This Clifton-bashing thread is looking interchangeable with a Clinton-bashing thread. Get the e-mails out.
Joanne and Karen acting unprofessionally?
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Originally Posted by Dervlathedog:
“Oh, I got you wrong.
I thought you meant Jo and Karen only ever cheered for Kevin (and none of the others) but you mean that they alone cheer for him??
I give up!! I'm confusing myself now and, honestly, having watched it back, I'm surprised that two demob happy women have caused such a long debate.
”
“Oh, I got you wrong.
I thought you meant Jo and Karen only ever cheered for Kevin (and none of the others) but you mean that they alone cheer for him??I give up!! I'm confusing myself now and, honestly, having watched it back, I'm surprised that two demob happy women have caused such a long debate.
”
You're as confused as I am!!
What a way to spend your life.
Ok, even as someone who usually defends the Cliftons, I agree that the undermarked shouting was a misjudgement on the part of Joanne and Karen and they shouldn't have done it.
However Kevin behaves perfectly well there, and tbh, I'm more interested in what that exchange between Kevin and Natalie (and Anton) was all about than Joanne and Karen's shenanigans!
.
However Kevin behaves perfectly well there, and tbh, I'm more interested in what that exchange between Kevin and Natalie (and Anton) was all about than Joanne and Karen's shenanigans!
.
Originally Posted by Fuchsia Groan:
“You're as confused as I am!!
What a way to spend your life.”
“You're as confused as I am!!
What a way to spend your life.
”
Let's rebel and run amok!
I'm sure two de-mob happy forumers can create a bit of a stir
Originally Posted by Dervlathedog:
“Let's rebel and run amok! I'm sure two de-mob happy forumers can create a bit of a stir”
“Let's rebel and run amok!
I'm sure two de-mob happy forumers can create a bit of a stir”
On here??? No one will notice the difference.
Originally Posted by Dervlathedog:
“Let's rebel and run amok! I'm sure two de-mob happy forumers can create a bit of a stir”
“Let's rebel and run amok!
I'm sure two de-mob happy forumers can create a bit of a stir”
Someone will open a thread and we'll get ripped to pieces.
Originally Posted by Fudd:
“On here??? No one will notice the difference.”
“On here??? No one will notice the difference.
”
Is there anything left in the outrageous coffers?
Oh well, maybe we'll have to go all Measure for Measure and be oooober sober. That'll stand out
Originally Posted by Fuchsia Groan:
“Someone will open a thread and we'll get ripped to pieces.”
“Someone will open a thread and we'll get ripped to pieces.
”
Not you. You've got a Castle. They'll drown in the moat while you pelt them with stuff from the lavvy
Originally Posted by Ann_Dancer:
“Ok, even as someone who usually defends the Cliftons, I agree that the undermarked shouting was a misjudgement on the part of Joanne and Karen and they shouldn't have done it.
However Kevin behaves perfectly well there, and tbh, I'm more interested in what that exchange between Kevin and Natalie (and Anton) was all about than Joanne and Karen's shenanigans!.”
“Ok, even as someone who usually defends the Cliftons, I agree that the undermarked shouting was a misjudgement on the part of Joanne and Karen and they shouldn't have done it.
However Kevin behaves perfectly well there, and tbh, I'm more interested in what that exchange between Kevin and Natalie (and Anton) was all about than Joanne and Karen's shenanigans!
.”
The pair of them just looked a bit lairy to me. I've done far worse on a Big Night Out.
What exchange? Was this at the same time?
Originally Posted by Dervlathedog:
“Not you. You've got a Castle. They'll drown in the moat while you pelt them with stuff from the lavvy”
“Not you. You've got a Castle. They'll drown in the moat while you pelt them with stuff from the lavvy”
Sh*t - how do I answer that? Oops looks like I have done.
Originally Posted by Fuchsia Groan:
“The pair of them just looked a bit lairy to me. I've done far worse on a Big Night Out.
What exchange? Was this at the same time?”
“The pair of them just looked a bit lairy to me. I've done far worse on a Big Night Out.
What exchange? Was this at the same time?”
Yes, just after the scores and the shouting from Karen and Joanne.
How sad am I watching it again? I said I wasn't going to do that after giving in and tracking Kevin's Clauditorium placements the other week. I'm really disappointed with myself.
😳🙄😔 😖
I need to write 100 lines: 'If you didn't notice it first time round then it really doesn't matter.' ✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻
Originally Posted by Ann_Dancer:
“Yes, just after the scores and the shouting from Karen and Joanne.
How sad am I watching it again? I said I wasn't going to do that after giving in and tracking Kevin's Clauditorium placements the other week. I'm really disappointed with myself.
😳🙄😔 😖
I need to write 100 lines: 'If you didn't notice it first time round then it really doesn't matter.' ✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻”
“Yes, just after the scores and the shouting from Karen and Joanne.
