I thought todays episode was really good actually, loved the Massoods, they were a great family.

Actually I do like Carmel, i just don't like her recently,

And thanks for views, I agree with a few of your topics, the development of characters I agreed great, and I hated the block storylines ( I think that still happens really
)

But it is dull, but my line in the sand was Belinda, such a waste.

I won't take a break just yet, I'll give it until after Christmas
It seems to me people are all disagreeing but why can't the show be both dramatic and gripping yet everyday and whatable?

Ok I see what you mean now

I love character driven stories. Yes there are some dull stories happening like Kim etc but Lees depression along with Dots struggles and Kathy being rejuvenated are all excellent in my view

In short the characterisation is spot on and I'm caring about the characters again.

That's for me personally why I'm enjoying it. I feels like Eastenders to me again whereas the last few years felt like Hollyoaks

Now I watch Hollyoaks and I love the show but that direction doesn't work on EE.

All the exits have been really great aswell so I'm looking forward to ronnie and Roxy's

Kneel at my command.

Maybe they need to give it an extra 'oomph' on a few of the stories and give the duff duffs more of an exciting cliffhanger - but on the whole I think the show is mixing the drama with everyday life well.

Belinda was a good character, but SOC knows he is going to have to manuever people out if he is to bring in new characters. Rather Belinda than a Sharon or an Ian, for example.

I think the Kim storyline is going somewhere. Or otherwise what's the point? I don't think the writers went "lets give Kim a driving lesson story lol". It will probably lead somewhere, but at this point we don't know what.

I'm general zod

It's always subjective as we've seen here what pleases some won't please others. The ground work if you like is being laid, characters are mixing well with each other and it has recovered it's community spirit it had. Seeds are being planted bit by bit, I wouldn't say nothing is happening perhaps it's not explosive stuff but it'sOK. Lee's depression has been good, I thought Jay's drug storyline has been good, Dot's health might not be seen as the most exciting stuff but it's been well acted. Disappointed to see Belinda go but if I remember correctly in the past her character wasn't one to stick around for long anyway

Ok I agree Belinda going over Sharon of course that is in thinkable, but what is he replacing Belinda with, is it to make room for Kat and the red water stuff or is it for bloody Casandra from only fools and horses

I don't think the Kim story is going anywhere other than filler, she will pass the test in the end ...

But there's a glimpse of hope maybe the casts neatly empty do new blood,

Maybe it is just such a dramatic change in focus it's taking 6 months, as I said earlyier subtle is ok as long as it goes somewhere it can't just be about putting the bins out and moaning they havnt been collected it needs to lead to somthing doesn't it?

This whole thread has become ridiculous everyone is just repeating what has been said pages before. If the discussion has already ended why do people feel the need to just keep adding the same old complaints to it.

I think bingate and drivinggate could run as long as Sharongate.

I wonder what award it would win, most over drawn non storyline ever!

Jimbo, mate, we get that you're not liking it at the moment and whilst we can sympathise, we can't really make you like it, all we can do is add our thoughts as to why it's coming across as a bit slow.... but as Adam has said, it's been discussed at length for the last couple of months and there's really little more to add.

For what it's worth, I firmly believe it's a temporary lull. Yes, it's perhaps been a little bit too dull at times but I do sense that it's started to pick up over this last three or four episodes. I guess that's reasonable as it's heading towards Christmas and the Lee and R&R exits are coming up, so those stories are building up (albeit slowly).

I'm sure there will be new characters, there has to be but it's been important to reconnect with the existing ones too and it would have been difficult to do both properly all at the same time. I'm guessing too that SOC has scrapped an awful lot of what DTC had pencilled in for this autumn, which he's perfectly entitled to do but of course, the time has had to be be filled with something else at short notice, so yes, not a lot has been happening other than a few exits, although the other things like Kim's driving and the bins will probably lead to something more in due course.

