Your post sums it up perfectly! I still believe EE is being "set up" at the moment. SOC had a lot of work to do to bring the writing & character interacting up to speed. These things take time!

At least he isn't carrying on with the sensationalism & fan-fic ways of DTC.

How much time though? On Thursday Seeing it sandwiched between two currently far superior soaps emmerdale and Corrie was just showing up how uninspiring EastEnders is at the moment.

How many people watch EE alongside Corrie and Emmerdale though?

I don't. So I don't compare.

I've just enjoyed EE greatly since SOC after switching off for a bit when DTC was there. I'm not comparing it against other shows as I don't watch them.

BIB - This is completely subjective! I'd rather watch the testcard than those!

Maybe I am being pessimistic here but I can't see EE ever being truely golden again. I've just given up on that ever happening. 2014 was the last full year I watched but I was struggling as a viewer in the years before that. I know 2009 has its critics but for me that was the last year that was truely interesting, with decent characters and decent storylines.

Then of course Kirkwood took over and the damage he did has been inpairable. Following on was Newman, DTC (whom i had such high hopes for) and now SOC and nothing has improved. I do think DTC showed promise in 2014. Not neccassarily a brilliant year but I did feel the show was finally on the road to recovery but then after EE live, the show went to pot again.

I must admit that I haven't seen much of SOC material. I haven't watched EE in years and have no interest in it now. What I have noticed though, on this forum there has been a buzz around Corrie and edale. (I don't watch these shows either). When people are talking positively but consistently (not just when the show has had a good week) then you know a show is on the up. I'm not getting that vibe with EE and haven't in years. It's still very early days but the first 6 months of 2017 will determine the kind of producer SOC is going to be. I don't plan on tuning in but if I find there is a buzz I may be swayed to tune in. However my days of being patient and waiting are done.

You make a very good point about Bryan Birkwood , the show just has not been the same since.
What's funny is, he's pretty much finished Hollyoaks off as well with his absurd storylines and weird obsession with death. I really do not understand how he is still working in television.
I'm guessing he got the job back on hollyoaks as perhaps C4 thought 'he wasn't very good on EastEnders but did a good job on hollyoaks first time round so maybe he just fits better with hollyoaks' . oh dear.

Yes I agree Kirkwood did terrible damage to EE, I think the main reason the BBC employed him was because of his successful era at Hollyoaks and they thought they wanted a bit of that as it was really good. With Hollyoaks though, they can pass it off as sensationalist because it's 'different' and aims for a younger audience, even though last year they definitely took that for granted. It's improved a bit his year, a long way to go yet but it's better than 2015 as a whole. Incidentally, it was when Iain McLeod left it started to improve gradually. Channel 4 probably had him back because of his great first run but this time it has been pretty shocking, not as good as 2006-2009 at all.

It's a shame that EastEnders seems to suffer at the hands of incompetent producers, or rather ones that start off promising and fail towards the end. I hope SOC is a decent enough producer, I really do, EE needs a half decent producer who is consistent and has interesting storylines to tell. I dp like the show at the minute and think it's good but I can see how others don't feel the same way as the change in tone and pace really did change and it was noticeable. It's astounding how much he has divided opinions, on here especially but I hope that once his proper storylines kick in the show will be really good. DTC started off very promising, and as Katrina says 2014 was a good year. I loved how the show felt a lot like how it should, characters were getting decent stories and the Carters were a new family and weren't bogged down with storylines. It's a shame after Live Week it went crap and still was (is for some) bar the odd good period or episode.

I hate the way they bring back characters but you know they aren't going to stay. An example was Grant and also David.
Also they change characters personalities and have relations just moving in.
Louise for example is allowed to stay with Phil - as of Lisa would ever have allowed this!
The whole Grant and Mark revelation was dealt with terribly. 20 years this has been waiting to come out and that was it?
Also the way they set Masood up with every single middle aged white woman.
They ruined the Masood family.

i still cant get over this one. i suppose thats more down to DTC, but where the hell is Lisa??!!

