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FIFA bans poppies on shirts for the England v Scotland match


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Old 20-11-2016, 12:59
The_don1
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See the glasgow derby
I am talking about the whole game not just one team (or a small number)

The connection between the Armed Services and football is there for anyone with a small knowledge of the history of the GAME to see and is also there between a massive number of clubs. That is why there is a place for things like this in the game

The connection between football and religion etc is of course there but nowhere near to the same degree as the one between Football and The Armed Services. Its much more important and that's why there is a place for it in the game
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Old 20-11-2016, 13:32
Deep Purple
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how about in non-political wars?

what else should football commemorate? perhaps a cross at easter?
Why do you keep coming up with stuff that isn't there?

Both FA's wanted this, and the players were all happy with, and the ceremony was superbly supported by most of the fans.
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Old 20-11-2016, 13:32
codeblue
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The connection between the Armed Services and football is there for anyone with a small knowledge of the history of the GAME to see and is also there between a massive number of clubs. That is why there is a place for things like this in the gamee
could you ever see an action by the UK military that football and its sponsors would want to distance itself from?
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Old 20-11-2016, 13:34
codeblue
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Why do you keep coming up with stuff that isn't there?

Both FA's wanted this, and the players were all happy with, and the ceremony was superbly supported by most of the fans.
Which went against the rules of Fifa.

Didnt football have ceremonies commemorating princess diana and michael jackson too?
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Old 20-11-2016, 13:38
The_don1
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could you ever see an action by the UK military that football and its sponsors would want to distance itself from?
Irreverent.

Having discussing what might and might not happen is about as relevant as many pointless comparisons that have been made in this topic. Its ignoring the topic and the points made in previous posts

You have continued to say there is no place for this sort of thing in football that clearly is as incorrect as you can get.

Take the recent Chelsea game where we paid our own tribute, With Chelsea's connection with the armed services etc, It was vital that we paid tribute in the way we did that was the most important aspect of that day. It more then had a place in the game
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Old 20-11-2016, 13:39
Deep Purple
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Which went against the rules of Fifa.

Didnt football have ceremonies commemorating princess diana and michael jackson too?
Football has silences and applause's for all manner of things these days, and I think they stretch it too far in some cases. Diana I can understand, and I dont know about Jackson. I dont remember that.

The poppy is a long standing tradition in this country, and many organisations dont have an issue with it, as there isn't one, apart from in the minds of the likes of you.
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Old 20-11-2016, 13:40
The_don1
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Which went against the rules of Fifa.

Didnt football have ceremonies commemorating princess diana and michael jackson too?
Once again please show connection between football (the game and not a club etc) and those occasions?

Oh and Fulham did pay tribute to Jackson, They placed a statue to him outside their ground.

Anymore incorrect statements you wish to make?
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Old 20-11-2016, 13:47
The_don1
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Which went against the rules of Fifa.

Didnt football have ceremonies commemorating princess diana and michael jackson too?
Both the English and Scottish FA are fully aware of it being against the rules and did so knowing they would be punished and felt it was more important then any punishment.

If the League did the same in club games I would hope that Chelsea would feel the same way as with regards to Chelsea they would be right to do so
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Old 20-11-2016, 14:43
ShaunIOW
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Poppies, and all other political and militaristic symbols should be kept out of sport.

It seems the English, as usual, think they are above the rules though.
Couldn't the National Flags and anthems also be described as political? Afterall there havce been diplomatic incidents over the wrong flags being displayed or anthems played.

That's because there is not the same connection between those two sports as there is between football.

Football and the armed services have always had more of a connection then you would find with many sports (Rugby is also a sport that's had a link with the armed services)
The is a strong connection between the armed sevices especially the Royal Navy and Portsmouth FC, and haven't the Royal Engineers been FA Cup winners?
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Old 20-11-2016, 15:09
roger_50
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Like some have already alluded to, there are aspects of football that are far more political than the poppy, which by international perceived definition isn't even a political icon anyway.

Some lyrics to certain anthems for example are basically nationalistic love letters that often declare a strong position on politics and religion - yet they can be boomed out in front of FIFA officials without a care in the world.

I think FIFA have lost the plot here. Well, they lost the plot a long time ago, but you know what I mean.
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Old 20-11-2016, 15:52
RichmondBlue
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The is a strong connection between the armed sevices especially the Royal Navy and Portsmouth FC, and haven't the Royal Engineers been FA Cup winners?
Same with Arsenal, originally named Woolwich Arsenal. They played in Woolwich the home of the Royal Arsenal.
Quote:
"It was famous because it was the adopted club of servicemen throughout the British Empire. Whether they had ever seen the Arsenal play, or whether they even knew where the club played was irrelevant. This was the club of the men who made the armaments that kept the soldiers and sailors alive. It was, deep in their hearts, their club."
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Old 20-11-2016, 16:13
CELT1987
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Once again please show connection between football (the game and not a club etc) and those occasions?

Oh and Fulham did pay tribute to Jackson, They placed a statue to him outside their ground.

Anymore incorrect statements you wish to make?
Did Jackson play for Fulham?
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Old 20-11-2016, 16:16
The_don1
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Did Jackson play for Fulham?
Nope but the question was asked did football pay tribute when Jackson died and the answer was yes, While yes the poster was trying to make some irrelevant comparison I think it should be pointed out that it did
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Old 20-11-2016, 17:05
Mark F
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Didn't Jackson die in June of 2009 so not sure any football would have been on?
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Old 20-11-2016, 18:58
mcg3
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Football has silences and applause's for all manner of things these days, and I think they stretch it too far in some cases. Diana I can understand, and I dont know about Jackson. I dont remember that.

The poppy is a long standing tradition in this country, and many organisations dont have an issue with it, as there isn't one, apart from in the minds of the likes of you.
Rules are rules regardless of what you think about them.