How sad am I watching it again? I said I wasn't going to do that after giving in and tracking Kevin's Clauditorium placements the other week. I'm really disappointed with myself.
😳🙄😔 😖
I need to write 100 lines: 'If you didn't notice it first time round then it really doesn't matter.' ✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻”
Just looked like banter - Anton patted Kevin on the back after the marks were given, and I think Kevin thought Natalie had done it. Banter ensued between the three of them - nothing sinister by the look of it.
Originally Posted by Fuchsia Groan:
“Just looked like banter - Anton patted Kevin on the back after the marks were given, and I think Kevin thought Natalie had done it. Banter ensued - nothing sinister by the look of it.”
“Just looked like banter - Anton patted Kevin on the back after the marks were given, and I think Kevin thought Natalie had done it. Banter ensued - nothing sinister by the look of it.”
Yes, I agree it was good natured. I think you're probably right.
Originally Posted by Ann_Dancer:
“I need to write 100 lines: 'If you didn't notice it first time round then it really doesn't matter.' ✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻”
“I need to write 100 lines: 'If you didn't notice it first time round then it really doesn't matter.' ✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻✍🏻”
I normally miss everything and go back for a look if I read anything on here. I did however notice Jo (although Karen was not so obvious) and I did think she was OTT.
You can hear Anton mutter something through his teeth under his breath as Claudia reads out the voting numbers, and that's what Kevin and Natalie are laughing at. No idea what it is though.
Originally Posted by LaughingSock:
“I could be wrong, but usually when it's the other kind of "undermarked" yelling, it tends to be a huge crowd so maybe they're lost in the chaos.
But it's funny how when they do it for Kevin and whoever he's partnered with, it's fairly obvious because nobody else is doing it.
It kind of skews the impression when it sticks out like a sore thumb like that.”
“I could be wrong, but usually when it's the other kind of "undermarked" yelling, it tends to be a huge crowd so maybe they're lost in the chaos.
But it's funny how when they do it for Kevin and whoever he's partnered with, it's fairly obvious because nobody else is doing it.
It kind of skews the impression when it sticks out like a sore thumb like that.”
Surely your first paragraph disproves what you pretty much stated as fact in your previous post? There's almost always a lot of cheering involving everyone - i.e. including Jo and Karen. So quite how you can claim they don't support anyone else (which is the implication from your original post) I have no idea, and I think it's a bit disingenuous and unfair to them.
And I think your second paragraph is untrue as well - there have been plenty of instances in the past where lots of people have been shouting support for Kevin and his celeb partner - whether it's "undermarked" "10, 10, 10" or just general cheering is irrelevant - it's all support.
Quite how anyone can ignore all of that and claim that family members supporting each other means they're some sort of exclusive clique never joined by anyone else nor supporting anyone else is beyond me.
Originally Posted by Mystical123:
“Surely your first paragraph disproves what you pretty much stated as fact in your previous post?”
“Surely your first paragraph disproves what you pretty much stated as fact in your previous post?”
As factual as I can be without standing right in the room, yes. If you can tell me you've been in the room and know better, go for it.
Originally Posted by marieantoinette:
“It's interesting isn't it. I work with two couples in my job (both met a work and have stayed together) in a small department of 16 and they go out of their way to avoid this sort of 'favouritism'. They go out of their way to remain neutral on their partners' decisions/suggestions because they know this can make other people feel very uncomfortable/ganged up on/excluded. I have no idea what is said at home, but in the workplace they are as neutral as they can be - and so no one feels it's a issue.
If Joanne and Karen were calling out about Greg or Daisy, I can get that. But surely they can see it isn't appropriate to do this for their family? Clearly they are biased, so their comments look silly; and it creates an atmosphere with the other contestants.
If they were in my workplace, someone would take them aside and tell them (nicely) to grow up.”
“It's interesting isn't it. I work with two couples in my job (both met a work and have stayed together) in a small department of 16 and they go out of their way to avoid this sort of 'favouritism'. They go out of their way to remain neutral on their partners' decisions/suggestions because they know this can make other people feel very uncomfortable/ganged up on/excluded. I have no idea what is said at home, but in the workplace they are as neutral as they can be - and so no one feels it's a issue.
If Joanne and Karen were calling out about Greg or Daisy, I can get that. But surely they can see it isn't appropriate to do this for their family? Clearly they are biased, so their comments look silly; and it creates an atmosphere with the other contestants.
If they were in my workplace, someone would take them aside and tell them (nicely) to grow up.”
Thank you very much for explaining what I tried to convey in my previous messages (I used the expression "professional environment" instead of "working place"). I am not sure whether people did not read them to the end or whether some of the responders had no idea what a "professional environment" means...
Originally Posted by LaughingSock:
“As factual as I can be without standing right in the room, yes. If you can tell me you've been in the room and know better, go for it.”
