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Freeview with 4K tuners?


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Old 13-11-2016, 13:33
zandar
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Are the Freeview tuners in present day televisions & PVR’s able to receive future 4K transmissions?
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Old 13-11-2016, 14:47
chrisjr
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Strictly speaking the tuner has nothing to do with what video format the TV can receive. It is the stages after the tuner that determine whether or not the TV can receive different broadcast formats.

It is extremely unlikely that any current TV has the necessary circuitry to decode a 4k broadcast. Mainly because there are no 4k broadcasts. And I'm not even sure there is anything more than an experimental standard for 4k broadcasts anyway.
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Old 14-11-2016, 07:48
zandar
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So, it would appear that all the people who are purchasing the 4K sets which are displayed with the super pictures coming off a hard drive, are really being conned?
Even if BBC, ITV etc. did start broadcasting in 4K, televisions purchased today would not be able to show such pictures by just plugging in the aerial.
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Old 15-11-2016, 09:23
figrin_dan
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They are, in fact, "4k ready".
Although if they used that term people would call it "not real 4k" and wait for Full4k.
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Old 15-11-2016, 12:26
soulboy77
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Don't hold your breath. 4K channels transmitted on terrestrial are unlikely for a long while because of the limited overall capacity across the muxes. Why have one 4K channel when you can have several other lower definitions? I can though see the BBC doing a test transmission if a new mux became available, in advance of more permanent channel launches and moves filling it up.
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Old 15-11-2016, 15:39
howard h
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Don't hold your breath. 4K channels transmitted on terrestrial are unlikely for a long while because of the limited overall capacity across the muxes. Why have one 4K channel when you can have several other lower definitions? I can though see the BBC doing a test transmission if a new mux became available, in advance of more permanent channel launches and moves filling it up.
If we could get all the channels broadcasting in HD (not even full HD) that would be a start. How many channels @ 720 could freeview handle?
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Old 15-11-2016, 16:16
chrisjr
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If we could get all the channels broadcasting in HD (not even full HD) that would be a start. How many channels @ 720 could freeview handle?
As many as you like. Resolution is only one factor. The data compression used is the bigger factor in determining how many channels you can squeeze into the available bandwidth.

If every mux was converted to DVB-T2 spec and you compressed the life out of the video getting them down to about 1Mb/s then you'd get 40 or so channels per mux. Mind you HD compressed down to 1Mb/s is likely to be pretty rubbish quality.

As ever the trade off is quality against quantity. Increase the quality and quantity goes down and vice versa.
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Old 15-11-2016, 22:17
Greebo
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... I can though see the BBC doing a test transmission if a new mux became available, in advance of more permanent channel launches and moves filling it up.
The test happened in 2014 on what was then an empty COM8 - http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1974497 , there's no chance of any space for a terrestrial UHD channel in the foreseeable future.
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Old 15-11-2016, 23:44
Colin_London
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The BBC has already said that they will launch 4K first via iPlayer, and I suspect that will be the only platform for some time.....

http://www.digitalspy.com/tech/news/...efore-your-tv/
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Old 15-11-2016, 23:55
Night Crawler
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As I understand it all TV's that satisfy phase 1 specs will have HEVC compatible tuners which would be able to receive and deliver a 4k broadcast at today's standard.

Panasonic were the first to release such a TV in the last quarter of 2014.

https://www.avforums.com/news/dvb-br...-BBC-SKY.10488
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Old 16-11-2016, 07:44
soulboy77
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The test happened in 2014 on what was then an empty COM8 - http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1974497 , there's no chance of any space for a terrestrial UHD channel in the foreseeable future.
I had forgotten about that!
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Old 17-11-2016, 12:03
David (2)
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The current 4K (UHD) tv's can display a 4K picture, but only with the aid of an external 4K device - such as a sky Q box or a 4K bluray player, or 4K content from the Internet.
any future 4K freeview, freesat, cable boxes will also work.

At some point in the future, we might see 4K (UHD) tv's with built in 4K freeview/freesat.


No different to what happened with HD. My old, full HD tv only has the plain freeview decoder built in, so to get freeview HD channels requires a freeview HD box.
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Old 17-11-2016, 16:57
grahamlthompson
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The current 4K (UHD) tv's can display a 4K picture, but only with the aid of an external 4K device - such as a sky Q box or a 4K bluray player, or 4K content from the Internet.
any future 4K freeview, freesat, cable boxes will also work.

