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Your All Time Ranking of the Housemates 2016 [Results Thread] |
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#776 |
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Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 7,505
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In what way was it a bad question? Why shouldn't Davina have asked it? Contestants in tv shows sometimes discuss splitting the prize, and in at least one case (The Search) they actually did it. In any case, I'm not blaming Rachel for not being able to come up with an answer; that would make no sense, since she did come up with an answer.
It seems a legitimate question to me. There was a conversation about splitting in the house, and Davina mentioned that, first asked the other HMs, and then asked Rachel if she'd considered it. Quote:
Someone saying they think they're dreaming in that sort of context is a bit of a cliché; they don't actually feel like they're dreaming.
It's just another way of saying that they can't believe it, that it doesn't feel real.[quote]A lot of people criticised her for the Saddam Hussein moment because she was so reluctant to express an opinion even about someone like that, and because her reason was that she didn't know him. (How does she manage to vote in elections, if she even does vote?) Maybe she doesn't, I don't know. It wouldn't be a bad thing if she doesn't. Quote:
It matters that I didn't say it was the only moment when she was like VT Rachel and instead that it was "the time she came closest to living up to the talkative image presented in her VT".
Well, to me that's what it sounded like, but from what you've said, it obviously wasn't.Quote:
Remember that in her VT Rachel said "I am annoying. I know I am, because I talk a lot" and a bit later "'cause people think I'm on drugs as well, just because I'm so energetic." I'd be surprised if there was anyone that would be as hyper as Rachel was in her VT literally every single waking moment of their life. There would be obviously be times when they'd be calmer or upset, (etc).Anyway, while there are times when Rachel was like something in her VT, I don't think it can be credibly maintained any more that in-house Rachel wasn't different from VT Rachel, because even Rachel's mother has given explanations for why she was different, and that wouldn't make sense if there was no difference. And I didn't say that Rachel was constantly like her VT when she was in the house. And yes, I've read accounts from both Rachel and her mother saying that she was quieter to how she normally was at times because of the nastiness and negativity that there was in that house. When most of the nastier HMs left and when it was just her and her close friends in the house, that's when the VT side of her came out. Quote:
I don't think anyone has even claimed that Rachel talked with Luke (or with various other HMs) in the way she did with Jen & Bex and with Lisa.
Like I said before, I don't know if Rachel ever spoke with Luke personally about how she didn't agree with his behaviour, (maybe other forum members can help?), but her saying that Luke was the HM she least wanted to win told me that she did not agree with the things he was doing. (Also, this would be why she nominated him several times).Quote:
Rachel had a long conversation with Lisa. I'm not absolutely sure it was the same one you're talking about, but it covered the things Rachel said she had a problem with. It was too long for all of it to be in the highlights, but some of it was, and BB even edited it misleadingly to make it seem Rachel had left Lisa speechless.
I think the conversation you're referring to is the night that Mario left and that Lisa had said that it wasn't fair that people who were being vocal were leaving and the quieter ones were staying. Rachel knew that she was referring to her because Mario had very recently said the same thing.The conversation I was referring to was later in the series, when Lisa broke out and returned the night that Nicole first arrived. Quote:
When Rachel said she'd said what she'd wanted to say, I think it's pretty clear that she meant she'd said what she wanted to say, and not that she'd said one thing she'd wanted to say but had a lot more to add to it so you'd better set aside half an hour for the rest. (Though to be fair, the first time Rachel said it, the one at the start of the video, it may have started up again because Stu arrived and someone (Stu?) said "what's the matter, like?") I think we'll have to agree to disagree on that one.In the early part of the conversation (so far as we can tell from the videos), there's nothing about "whispering" (contrary to numerous claims that that's what the talk was about). It's just about things like Bex being annoyed by Kat singing and saying (according to Rachel) that she didn't want a happy house. Bex says that isn't what she said; in any case, it isn't what she meant, and Jen agrees, adding "what she's saying is she doesn't want people going happy happy house and she doesn't want it to be a false environment". Rachel really doesn't seem to get that Happy House can be annoying; she says "I like Kat singing, and other people like Kat singing; Kat singing cheers people up." I don't think there's any time in the whole long conversation where Rachel shows she understands that it can be annoying or that it's impossible to get away from it in so small a house. (And by that point in bb9, it looked like Happy House was sometimes being deliberately sung as a way to wind up the HMs who didn't like it.) Rachel saying "just walk away" shows she doesn't get it (or is pretending not to). You cannot walk far enough away, in the BB house, so that you won't hear it. I think Jen explains it pretty well. There's what I quoted above; and, also about what Bex meant, "she wants everyone to be themselves and be normal and not purposely try to be happy when really you're not." Plus this: "when you live with someone for 24 hours a day there's no way of getting out of this house, and when people are like purposely repeating and singing the same thing over and over again -- it could be any song, it could be any song in the world, and eventually it's going to wind you up to a certain extent." Rachel didn't -- or couldn't -- or wouldn't -- take it in. Quote:
In any case, I don't agree at all that Rex saying that meant that the conversation was about people one meets in person, and I don't think anyone has even claimed before that it was about that. The idea that the only alternative to that is '"talking heads" on one's telly' is absurd, especially since Saddam Hussein and Margaret Thatcher aren't normally described in that way. Indeed, I'm pretty sure I've never seen them described that way before just now.
