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Old 03-12-2016, 23:56
johnny_boi_UK
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In the late 1970s, the population of London was actually falling and there was a real fear that this meant the city was heading into the doldrums and serious decline.

People keep talking about the UK population growing as if it is a terrible phenomenon but if it was revealed that the population was falling, it would be much worse, as a country being depopulated nearly always is bad news and a very bad sign.
I would imagine thatchers economic reforms are a major factor in a population boom in london.
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Old 03-12-2016, 23:57
Nodger
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She really is an incredibly nasty, smug and spiteful woman.
Indeed and nobody, not even JHB should have been forced to interview her.
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Old 04-12-2016, 00:02
burneside
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Might well have been. Given the choice between a British second home owner who contributes f** all to my community for 11 months of the year and an EU immigrant who wants to work in my community, support the local economy, raise a family here etc, I know which I'd prefer.
Don't you mean English second home owners? Because that's who they were. But hey, just burn down the homes of people you don't like.
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Old 04-12-2016, 00:10
Blairdennon
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In the late 1970s, the population of London was actually falling and there was a real fear that this meant the city was heading into the doldrums and serious decline.

People keep talking about the UK population growing as if it is a terrible phenomenon but if it was revealed that the population was falling, it would be much worse, as a country being depopulated nearly always is bad news and a very bad sign.
But the population around London was sky rocketing. It was the transport revolution that enabled London to carry on. The UK population growing at the current rate is a problem even if viewed purely from a available space point. I think most people want to keep some degree of a rural backdrop to their lives
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Old 04-12-2016, 00:15
Multimedia81
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Will Zac be flying out of Heathrow back to France?
Yes he will, but before the 3rd runway is built.
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Old 04-12-2016, 00:18
Blairdennon
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Might well have been. Given the choice between a British second home owner who contributes f** all to my community for 11 months of the year and an EU immigrant who wants to work in my community, support the local economy, raise a family here etc, I know which I'd prefer.

Now that is an interesting take that one gets to choose who immigrates and under what conditions and if one does not like the conditions one can burn them out. Most people in the rest of the country do not get to choose who, why, where, how many, what condition, how rich, how poor, what effect on housing, schooling, community and if they make one little comment as regards maybe that is wrong out comes the R word. What a strange hypocritical world we all have to live in.
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Old 04-12-2016, 00:44
Multimedia81
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Because it's stupid question. Just like when Farage used to constantly repeat that 500 million people could move to the UK.

In theory the whole population of the UK could move to Tunbridge Wells tomorrow, even after Brexit, but it's not going to happen so there's little point speculating about the effect of it happening.
If the whole population moved to Tunbridge Wells, it would change from a Remain to a Leave area.
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Old 04-12-2016, 00:49
Multimedia81
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Although it is really encouraging that Sarah has won the seat, I concede that it is likely to return to the Conservatives at the next General Election, even if with just a 4-figure majority. Sarah's majority was under 2000 on a 53% turnout, not only helped by tactical voting but also by "Conservative abstainers" ie people who would vote Conservative at a General Election but did not turn out on Thursday.

It is creditable that Zac honoured his pledge to stand down and trigger a by-election over the Heathrow 3rd runway as promised. It was just his own vanity project. For the Conservatives to stay out and not field their own candidate, they can say with hand on heart that it was not their defeat, even though they did still back Zac.
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:04
Welsh-lad
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Don't you mean English second home owners? Because that's who they were. But hey, just burn down the homes of people you don't like.
Not at all. Just as many folk from Cardiff have 2nd homes here as far as I can tell, and I assume some of them must be Welsh rather than English. Would rather have EU immigrants who live here full time.

Interesting how you are turning this into something nationalist / ethnic / racial, when the point being made was one of economics.
Says a lot about what is lurking under your veneer.
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:04
andykn
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Endless according to the the usual whiners on here...
Harsh words for Theresa May, who, despite over 6 years in charge, has let net non EU migration exceed the "uncontrolled" EU migration despite the "tens of thousand" promise.
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:07
Welsh-lad
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Now that is an interesting take that one gets to choose who immigrates and under what conditions and if one does not like the conditions one can burn them out. Most people in the rest of the country do not get to choose who, why, where, how many, what condition, how rich, how poor, what effect on housing, schooling, community and if they make one little comment as regards maybe that is wrong out comes the R word. What a strange hypocritical world we all have to live in.
Never said we should have a choice, just that inhabitants who are actually present, and economically active are better than absent ones, regardless of their ethnic, national or racial origin.