I would have thought that you of all people would understand this.

There's plenty rules and regulations i don't like but conform to them. If you break them, you face the penalties.

I don't believe for one minute that every single football player wanted to wear the poppy, but felt they had no choice in the matter, so much for freedom of choice.
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Old 20-11-2016, 20:27
Deep Purple
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Rules are rules regardless of what you think about them.

I would have thought that you of all people would understand this.

There's plenty rules and regulations i don't like but conform to them. If you break them, you face the penalties.

I don't believe for one minute that every single football player wanted to wear the poppy, but felt they had no choice in the matter, so much for freedom of choice.
Poppies are not banned under the rules, and many people believe they dont come within the rule FIFA has tried to impose.
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Old 20-11-2016, 21:27
Eurostar
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Rules are rules regardless of what you think about them.

I would have thought that you of all people would understand this.

There's plenty rules and regulations i don't like but conform to them. If you break them, you face the penalties.

I don't believe for one minute that every single football player wanted to wear the poppy, but felt they had no choice in the matter, so much for freedom of choice.
Wars by their very nature are political events. England seems to have a rather unhealthy attitude to them and to think that commemorating wars with military ceremonies and soldiers on the pitch before a football match is absolutely fine and not problematic in the slightest.

Bizarrely, none of these types of displays were happening in football 20 years ago when many men who had fought in WW2 were still alive and well. It seems to be a fairly recent phenomenon and the world football bodies not surprisingly are far from impressed.
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Old 20-11-2016, 22:46
Mr_Bee
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If the English, Scottish, Northern Irish and Welsh FAs feel so strongly, maybe they should bring it up at the next IFAB meeting. They get a vote on setting and amending the laws of the game. In the mean time, stop bitching and pay the fine that'll come.
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Old 21-11-2016, 08:28
codeblue
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Poppies are not banned under the rules, and many people believe they dont come within the rule FIFA has tried to impose.
Political symbols are.

Many people see poppies of reminders of illegal wars tony Blair led the uk into, and money making schemes by the legion.

Football should distance itself from them, and listen to FIFA.
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Old 21-11-2016, 09:06
Deep Purple
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Political symbols are.

Many people see poppies of reminders of illegal wars tony Blair led the uk into, and money making schemes by the legion.

Football should distance itself from them, and listen to FIFA.
And the vast majority of people see them for what they actually represent, and not something others are trying to hijack them for, for other reasons.
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Old 21-11-2016, 09:15
The_don1
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Political symbols are.

Many people see poppies of reminders of illegal wars tony Blair led the uk into, and money making schemes by the legion.

Football should distance itself from them, and listen to FIFA.
Many people see many things.

Just because "people" see things is not a reason to do or not do something.

This is not a reality TV show where what people think matters.

Yes today's society seems to think everyone's opinion matters (hence the childish behavior anytime any vote goes against them) due massively IMO to the internet and social media giving people a sense of entitlement.

Football has a deep historical connection to the armed services and when a sport has such a connection its important to maintain that link
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Old 21-11-2016, 10:02
codeblue
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And the vast majority of people see them for what they actually represent, and not something others are trying to hijack them for, for other reasons.
They ironically have been hijacked. They used to represent fallen soldiers who died fighting for our freedom in ww2 (or for zero reason in ww1)

Since ww2 no soldiers have died for the freedom of the uk, zero, zilch, not one. There is a massive difference between the two. Let me illustrate:

Conscripted "soldiers" fighting nazi soldiers in trenches in ww2 , going over the top, into certain death of machine gun fire.

Or paid mercenaries fighting a political war for oil and control of the middle east in Iraq2, Libya et al. Using air power, missiles, drones in an unfair fight.

I'm not donating a single bean to the latter.

Poppies represent both the best and the worst of the uk. Both at home and internationally. Soldiers should not be seen or have any place on a football pitch.

Let's just let football be football .
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Old 21-11-2016, 10:07
Deep Purple
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They ironically have been hijacked. They used to represent fallen soldiers who died fighting for our freedom in ww2 (or for zero reason in ww1)

Since ww2 no soldiers have died for the freedom of the uk, zero, zilch, not one. There is a massive difference between the two. Let me illustrate:

Conscripted "soldiers" fighting nazi soldiers in trenches in ww2 , going over the top, into certain death of machine gun fire.

Or paid mercenaries fighting a political war for oil and control of the middle east in Iraq2, Libya et al. Using air power, missiles, drones in an unfair fight.

I'm not donating a single bean to the latter.

Poppies represent both the best and the worst of the uk. Both at home and internationally. Soldiers should not be seen or have any place on a football pitch.

Let's just let football be football .
Talk about an over the top post, with a complete lack of understanding.

Keep your pound.
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Old 21-11-2016, 10:17
The_don1
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They ironically have been hijacked. They used to represent fallen soldiers who died fighting for our freedom in ww2 (or for zero reason in ww1)

Since ww2 no soldiers have died for the freedom of the uk, zero, zilch, not one. There is a massive difference between the two. Let me illustrate:

Conscripted "soldiers" fighting nazi soldiers in trenches in ww2 , going over the top, into certain death of machine gun fire.

Or paid mercenaries fighting a political war for oil and control of the middle east in Iraq2, Libya et al. Using air power, missiles, drones in an unfair fight.

I'm not donating a single bean to the latter.

Poppies represent both the best and the worst of the uk. Both at home and internationally. Soldiers should not be seen or have any place on a football pitch.

Let's just let football be football .
One of the saddest comments regarding the game and what the "modern" fan has become shows a lack of connection to the game.
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Old 21-11-2016, 11:45
codeblue
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How awful, what a terrible thing to say, to keep politics, religion, out of football.

This forum is baffling.
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