ore has a charisma factor, his performances are very compelling, you'd think he'd provide that antidote to 'beige' that people experience in louise..

louise is a quiet, classy, understated performer who is equally enjoyable in a totally different way.

so from my pov, its cliftons all the way to the final, and with any luck it'll cause a tear in the space time fabric and a few miseries will disappear up the fundament...

Well said

If he's on the show next year and he's partnered with someone who isn't that good, I'd be expecting comments like, "They've only partnered him with her to try and make it seem like they don't favour him, when they obviously do." He can't win on here, no matter what he does.

But you can't argue with the fact that he has been given four average or above average celebrities though which is why people think he has been shown favouritism. That isn't a matter of opinion it's fact, he has been never given a "duffer". For me personally it doesn't bother me that much but I can totally understand why some people get annoyed about it.

Nothing confusing about it .... as you say, we all see things differently.

I wondered why they were so disliked till I noticed that their critics are a very active and vocal minority.

Excruciatingly embarassing dancing to Ellie
Absolutely no style or charisma

I like Jo - I think because I've seen her do choreography corner on ITT and was good and natural at it and she knew what she was talking about.

Kevin - I would like to see him get a duffer and see how he does with them, he's had too easy since he joined and I just want to see if he can really teach well. I just feel with Louise this year, she's supposed to be a performer but I just can't connect emotionally with them.

Karen is my least favourite - I don't find her likeable....I know there was all the rowing rubbish 3 years ago with Ola...but can't help but feel she's a dominant type person and is very me me me me

Having said that - if Kevin and Karen choreographed that dance to Ellie Goulding...horrendous

I have no idea who choreographed that dance to Ellie Goulding, but the very least Karen and Kevin could have done was say no. That was awful.

No, I can interpret that as I want too,

But since I know you know Jo I am sure you have a good view of her

I think they are great - and all three are excellent choreographers.

I don't think that is a fact. It's sometimes difficult to know who is going to turn out to be a "duffer". There are a few obvious ones, who tend to get partnered with Anton, but otherwise there are always some surprises. It wasn't obvious at the beginning that either Susannah or Kellie would do well. Maybe their success was in part down to Kevin's skill as a partner? (Ducking now)

They may be a surprise to the audience, but the celebs have said they have to audition for the producers and try out with a pro before they are selected, so TPTB will know who is a duffer and who has potential before they do the pairings.

Think Kevin had to many Haribo tonight , that dance.... and I use the term loosely , was manic. At one point it looked like they were running around playing Tag.

The first segment was OK, the second one was lairy.

Fair enough I see your point but I think only Susannah would be more of an unknown quantity. Kellie Bright went to stage school and is used to performing, Frankie Bridge was in a girl band so it would be highly unlikely she would be a "duffer" and the same goes for Louise. It obviously doesn't follow that the last three would win the show or even get to the final but I did say that he had average and above average contestants. The chances were he wasn't going to be out week 1. I suppose Susannah could have had two left feet and no rhythm but on paper she didn't fall in to the older lady or joke category so maybe people are thinking it's about time he got one of those types of celebrities. I personally think he would be a great partner whoever he gets and get the best out of them because he comes across as a likeable guy.

I am getting fed up with certain posters jumping on anyone who dares to comment or criticise any of the Cliftons and calls it bashing which is why I responded to that post (that isn't aimed at you by the way) I think it is only a minority of people on here who seem to have a big problem with members of the Clifton family and another minority who defend them no matter what. Most people are somewhere in the middle thank goodness.

I actually think Kevin is a good teacher. His weakness is not seeing where his celebrities need help to improve, along with a tendency to work with the personality of his celebrity, rather than seeing where they are not selling (in Louise's case) or overselling (in Kellie's case) the choreography he gives them.

In trying to create a romantic routine for someone inherently unromantic, he was a hiding to nothing. Or giving high level footwork to someone who will not relax and enjoy the dance because they are too worried about getting it right.

Kevin lacks insight into what makes someone tick.

For me the issue is that a lot of people seem to consider Kevin, Karen and Joanne to be a collective entity and that a dislike of one, for whatever reason, results in the others being deemed "guilty by association". They become "fair game, as it were.

Whatever their perceived shortcomings as dancers, choreographers or anything else in the eyes of those who criticise them, the fact remains that none of them are unpleasant, they don't bitch about other people on social media and they are kind and supportive to the other pros and celebrities - whether related to them or not.

There are some truly obnoxious, deeply unpleasant and utterly untalented people in the world of TV, showbusiness and associated fields, if anyone feels the need to take casual but regular potshots at someone in the public eye.

The manner in which Kevin, Karen and Joanne are set up for often cruel and gratuitous criticism on here is pretty shabby, to be honest and there are plenty pf people out there who are more deserving of character assassination than any of those three.

On that basis, I feel perfectly vindicated in challenging unfounded or irrational condemnation of them. It's nothing to do with blindly defending them - but rather pointing out that they haven't actually done anything to merit the level and depth of unpleasantness in the first place.

For what its worth, I'd say the same if it were any of the other celebrities who were the ones being "bashed". None of them deserve it because they all do a great job with their celebrity partners.

I know one is on a hiding to nothing here saying things like this, but: the programme is about the celebs, not the pros, certainly in the minds of the production team. Being 'fair' to the pros hardly crosses their minds. They might give the previous year's winner a duffer, if there isn't an obvious match otherwise, but not necessarily even that. Rather they will match a pro to an appropriate celeb, taking into account, height, personality, chemistry and so on. It seems to me hard to argue that either Karen or Jo have had especially favorable treatment in this area. Even Kevin has basically been a niche partner - he;'s had three (short) Carole Smillies: 40ish mums several years older than any previous female winner (35) or indeed any previous winner of either sex.

It was Karen who publicly denounced Ola - and Ola had to make a statement saying all was fine and it was a thing of nothing - IMO there is no smoke without fire!

IMO the Cliftons are favourites of the shows producers - they always get good celeb partners - they get more than their fair share of starring parts in the pro dances (always front and centre) and they always get praised on the VT on both SCD & ITT (as supplied by the producers) and most of us just don't like this blatant favouritism! - please get rid!!!

1. They don't always get good partners - Karen's only ever had one and he was thoroughly unlikeable!

2. They're not always front and centre of the pro dances - Kevin wasn't even in the pro dance tonight! And all the pros take turns to do the guest musical slots.

3. Everyone gets praised on the VTs, that's the nature of the show and ITT, I really don't understand where you're going with that one.

4. You don't speak for everyone, and frankly I don't think you even speak for "most" people - everyone can make their own mind up thank you very much.

Really you haven't given any evidence of the so-called "blatant favouritism" at all...

I have no doubt that Ola was as much a part of it as Karen. At the time the full story came out and neither looked great. Personally I would take Karen over 'let's rehash every routine, Ola' every time.


Some just can't see the truth beyond their bias specs.

I don't dislike any of the Cliftons, but i'm fed up with Kevin always being in the final, it's time we seen Brendan and Pasha again in the finals.

Or maybe at least given the lead pro dance, as Kevin was tonight, despite still being in the competition, and in the quarter-finals ( same goes for Anton, Aljaz and Gorka )

These spots should be performed by the pro's who are no longer centre -stage every week