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Footballers historical abuse
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francie
30-11-2016
Originally Posted by laurielou:
“It was "Jackie Wilson Said" by Dexy's Midnight Runners. Famously, TOTP mistook "Jackie" for "Jockey "and stuck up a huge picture of the latter by the stage while they were performing the song. I remember watching it as a kid at the time and thinking - mmm, not sure the song is meant to be about him...”

Easy mistake to make, they could have passed as twins.
dee123
30-11-2016
Originally Posted by Tellystar:
“A stupid , unfair and ignorant comment from you
I am not saying it shouldn't be on the news,
I said it shouldn't be continually dominating the news, when it was already known about for years”

Please. It was known in certain circles and outside of that as just gossip and innuendo. Not anymore. Hence why it's news.

As for something being "stupid, unfair and ignorant" well that's a pretty good way to describe this thread being started.
Richardcoulter
30-11-2016
Originally Posted by SULLA:
“The vast majoity of people who coach youngsters are good people but there have always been a few who will abuse their power to explain to some kids what they need to do to get in the team and stay in the team.

These are the people who should now be concentrated on.”

I'm sure that the vast majority of adults involving themselves with children are doing it with honourable intentions, but these aren't the ones to worry about or concentrate on.

The vast majority of people aren't paedophiles, but the public would be horrified to know the number of people who are sexually excited by under age people of all ages.

If any men reading this has suffered sex abuse as a child, three organisations that might be able to help are:

M power https://helplines.org/helplines/mpower/

Survivors UK https://www.survivorsuk.org

National Association for people who have been abused in childhood http://napac.org.uk

Help organisations are saying that one good thing about the latest revelations is that it involves football, which a lot of men can relate to, so they are finding that men who have kept this to themselves for many years feel a little more comfortable discussing it many years later.

These organisations have people who have suffered abuse themselves. I'm sure that it must help to be an to speak to someone who can truly understand the effects of sexual abuse in childhood.
Landis
30-11-2016
We cannot keep moving from "Don't believe the Children" to "Believe the Children" and then back again.

Soap Actor: Don't Believe the Children
Politicians: Don't Believe the Children
Football Coaches: Believe the Children.

What will happen if a former Child Footballer phones the help line and his name just happens to be "Nick"?
Richardcoulter
01-12-2016
Wow, 860 footballers have now reported being sexually abused, including David Restock from Newcastle United

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-38157275
Grafenwalder
01-12-2016
And another one on Channel 4 news tonight. This pervert has gone to his grave but the numbers calling in are rising daily. 17 police forces now involved and already said to be the biggest child sex abuse inquiry known.

https://www.channel4.com/news/rapid-...se-allegations
Richardcoulter
02-12-2016
Ex Chelsea player Gary Johnson now saying that he was paid £50,000 to keep quiet about being abused

Child sex abuse seems to be much larger than anybody ever imagined.

An ITV poll said that 86% of people had either been sexually abused as a child, or knew someone that had.

After Savile and sport, it makes you wonder which industry will be next
shaddler
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by Richardcoulter:
“An ITV poll said that 86% of people had either been sexually abused as a child, or knew someone that had.(”

Are you sure about that? 86% sounds very high and I can't find the poll you speak of.
Richardcoulter
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by shaddler:
“Are you sure about that? 86% sounds very high and I can't find the poll you speak of.”

It's shockingly high isn't it.

It was announced here:

http://www.itv.com/loosewomen

Should now be on the ITV Hub if you want to watch it
johnF1971
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by Richardcoulter:
“An ITV poll said that 86% of people had either been sexually abused as a child, or knew someone that had.”

Seems to me like ITV are trying to sensationalize the issue by including "knew someone that had" in the percentage. What exactly is that supposed to mean?

Why not just give the actual percentage of people who've been abused as a child or would that not have the shock factor they're looking for?
Grafenwalder
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by johnF1971:
“Seems to me like ITV are trying to sensationalize the issue by including "knew someone that had" in the percentage. What exactly is that supposed to mean?

Why not just give the actual percentage of people who've been abused as a child or would that not have the shock factor they're looking for? ”

They may have confused it with the 860 figure which is the number of calls the NSPCC has received in just one week. It seems safe to say it's certainly more widespread than first realised and growing daily.

Bennell's crimes are at the worst possible end of the scale raping and abusing young boys though i suspect there were more than him involved.

I was disappointed though not surprised to hear the latest revelation of a footballer being paid off at £50k by a club to keep his mouth shut. That makes them complicit.
Deep Purple
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by Landis:
“We cannot keep moving from "Don't believe the Children" to "Believe the Children" and then back again.

Soap Actor: Don't Believe the Children
Politicians: Don't Believe the Children
Football Coaches: Believe the Children.

What will happen if a former Child Footballer phones the help line and his name just happens to be "Nick"?”

Whenever something is in the news, certain people join in, and because of the problems of recent such cases, extra care needs to be taken to ensure that the genuine complaints are addressed, and that the likes of "Nick" are sifted out, but that's easier said than done.
MikeJW
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by Landis:
“We cannot keep moving from "Don't believe the Children" to "Believe the Children" and then back again.

