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Carol confirms Martin is being picked on


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Old 02-12-2016, 08:41
Menk
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He is not the DS chosen one, he is the victim of sheer spite and people who find it uncomfortable to watch have come out in support.
The forum favourite will always be someone who is deemed to be the victim.

It has been way overplayed on here, and Martin's negative points all ignored.
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Old 02-12-2016, 09:18
Geisty
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I've not ignored Martins negative points.

He's got a couple of annoying quirks. It's called being human. I would argue that those who hate the guy are suckling up the rubbish from the other camp mates. I mean how can you dislike someone for suggesting straws are drawn or being excitable when winning a DD challenge. It's ridiculous.

Its not like he's done anything "bad". He had a nervy first episode where he came across as a bit petulant about the food but they really need to get over it, and they just haven't.

He's barely done anything wrong, and has been a great, genuinec campmate on the whole. The fact they've laid into him for practically no reason is definitely an element of why he's getting my voting support, but even if he hadn't been targeted, he's still the best one there... and definitely the least fake along with Sam.
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Old 02-12-2016, 09:32
calamity
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Martin to me is the type whos lovable but one that we sometimes shake our heads at and smile, annoying but still want him as a friend sort.
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Old 02-12-2016, 09:37
Moody Blue
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Well, I can honestly say he's the most entertain gone there and he's getting all my free votes.
I want to be entertained and I don't like the way he's been treated.
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Old 02-12-2016, 09:41
blueabu
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Only just read a few of these sycophantic posts about Martin. To read some you would think he was up for sainthood!! I agree he is probably not a bad person, but he does have to be centre stage all the time, and seems to have very poor social skills. I can see how he would get on anyone's nerves after a while
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Old 02-12-2016, 09:47
1fab
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Only just read a few of these sycophantic posts about Martin. To read some you would think he was up for sainthood!! I agree he is probably not a bad person, but he does have to be centre stage all the time, and seems to have very poor social skills. I can see how he would get on anyone's nerves after a while
Poor social skills compared to whom? Surely you can't mean the other campmates?
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Old 02-12-2016, 09:48
duckylucky
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Only just read a few of these sycophantic posts about Martin. To read some you would think he was up for sainthood!! I agree he is probably not a bad person, but he does have to be centre stage all the time, and seems to have very poor social skills. I can see how he would get on anyone's nerves after a while
I was about to post the same . I think I would find it hard to live with Martin , guessing too that he lacks social skills and his timing is awful
Having said that I think he is a nice guy who is needy and annoying but I it still doesn't justify how Larry and some others treated him
I am very glad he lasted longer than Larry as that was a slap in the face for Larry
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Old 02-12-2016, 09:52
1fab
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Good social skills mean being able to at least superficially get along with the people around you, even if you don't like them. So Larry doesn't have good social skills. Neither do some of the others who joined in the bitching.
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Old 02-12-2016, 09:58
Geisty
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Good social skills mean being able to at least superficially get along with the people around you, even if you don't like them. So Larry doesn't have good social skills. Neither do some of the others who joined in the bitching.
Exactly.

Wearing your heart on your sleeve leaves you open for ridicule and criticism, but it's hardly a fatal character flaw and I'd take it over being two-faced and moaning about people behind their back.
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Old 02-12-2016, 09:59
duckylucky
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Good social skills mean being able to at least superficially get along with the people around you, even if you don't like them. So Larry doesn't have good social skills. Neither do some of the others who joined in the bitching.
For me poor social skills means you have difficulty reading others and lack some ability to know when and how to say something . Rabbitting on and boring others with no insight into how you come across . Not saying Martin has all these but it does seem he can annoy and irritate as they all say the same
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Old 02-12-2016, 10:09
1fab
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For me poor social skills means you have difficulty reading others and lack some ability to know when and how to say something . Rabbitting on and boring others with no insight into how you come across . Not saying Martin has all these but it does seem he can annoy and irritate as they all say the same
Just because a group of egotists all say the same thing, doesn't mean it's to be taken as gospel. It's more a sign of pack mentality in action. Everybody has annoying traits, but Martin's are the only one they've been picking on, following the lead of the "alpha male" / he-who-must-be-obeyed, Larry.
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Old 02-12-2016, 10:14
Fairy Wings
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I'd describe Martin more as socially awkward. I think he could be a bit self conscious also. I feel sorry for him 😖
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Old 02-12-2016, 10:27
coldcomfort
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Just because a group of egotists all say the same thing, doesn't mean it's to be taken as gospel. It's more a sign of pack mentality in action. Everybody has annoying traits, but Martin's are the only one they've been picking on, following the lead of the "alpha male" / he-who-must-be-obeyed, Larry.
Fully agree with this.
When Martin went on about his trial they rolled their eyes and balked at him. Yet when others have done the same, srep foreward Joel with that drawn out maths nonsense, the mob were agog and seemed to find it fascinating.

If Martin has been play-acting and this is not his genuine persona, then he'a far superior actor than Larry or Adam put together.