“As factual as I can be without standing right in the room, yes. If you can tell me you've been in the room and know better, go for it.”
I don't need to be in the room - as you said yourself, there are lots of cheers from the whole group for contestants all the time, so the clear implication from that is that Joanne and Karen do support people other than Kevin as well. That much is obvious from watching any of the live shows anyway, so I'm not sure how anyone can claim they're not supportive of others.
Admittedly I haven't read the whole thread but surely as the marks are awarded to the contestant then their praise and encouragement was for Louise. This ties in with what I read somewhere else...that the Clifton's have been rallying round to boost Louise's confidence. It's a long time since I've seen someone who's lost themselves so completely, although I think Daisy was not far behind her.
Originally Posted by LaughingSock:
“As factual as I can be without standing right in the room, yes. If you can tell me you've been in the room and know better, go for it.”
“As factual as I can be without standing right in the room, yes. If you can tell me you've been in the room and know better, go for it.”
To be Judgey for a mo... the burden of proof lies with you since the original and rather bold claim is yours. Plus you're speaking for the Prosecution.
I've watched Kavanagh
(I'm an expert)
I'm of the view that everyone should get equal support (preferably before they go out and perform) and that no co competitors are judgemental; you congratulate everyone and find something positive to say. It is for the judges and public to be judgemental. So I don't like the undermarked shouting from anyone (particularly in support of a highly marked celeb/pro couple) because if no one shouts 'undermarked' for a couple it looks unsupportive by default
When I started medallist competitions some years ago, I experienced inadvertent cliquiness (is that a word?) in that I was a private lesson competitor and others were from group lessons. It felt quite alienating. I emphasise that my behaviour was by no means perfect. You become less sensitive to others' emotions when the adrenaline is pumping. I found that being supportive to others gives a feelgood feeling and is beneficial to your own performance, but I think that supportiveness has to be across the board. So I do feel Jo and Karen went too far in making a big thing of Kevin/Louise's marking, even though I'm not suggesting that they are not generally supportive of all the celebs.
When I started medallist competitions some years ago, I experienced inadvertent cliquiness (is that a word?) in that I was a private lesson competitor and others were from group lessons. It felt quite alienating. I emphasise that my behaviour was by no means perfect. You become less sensitive to others' emotions when the adrenaline is pumping. I found that being supportive to others gives a feelgood feeling and is beneficial to your own performance, but I think that supportiveness has to be across the board. So I do feel Jo and Karen went too far in making a big thing of Kevin/Louise's marking, even though I'm not suggesting that they are not generally supportive of all the celebs.
Originally Posted by Ann_Dancer:
“I'm of the view that everyone should get equal support (preferably before they go out and perform) and that no co competitors are judgemental; you congratulate everyone and find something positive to say. It is for the judges and public to be judgemental. So I don't like the undermarked shouting from anyone (particularly in support of a highly marked celeb/pro couple) because if no one shouts 'undermarked' for a couple it looks unsupportive by default
When I started medallist competitions some years ago, I experienced inadvertent cliquiness (is that a word?) in that I was a private lesson competitor and others were from group lessons. It felt quite alienating. I emphasise that my behaviour was by no means perfect. You become less sensitive to others' emotions when the adrenaline is pumping. I found that being supportive to others gives a feelgood feeling and is beneficial to your own performance, but I think that supportiveness has to be across the board. So I do feel Jo and Karen went too far in making a big thing of Kevin/Louise's marking, even though I'm not suggesting that they are not generally supportive of all the celebs.”
“I'm of the view that everyone should get equal support (preferably before they go out and perform) and that no co competitors are judgemental; you congratulate everyone and find something positive to say. It is for the judges and public to be judgemental. So I don't like the undermarked shouting from anyone (particularly in support of a highly marked celeb/pro couple) because if no one shouts 'undermarked' for a couple it looks unsupportive by default
When I started medallist competitions some years ago, I experienced inadvertent cliquiness (is that a word?) in that I was a private lesson competitor and others were from group lessons. It felt quite alienating. I emphasise that my behaviour was by no means perfect. You become less sensitive to others' emotions when the adrenaline is pumping. I found that being supportive to others gives a feelgood feeling and is beneficial to your own performance, but I think that supportiveness has to be across the board. So I do feel Jo and Karen went too far in making a big thing of Kevin/Louise's marking, even though I'm not suggesting that they are not generally supportive of all the celebs.”
I think I said in either this or another thread that it reminded me of the Dance school comps where fav contestants were cheered with undermarked even with reall good marks and kids lower down the ladder were not given much encouragement, it was not nice or sportsman like
we made a decision and said if you cannot cheer for all you do not cheer at all
it didnt go down well with the cliquey kids but they had to accept it
I like the Cliftons (there seems to be a lot of them) but yes it seems a bit insular with them. Give it a rest Clifties .....it's not all about you lot
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