Me neither. Not to even mention Lisa is ridiculous beyond words. She'd be apoplectic but all we got was one bizarre phone call that just raised more questions.

I can't believe that SOC won't try to resolve this loose end as he's worked through most of them but it's a right old mess and the situation just gets more unrealistic the longer it goes on.

It would be interesting to see Lisa back. Her interacting with Louise and the Mitchell's would be great but she could also have Mell come back via her which might be interesting,

Having watched EE since 1985 for me the golden era will always be 1986-1989. Hutchison, Harwood, Kirkwood and Newman were awful, Kirkwood the worst by far. Santer was good and so were some of DTC's efforts - at least he had the balls to bring back Kathy unlike other producers before him.

I'd love to see both back, Mel particularly. A great actor.

I just think Louise was showing her true Mitchell colours and Lisa couldn't cope. She was a pretty unhinged person anyway, this is the woman who did try and kil Phil. I think Lisa just came to the end of her tether and wiped her hands of Louise.

I struggle to comprehend how people seem to think Lisa wad this strong, loving, caring type. She wasn't. Any little bit of stress would cause a meltdown.

I wouldn't rule out Lisa being one of SOC's returnees. There's a reason for her being back on the show with Louise as a regular.

I hope not, I'm not really sure what Lisa could add. A guest appearance I could live with to tie up some loose ends, but I wouldn't want her back permanently.

I Hope we get new characters soon.

No, she wasn't but neither was she the sort of person to just give up, especially where losing out to Phil was involved.

In regards to Lisa, it would be great to have her back as Lucy Benjamin is a good actor - but didn't she and McFadden used to date? Maybe that's why producers are tetchy about it.

I also hope, and think, we'll get new characters in 2017. SOC has been maneuvering people out to bring people in.

The 2010s so far has been poor for interesting characters. Only Mick, Linda, Kush, Donna, Carmel and Vincent have been succesful from the decade so far. Mid noughties we had an influx of great new characters; Stacey, Denise, Max, Tanya, Shirley, Jay, Roxy, Ronnie, Jack, Bradley, Archie.

Hopefully O'Connor will really freshen things up with exciting actors and characters post-new year. There's been too much of a reliance of past characters since 2010 for me.

also if mel did come back her brother might visit, Alex the vicar, who once had an affair with kathy

I too have watched since the start & agree with the worst producers, but Louise Berridge started the rot (IMHO).

But we have seen her give up before, she does have form for abandoning Louise. Its nothing new.

I totally agree Damien. Been loving EastEnders since the new producer took over. The show (and the characters) are allowed to breathe naturally which allows the whole production to move at a more natural/realistic pace.

Keep up the excellent work BBC EastEnders.

Six months in and we still have no new regular characters yet.

I don't think SoC is ruining the show. I think the problem lies within the BBC itself. I reckon due to the licence fee issues and the fact the BBC has to pander to the government a lot more than it used to, it's leaving him with a very restrained budget and a lack of leeway.

The character writing has been brilliant - they feel more human and with Phil and the reaction to his diagnosis has played to Steve McFadden's strengths and given the character a bit more depth. We're now see the Kathy of old - fiery, and confident. I also think we are seeing the relationship with her and Ben develop as well. They've handled Lee's storyline well too, though I think they've wrote Whitney as a bit of an idiot with the way she has behaved. I know she's not the sharpest tool, but the Whitney of old would want answers not be telling half the Square or asking for Lauren to help her. Oh and btw, I think Lauren has been written decent - especially the friendship with Whitney.

Bin-gate and the Christmas play with Cassandra out of Fools and Horses - come on, even Julia Smith and Santer had banal storylines like this playing out. It's a bit of light humour.

Bar Monday's episode which saw Tilly Keeper step up to the plate and is a brilliant signing for the show, the last couple have been a bit naff but I do think we're seeing foundations settling.

Don't get me started on the wonky camerawork and some of the duff-duffs. It wasn't the best episode but it felt unfinished as it was abrupt.

Overall, it's been worse than this but about 75% of the time it is watchable.