Speaking merely from my experience the number of EU migrants we have in my locality are working. One family is running a shop. Tell me how that is worse for my community than someone from Cardiff owning a 2nd home here, and present for a few weeks in July and August.
They don't even buy food here going by the number of waitrose bags in their people carriers!
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:08
andykn
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?? Where o earth do you get that from. A dictatorship is one person, or a small group, deciding what is to be done and doing it. We have been discussing the eU since its inception, we have had the vote on it we have been asking for for over 20 years, we aired, discussed and weighed up the arguments then every voter in the country was able to cast a vote on what to do with the popular understanding that that would be the decision. Should we play football or golf, the vote was decided golf, you cannot put up nets at each green and say well since 48% wanted to play football we will have a kickabout here on our way through. That was not what the vote was about.
No, but neither can you decide on what sort of golf you want to play without us.
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:09
Welsh-lad
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Nothing infantile about it at all well over 200 homes arson attacked and they were all held by individuals and families who were incomers. Started early 80s if I recall and carried on into the 2000s. I think some are still going on. Many of the attacks were specifically in sparsely populated areas.
Links please rather than your 'recall' and 'I think' which is probably as reliable as a senile tortoise.
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:09
andykn
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She asked very difficult questions that the new MP could not counter. Ask them hard and ask them fast. That has been the technique for many who are supposed to be impartial. JHB is not supposed to be impartial. Everyone seems to love it when Farage gets a roasting from an 'impartial' interviewer. Any chance of at least some consistency.
Consistency from "everyone"? Listen to yourself!
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:10
andykn
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Labour now say they will "seek to amend Article 50"

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38196303

Amending any EU treaty is always a simple process isn't it?
Er, try reading.
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:13
andykn
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Its not a stupid question as Tunbridge Wells could not cope with the UK population, so answer the question. How many can the UK cope with?
No the question is very well defined. It was how many people could Britain accommodate without there being serious overcrowding problems?
Well, Japan has a population density 25% greater than ours so maybe 90 million?
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:19
andykn
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...if they make one little comment as regards maybe that is wrong out comes the R word.
Yet you bang on about little else and haven't had the 'R' word used against you recently. What a paradox. It's almost like you're playing the victim card despite holding pretty much all the privileges.
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:30
david16
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Frankly its hard Brexit or no Brexit.

Soft Brexit is effectively staying in the EU but having no say or vote in how its run. You might as well not bother.
Other European nations that are members of both the EEA and the Customs Union but are not EU members are not in the EU at all.

The UK would be no different if joined both post Brexit. The UK would still have 100% left the EU and then are 0% back into the EU.

To suggest that the UK would be is totally ridiculous.
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:40
MARTYM8
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Other European nations that are members of both the EEA and the Customs Union but are not EU members are not in the EU at all.

The UK would be no different if joined both post Brexit. The UK would still have 100% left the EU and then are 0% back into the EU.

To suggest that the UK would be is totally ridiculous.
On purely technical grounds. But still subject to full freedom of movement, still in the single market, still potentially paying the same contributions and still being subject to European courts - but having no votes.

I don't think people would regard that as taking back control. It's the EU without a say.
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:41
koantemplation
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Other European nations that are members of both the EEA and the Customs Union but are not EU members are not in the EU at all.

The UK would be no different if joined both post Brexit. The UK would still have 100% left the EU and then are 0% back into the EU.

To suggest that the UK would be is totally ridiculous.
They have to accept EU rules and Freedom of movement, so they are effectively still in the EU.

Being out of the EU is no good if we then do everything we did while in the EU.
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:41
burneside
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Not at all. Just as many folk from Cardiff have 2nd homes here as far as I can tell, and I assume some of them must be Welsh rather than English. Would rather have EU immigrants who live here full time.

Interesting how you are turning this into something nationalist / ethnic / racial, when the point being made was one of economics.
Says a lot about what is lurking under your veneer.
What veneer would that be? I just remember all the second homes being burnt to the ground purely because the owners were not Welsh.
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:43
voteout
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Remain cannot stop Brexit.
Only a change of heart from Leavers can stop Brexit.
Absolutely correct.

It is pointless trying to stop the process, and there are a large number of people who do not believe the opinions that say that leaving the EU will be damaging.

The only way this is going to change is to get on with it. You can argue until you're blue in the face about the damage that will happen, but this will fall on deaf ears.

The only way leavers might change their minds (and in a lot of cases I don't even think this will work, but it will convince a lot of voters) is to let the hard-liners have their way, crash the economy and then come back and say "I told you so".

The longer the remainers stall the more likely the damage will be laid at their door and not the leavers themselves.
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:47
Mark.
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They have to accept EU rules and Freedom of movement, so they are effectively still in the EU.

Being out of the EU is no good if we then do everything we did while in the EU.
So?

The question on the ballot paper was about membership or otherwise of the EU. Leaving the EU but still "do[ing] everything we did while in the EU" fulfils the expressed wish of the majority of those who voted, whether they like it or not.
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:49
koantemplation
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What veneer would that be? I just remember all the second homes being burnt to the ground purely because the owners were not Welsh.
Reminds me of this Not The Nine O'clock News sketch.

https://www.facebook.com/welshnotbri...6889406716055/
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Old 04-12-2016, 01:52
koantemplation
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So?

The question on the ballot paper was about membership or otherwise of the EU. Leaving the EU but still "do[ing] everything we did while in the EU" fulfils the expressed wish of the majority of those who voted, whether they like it or not.
No it doesn't fulfils the wishes of the majority that is the issue.

There is no point being out of the EU if we're just going to do everything we did while in the EU.
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