Soap Actor: Don't Believe the Children
Politicians: Don't Believe the Children
Football Coaches: Believe the Children.

What will happen if a former Child Footballer phones the help line and his name just happens to be "Nick"?”

Don't worry, the "they're only in it for the compo" crowd will be along in force soon.
GusGus
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by MikeJW:
“Don't worry, the "they're only in it for the compo" crowd will be along in force soon.”


What makes you think they're not here?
MikeJW
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by GusGus:
“What makes you think they're not here?”

That's why I said "in force".
Grafenwalder
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by Deep Purple:
“Whenever something is in the news, certain people join in, and because of the problems of recent such cases, extra care needs to be taken to ensure that the genuine complaints are addressed, and that the likes of "Nick" are sifted out, but that's easier said than done.”

"Nick", previously said by Scotland Yard to be "credible and true", is now under investigation for attempting to pervert the course of justice.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...d-live-updates

What has made this case so different imo (apart from the sheer scale) is the men have waived the right to anonymity and gone openly public. Of course all the men were young boys at the time, some very young.
Grafenwalder
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by MikeJW:
“Don't worry, the "they're only in it for the compo" crowd will be along in force soon.”

Unfortunately that's always trotted out but generally where there is doubt. I don't believe that to be the case here with this.
benjamini
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by Grafenwalder:
“Unfortunately that's always trotted out but generally where there is doubt. I don't believe that to be the case here with this.”

Since I believe that most of the children /teens reporting abuse regardless of the circumstance , be it football coaches , media stars or uncles I find your inference odd. In what way have these guy have more veracity ?
This isn't a top trump situation, this is a sickness that has blighted children and teens from all walks of life. Girls and boys.
There will always be. A tiny minority who will try to capitalise on it from all sections.
They don't really matter in the scheme of things, believing children , all children is paramount.
Why have you said that " in this instance " they should be believed ?
academia
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by Grafenwalder:
“Unfortunately that's always trotted out but generally where there is doubt. I don't believe that to be the case here with this.o”

Why have you no doubt? When do you have doubt, in which cases?
Armi
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by Richardcoulter:
“Ex Chelsea player Gary Johnson now saying that he was paid £50,000 to keep quiet about being abused

Child sex abuse seems to be much larger than anybody ever imagined.

An ITV poll said that 86% of people had either been sexually abused as a child, or knew someone that had.

After Savile and sport, it makes you wonder which industry will be next ”

Car manufacturing?

Royal Mail?

Coal Mining?
benjamini
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by academia:
“Why have you no doubt? When do you have doubt, in which cases?”

Oh I think it moving the goal posts to accommodate a particular set of prejudices.
Grafenwalder
02-12-2016
Originally Posted by benjamini:
“Since I believe that most of the children /teens reporting abuse regardless of the circumstance , be it football coaches , media stars or uncles I find your inference odd. In what way have these guy have more veracity ?
This isn't a top trump situation, this is a sickness that has blighted children and teens from all walks of life. Girls and boys.
There will always be. A tiny minority who will try to capitalise on it from all sections.
They don't really matter in the scheme of things, believing children , all children is paramount.
Why have you said that " in this instance " they should be believed ?”

I went through all this with you before on page 3 and 4 in this thread. You misquoted and twisted context of my posts then and you are now repeating the same again here. Where have i written "in this instance" they should be believed? Where have i 'implied' to use your term, a 'top trump' situation?

Fwiw this particular thread topic concerns the sexual abuse and raping of young boys. As far as i'm aware there have not been any girls abused by Bennell or any other club employee. I'm not sure what reason you have for shoehorning every other possible figure or scenario into the equation but am quite aware that child abuse per se takes place with both genders committed by male and female abusers.


Originally Posted by academia:
“Why have you no doubt? When do you have doubt, in which cases?”

I think you've not understood what i said in reply to that poster which was "that's generally (in cases) where there is doubt". In relation to this particular case, the football abuse, i've not yet heard or read anything to make me doubt.

Hope thats clarified it for you?
gemma-the-husky
03-12-2016
I expect, like drug taking in sport, bung taking in sport, and so on, a lot of people knew what was going on, but are unable to say so because of libel laws and so on.

I just started another thread about Chelsea. Eva Carneiro, and Eddie Heath. Not the same issue, but indicative of the shabbiness in football.
Dan Fortesque
03-12-2016
With regards to Edward Heath. It's not a witch-hunt says Wiltshire Chief Constable.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...MCNEWEML6619I2
Jane Doh!
03-12-2016
Originally Posted by gemma-the-husky:
“I expect, like drug taking in sport, bung taking in sport, and so on, a lot of people knew what was going on, but are unable to say so because of libel laws and so on.

I just started another thread about Chelsea. Eva Carneiro, and Eddie Heath. Not the same issue, but indicative of the shabbiness in football.”

This thread? It doesn't really say anything. I had to look up who the woman was and still don't see why it's relevant. I asked in your thread but presumably you haven't seen my post yet.
Originally Posted by gemma-the-husky:
“Twice is very careless.

Eva Carneiro, and now Eddie Heath.”

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