At some point in the future, we might see 4K (UHD) tv's with built in 4K freeview/freesat.


No different to what happened with HD. My old, full HD tv only has the plain freeview decoder built in, so to get freeview HD channels requires a freeview HD box.
There are already UHD TV's with the capability to watch broadcast UHD satellite TV and a test/demo channel from SES Astra on 28.2E. Some of these can access this on channel 998 on the freesat epg.
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Old 17-11-2016, 19:17
chrisy
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There are already UHD TV's with the capability to watch broadcast UHD satellite TV and a test/demo channel from SES Astra on 28.2E. Some of these can access this on channel 998 on the freesat epg.
The latest D-Book mandates HEVC. I think it's mainly for hbbTV (Freeview Play), and not having access to a copy I can't say whether it includes any requirements for HEVC over DVB-T2, 4K or otherwise.
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Old 19-11-2016, 20:10
Richardcoulter
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The current 4K (UHD) tv's can display a 4K picture, but only with the aid of an external 4K device - such as a sky Q box or a 4K bluray player, or 4K content from the Internet.
any future 4K freeview, freesat, cable boxes will also work.

At some point in the future, we might see 4K (UHD) tv's with built in 4K freeview/freesat.


No different to what happened with HD. My old, full HD tv only has the plain freeview decoder built in, so to get freeview HD channels requires a freeview HD box.
I have a Virgin Media 4K box (V6) which will start being rolled out vrom 1 December.
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Old 20-11-2016, 16:33
_ben
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I have a Virgin Media 4K box (V6) which will start being rolled out vrom 1 December.
Are Virgin Media planning to broadcast any 4k channels, or just internet streaming?
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Old 21-11-2016, 08:46
Nigel Goodwin
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Are Virgin Media planning to broadcast any 4k channels, or just internet streaming?
They don't 'broadcast' any channels
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Old 27-11-2016, 16:44
kasg
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So, it would appear that all the people who are purchasing the 4K sets which are displayed with the super pictures coming off a hard drive, are really being conned?
It's not as bad as all the HD and HD-ready Freeview sets being sold that did not include a DVB-T2 decoder, when such things were available for a few extra quid. 4K sets already cost what HD sets did about a year ago so I don't think it's a big deal.
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Old 12-12-2016, 12:33
vgmf
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BT Youview do a 4K box
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Old 12-12-2016, 13:11
chrisjr
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BT Youview do a 4K box
But only for the streaming channels.
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Old 12-12-2016, 14:59
nigelb1972
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But only for the streaming channels.
They don't stream, they distribute using Multicast technology....
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Old 12-12-2016, 15:06
chrisjr
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They don't stream, they distribute using Multicast technology....
The definition of streaming is a user receiving a continuous flow of audio and/or video data from a service provider to be listened to or watched immediately.

Multicast is a method of providing those audio/video streams.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streaming_media
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Old 12-12-2016, 17:20
GDK
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Is it known on which or how many platforms a 4K capable BBC iPlayer will be made available?

If you have a smart UHD/4K TV now, it should be possible to install the upgraded BBC iPlayer app. Provided the BBC made it available for the OS on your TV.
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Old 12-12-2016, 17:54
Greebo
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Is it known on which or how many platforms a 4K capable BBC iPlayer will be made available?

If you have a smart UHD/4K TV now, it should be possible to install the upgraded BBC iPlayer app. Provided the BBC made it available for the OS on your TV.
The models that are currently testing are listed http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/help/planet_earth_4k - initial ones as I post this are Panasonic 2015/2016. This is for a 4 minute test video so don't get too excited if your TV is or isn't yet included!

And yes, this is UHD via the internet, not delivered by Freeview which is unlikely to have any broadcast UHD due to bandwidth limitations.
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Old 12-12-2016, 22:39
GDK
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The models that are currently testing are listed http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/help/planet_earth_4k - initial ones as I post this are Panasonic 2015/2016. This is for a 4 minute test video so don't get too excited if your TV is or isn't yet included!

And yes, this is UHD via the internet, not delivered by Freeview which is unlikely to have any broadcast UHD due to bandwidth limitations.
Thanks for the link. I see all the TVs listed there for now are Panasonic. I have 2016 LG model, so I hope support for LG's WebOS 3.0 will arrive in due course.

I understand it will be streamed, like Amazon Prime Video and Netflix. I won't be holding my breath for 4K terrestrial broadcasts!
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