If you can appreciate why it's been like it has for the last couple of months, then it's easier to understand. No-one's saying you have to agree, just acknowledge that under DTC the show was heading towards burn-out and it simply couldn't carry on at such a speed. Hopefully the groundwork has now more or less been completed and there will be a better balance of drama and real-life from here on in with perhaps new characters in the new year. None of us knows for sure but let's not write it off just yet.

Last night's episode was fabulous, with a great send off for Masood.

It's going in the right direction, imo. I could do without Bingate, but that's my only gripe atm.

I really have a feeling that Kim's plot will climax with her running somebody over.

A.) it's not Christmas unless someone gets hit by a car

B.) it would really be a shock. The slow build up and use of comedy "lets all laugh at Kim in her car" and then BAM she suddenly finds herself in a very serious situation.

Maybe she hits Denise which forces her early labour on xmas day?

Sean O'Connor's doing a fine job in my opinion, although I admit EastEnders is a little 'quiet'. I think 'ruining' is a complete exaggeration, but this happens every time a new Exec Prod. is appointed. It's a hobby here.

I think he's got the 'social side' to characters perfectly. They're interacting again, and I also think the writing's improved. I also think he's done a wonderful job of exits. Usually when Exec Producers arrive, exits are quick and clumsy. Les and Pam's was wonderful, as was Masood's. Belinda's was quite good too. They didn't feel too forced.

That's what I was thinking.

Or maybe something even darker, like Denise and Kim are in a crash and the doctors struggle to keep the baby alive?

i think i mentioned it earlier in the thread, but EastEnders IMO anyway, for the past 10 years has really struggled to get the fit for the right producer for the show.
Santer was OK i guess, but some blunders let him down for example, again IMO, bringing back Daniella Westbrook, Killing off Danielle Ronnie's daughter, which i found bizarre when she could have played a huge part in Archie's murder, instead we got that bizarre Stacey nonsense.
The show is still clearly struggling with production and writers, personally i would gutter it out from bottom to top with completely fresh writers and production.

Poor rating last night -
EastEnders: 5.48m (28.5%).

Stole this from WW so haven't got comparisons with the other soaps. Either way that is very low for a Thursday night, no clash, nearly into December. The show should be over 6m and audience share at around 32% if it was doing well.
Still people will keep defending SOC and saying the ratings don't matter.

If the show doesn't pick up soon I wouldn't be surprised if they axe him and bring in someone without previous links to the show. I really think it needs to go in a new direction.

2 weeks ago, when the rating were at their highest since April and May, we were told by the SOC bashers that the ratings didn't matter because Twitter was saying the was boring.

Now suddenly the ratings do matter when they are down for a week and SOC should lose his job?

I don't no why people make such a big deal about ratings, it makes selves that there equal to aprils ratings now, we had the summer in between, question soc all the time but I don't blame him for the ratings it's just the times of year.

Also I think I've been abit over the top on critising SOC it's not just his show, it's hundreds of people that make eastenders work in think most of the trouble is down to writers and story boarders, they need the right mix of drama and character driven stuff at the same time, whilst avoiding block story's,

I think a lot of it comes down to trying to be more cost effective. Having the right actors all in on the same days to film on the same set it must be very tempting just to focus on group a for a month then b for a month so on and so on,

No sorry, the first time ratings were mentioned in this thread it was used in defence of SOC. They were saying that it proves that he's doing something right.

Now I've pointed out they are falling quite dramatically, surely that must mean that people are simply not enjoying the show. To be fair, if EE was rating well the usual suspects such as yourself and gavin shipman would be on here praising SOC and using the ratings as justification that the SOC bashers are wrong. You can't have it both ways I'm afraid!

So are you

They're not "falling quite dramatically".

It's down on last week but pretty much where it was last year. It'll be higher when the official BARB ratings come in anyway (and they don't take in the iPlayer downloads, in which EE is one of the most popular).

Yes, it was mentioned that the ratings were good during Lee's wedding week because people on here were adamant that the show has "boring". You were saying the ratings didnt matter, now you're saying they do!

Also there is no chance the BBC will fire SOC on the back of a quiet week.

Well that's only one episode . though if the show carries on as it is then the ratings will eventually drop for a longer period its inevitable.