It's very telling that the way Rachel's defended changes in such ways. It's like the arguments defending her don't matter -- no one actually believes them -- all that matters is that somehow Rachel can seem to be exonerated in the end, or that the waters are muddied. ![]() * * * Right. I've just spent the time to watch it AGAIN. And what Rex just before "Saddam Hussein" was "Do you like everyone in the world?" When Rachel looked pained at that, and didn't answer, Rex asked about Saddam. After Rachel struggled with that, with the excuse that she didn't know enough about him as a person, Rex said he'd give another example, and Rachel said "someone not controversial". That's when Dale tried Maggie Thatcher, and Rachel still looked pained.The wider subject was Rachel's fence-sitting and lack of opinions. It wasn't even confined to people, let alone to people Rachel had met in person. There wasn't even anything that made it seem that Rachel thought the conversation was about people one meets in person. So I hope that's the last we see of that defence attempt. ![]() In the clips that have been referred to, (which btw, in response to SpecialFried, used to be available to watch on YouTube, but now can't be in the UK), Rachel said that she dislikes certain things that people do, but that doesn't necessarily mean that she'd dislike them as a person. Someone who sees the good in people is a good quality to have. If the world had more people like that, it would be a much nicer place. Rachel, as confirmed by her mother on BBLB, likes to think things over and looks at situations and weighs them up before making a judgement. And why should she jump in and voice her opinions on certain things if she doesn't want to? If Rachel's happy with the way she lives her life, and doesn't care if others don't like it, then what's the problem? |
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#777 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hello Summer, Goodbye
Posts: 3,384
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Quote:
In the clips that have been referred to, (which btw, in response to SpecialFried, used to be available to watch on YouTube, but now can't be in the UK), Rachel said that she dislikes certain things that people do, but that doesn't necessarily mean that she'd dislike them as a person. Someone who sees the good in people is a good quality to have. If the world had more people like that, it would be a much nicer place.
BTW as I talked about earlier, are you aware of any of this being televised anywhere other than on LF? As far as I know, it wasn't. |
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#778 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 7,505
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Thanks yes, I've got the clips saved to hard drive. Looking at the footage again, it subsequently goes into birdsong for over a minute with an on-screen caption saying that the HMs are talking abut people outside the House. So maybe Rex did come up with another "example".
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BTW as I talked about earlier, are you aware of any of this being televised anywhere other than on LF? As far as I know, it wasn't.
The only thing that was shown was bits right from the very start: https://youtu.be/of7rxNn__fY?t=43m7s
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#779 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hello Summer, Goodbye
Posts: 3,384
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Quote:
Maybe he did. Also, towards the start of the second part, it goes into birdsong for nearly a minute again and when it comes back, Rachel says: "Everything happens for a reason. I don't hate him. Everything he did to me, I don't hate him because at the end of the day, he made me appreciate the person I'm with". Rex had wanted to know if there were any people in the world that she hated. From what she said when the birdsong came back, I don't know for sure, but it sounds like she was talking about an ex boyfriend of hers before she then met her now husband.
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The only thing that was shown was bits right from the very start: https://youtu.be/of7rxNn__fY?t=43m7s
Thanks, I hadn't realised that some of this made it to the HLs.
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I've just spent the time to watch it AGAIN. 