themselves, bit of a mixed bag. Liked four out of the six but The Ribos Operation and The Power Of Kroll I've always found a bit dull, though the former has some interesting characters and Binro has some nice scenes in it.

I liked the chemistry between Romana 1 and The Doctor, but like other posters, preferred the second Romana's chemistry with him better though there's no doubting Mary Tamm was stunning.

daveyboy7472 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2016, 21:23
allen_who
Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 2,049
I must be one of the few who liked the armageddon factor. Although the end was a kop out in my opinion ..
allen_who is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2016, 23:56
Verence
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Kessingland, Suffolk
Posts: 85,519
Got the Boxset of this a while back but haven't got round to (re)watching it yet.



Not heard it myself but Big Finish did do a Sequel a few years back.

It features the 5th Doctor and Amy (no not that one).
With David Troughton as the Black Guardian
Verence is offline Follow this poster on Twitter   Reply With Quote
Old 14-10-2016, 06:28
bennythedip
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,690
At the time it was the season which turned me off doctor who. Tom's early era was my favourite but at the time I fell out of love with the series and did not return to watch until Peter Davison. I enjoyed the DVD box set though many years later. Don't think the key to time idea worked as they spent all season finding it then deciding that it was too powerful so it was dispersed. The guardians. The season started well with hints that they are so much more powerful than the time lords but that didn't really pay off.
bennythedip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-10-2016, 06:53
Theophile
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 1,830
At the time it was the season which turned me off doctor who. Tom's early era was my favourite but at the time I fell out of love with the series and did not return to watch until Peter Davison. I enjoyed the DVD box set though many years later. Don't think the key to time idea worked as they spent all season finding it then deciding that it was too powerful so it was dispersed. The guardians. The season started well with hints that they are so much more powerful than the time lords but that didn't really pay off.
The Guardians would be interesting characters to bring back; especially The Black Guardian. It could work well if it was done correctly.
Theophile is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-10-2016, 07:30
Lord Smexy
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,505
I loved it myself, even thought there were a lot of great ideas not realised and the resolution felt thin and unfinished. Mary Tamm was an amazing companion, almost like a Classic Who Donna with the way she bickered with the Doctor and got so competitive. It was a nice change of pace in terms of companions.

The Power of Knoll wasn't that great though despite being written by Robert Holmes. I think I enjoyed The Ribos Operation and The Pirate Planet the most.

It's a shame we didn't get to see more of The Shadow, he came across as a really interesting character to me.
Lord Smexy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-10-2016, 07:35
Mulett
Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Essex
Posts: 8,404
The Guardians would be interesting characters to bring back; especially The Black Guardian. It could work well if it was done correctly.
There was a suggestion on this forum years ago that the Trickster was the Black Guardian, although I wasn't never sure about that myself.

It would be interesting to bring back a character like that and see how it would be played out in New Who. Also, it would be interesting to see how the likes of the Black and White Guardians had been affected by the Time War.
Mulett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-10-2016, 09:51
Theophile
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 1,830
There was a suggestion on this forum years ago that the Trickster was the Black Guardian, although I wasn't never sure about that myself.

It would be interesting to bring back a character like that and see how it would be played out in New Who. Also, it would be interesting to see how the likes of the Black and White Guardians had been affected by the Time War.
I would love to see the two guardians playing the universe over eternity like a chess board wherein everything that happens is moved by them. The Time War could have simply been them exchanging rooks (the white rook being The Time Lords and the black rook being The Daleks). That would put the immensity of The Time War into an interesting perspective and also make me wonder as to who the other pieces were.
Theophile is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-10-2016, 10:45
Pull2Open
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: The Id
Posts: 12,239
At the time it was the season which turned me off doctor who. Tom's early era was my favourite but at the time I fell out of love with the series and did not return to watch until Peter Davison. I enjoyed the DVD box set though many years later. Don't think the key to time idea worked as they spent all season finding it then deciding that it was too powerful so it was dispersed. The guardians. The season started well with hints that they are so much more powerful than the time lords but that didn't really pay off.
Hmmm, my recollection is that the doctor was collecting it for the white guardian and only redispersed it when he realized that he had been tricked by the black guardian.

I'll have to go and revisit it.
Pull2Open is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-10-2016, 11:26
Boz_Lowdownl
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,588
As an idea I think it worked, the theme was always kept to the background and explicit scenes until, as has been pointed out, the final story.

The only gripe I would have with it is it's resolution. It just seemed a little bit undramatic and the Black Guardian really should have had a bigger part in the final story, considering his presence had been threatening in the background all season. The fact he only showed up for five minutes seemed to be an under use of a potentially good character. Thankfully that was more than made up for during the 20th Season.

As for the stories themselves, bit of a mixed bag. Liked four out of the six but The Ribos Operation and The Power Of Kroll I've always found a bit dull, though the former has some interesting characters and Binro has some nice scenes in it.

I liked the chemistry between Romana 1 and The Doctor, but like other posters, preferred the second Romana's chemistry with him better though there's no doubting Mary Tamm was stunning.

Agree with most of this, apart from The Ribos Operation, for me by far the standout story of the season.
Boz_Lowdownl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-10-2016, 11:29
Boz_Lowdownl
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,588
I loved it myself, even thought there were a lot of great ideas not realised and the resolution felt thin and unfinished. Mary Tamm was an amazing companion, almost like a Classic Who Donna with the way she bickered with the Doctor and got so competitive. It was a nice change of pace in terms of companions.

The Power of Knoll wasn't that great though despite being written by Robert Holmes. I think I enjoyed The Ribos Operation and The Pirate Planet the most.

It's a shame we didn't get to see more of The Shadow, he came across as a really interesting character to me.
Flipping heck, I find myself in almost total agreement with a Lord Smexy post!

Especially re Ribos, Mary and The Shadow.
Boz_Lowdownl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-10-2016, 11:32
Boz_Lowdownl
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,588
I would love to see the two guardians playing the universe over eternity like a chess board wherein everything that happens is moved by them. The Time War could have simply been them exchanging rooks (the white rook being The Time Lords and the black rook being The Daleks). That would put the immensity of The Time War into an interesting perspective and also make me wonder as to who the other pieces were.
.... and also, for once, disagreeing with a Theophile post!

I hate the concept of super beings controlling everything, it really makes a lot of stories quite pointless.

Far better in Inferno when the Doctor says something about free will not being an illusion.
Boz_Lowdownl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-10-2016, 05:32
Theophile
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 1,830
.... and also, for once, disagreeing with a Theophile post!

I hate the concept of super beings controlling everything, it really makes a lot of stories quite pointless.

Far better in Inferno when the Doctor says something about free will not being an illusion.
Oh, Man! I love The Inferno.

My main Doctor Who watching group and myself will be finishing up "The Planet of Spiders" on Sunday. We will eat a Tardis cake and drink to the Third Doctor. Then, in November (we are taking Halloween weekend off), we will move on to Tom Baker, my favorite Doctor. Five and half years into our watching and three Doctors down, only 9 to go. LOL!
Theophile is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-10-2016, 12:49
chuffnobbler
Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 9,542
The Armageddon factor is bloody awful, exemplifying all that is bad about 1970s six-parters. the rest of the season is magnificent though.
chuffnobbler is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply




 
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 09:07.