Sonic the Hedgehog Martin to beat Wayne and rictus-grin Joel hopefully.
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Old 02-12-2016, 10:36
Bedlam_maid
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I'd describe Martin more as socially awkward. I think he could be a bit self conscious also. I feel sorry for him 😖
Absolutely, and all the more so because he wasn't welcomed into the camp. Considering his treatment I think he's done great. He's kept smiling in spite of it. Go Martin
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Old 02-12-2016, 10:38
fredster
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Wow good old carole, shes goes up in my estimation more and more, wonderful lady who should still be in there, good on you Carole for your honesty.
She had impressed me, how come she is out and Scarlett is still there? Carole is far more interesting.
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Old 02-12-2016, 10:41
duckylucky
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Just because a group of egotists all say the same thing, doesn't mean it's to be taken as gospel. It's more a sign of pack mentality in action. Everybody has annoying traits, but Martin's are the only one they've been picking on, following the lead of the "alpha male" / he-who-must-be-obeyed, Larry.
Actually I was speaking more of what we saw .No need to jump on me ,I like Martin but I dont live with him and I think that might be the key of any of us being able to make a judgement .At no stage did I say what the group did was right by the way
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Old 02-12-2016, 10:45
calamity
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I'd describe Martin more as socially awkward. I think he could be a bit self conscious also. I feel sorry for him 😖
I think Martin is very self conscious and why he spoke and acted the way he did when entering the camp the first couple of days, he was putting on a big front that wasnt him, and thinking he would fit in better with most of them, then we saw his much softer side, Martin to me has been bullied when young and what did he get ..another old bully and an accomplice to tear him to shreds, the public saw it, as did some of the campmates, and got Danny out before it got any worse, Martin has shone and may it continue. Larry was in shock last night he really didnt want to leave, but some seemed to think thats why he was crying when Jordan left..... no he wanted badly to win, but even with only some of the footage of his nastiness shown to us , he still got the boot..
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Old 02-12-2016, 13:11
fredster
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Only just read a few of these sycophantic posts about Martin. To read some you would think he was up for sainthood!! I agree he is probably not a bad person, but he does have to be centre stage all the time, and seems to have very poor social skills. I can see how he would get on anyone's nerves after a while
What about Scarlett? She is far more centre stage than MARTIN.
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Old 02-12-2016, 14:03
anne_666
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Only just read a few of these sycophantic posts about Martin. To read some you would think he was up for sainthood!! I agree he is probably not a bad person, but he does have to be centre stage all the time, and seems to have very poor social skills. I can see how he would get on anyone's nerves after a while
I agree.
Martin has victimhood down to a fine art and the public love a victim.. He's probably been doing it for most of his life.
He's certainly been doing it virtually since the start of this show. Including self pityingly telling the world he's disliked with the right pout in place then sit back and wait for the reaction.
Reward or punishment with nothing in between and the uncomfortably polarised sought affirmation of any dysfunctional self fulfilling prophecy.

I don't doubt Carol's perceptions at all, but realistically few people in that situation would have her patience to tolerate someone so irritating, in their face 24/7 and only able to cope by either constantly having to treat a middle aged man like a demanding child or trying to ignore his behaviour.

The females were bound to cope best with him and most of all Carol. The mothering instinct is one of the most powerful instincts and of course it's something Martin perpetually seeks and revels in while longing to be one of the boys as long as he can be the best. That can never happen and sadly for him he's stuck
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Old 02-12-2016, 14:05
Rekekah_Carter
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Only just read a few of these sycophantic posts about Martin. To read some you would think he was up for sainthood!! I agree he is probably not a bad person, but he does have to be centre stage all the time, and seems to have very poor social skills. I can see how he would get on anyone's nerves after a while
Does he? I haven't actually seen him vying for centre stage at all. What I have seen is each time he does, or says something, that takes away the centre stage from one of the others, he gets criticised, and you have Larry and Joel, and no doubt others, giving each other 'knowing' looks. I would like to know what his poor social skills are too? Is this when, for example, he suggested using straws during a discussion?, or maybe not seeing Larry as a 'legend' for killing a fly?
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Old 02-12-2016, 14:41
Fairy Wings
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I agree.
Martin has victimhood down to a fine art and the public love a victim.. He's probably been doing it for most of his life.
He's certainly been doing it virtually since the start of this show. Including self pityingly telling the world he's disliked with the right pout in place then sit back and wait for the reaction.
Reward or punishment with nothing in between and the uncomfortably polarised sought affirmation of any dysfunctional self fulfilling prophecy.

I don't doubt Carol's perceptions at all, but realistically few people in that situation would have her patience to tolerate someone so irritating, in their face 24/7 and only able to cope by either constantly having to treat a middle aged man like a demanding child or trying to ignore his behaviour.

The females were bound to cope best with him and most of all Carol. The mothering instinct is one of the most powerful instincts and of course it's something Martin perpetually seeks and revels in while longing to be one of the boys as long as he can be the best. That can never happen and sadly for him he's stuck
Everyone is far too busy mothering Scarlett to have time for martin. " Wake me in the morning but say 'Wake up little one" Urgh!!!!
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Old 02-12-2016, 14:41
jtnorth
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I think Martin made the error of coming on to a show he hadn't really watched and didn't really get - an error I don't think anyone else in this year's group made, but that quite a lot of people over the years have done. I don't understand doing that, but it doesn't make someone a horrible person. I thought it was interesting that Carol described him as not part of the showbiz circuit like most of them.

I think initially the tight-knit group resented two new people, and Danny got them to like him by a) understanding the programme very well, he's a bright man, b) telling them how they were doing, e.g. telling Scarlett she was going to win, and c) getting them to dislike Martin, something Martin made easy by silly things like not wanting to eat the food. Whether that was luck or judgement on Danny's part, I don't know. I think that group behaviour, of bonding over disliking someone else, is incredibly easy to fall into in such unnatural circumstances, and I don't think it means Martin lacks social skills in real life, just that he didn't understand the game he was part of, and the others have got no distance to see what they are doing. Also simply they're bored and bitching is very tempting if you're bored.

I don't think Martin is a saint (just a reasonably nice man) and I don't think he has played no part in his rocky start, but I do think that once they had decided they didn't like him, nothing he could do was right and there have been several examples of him being criticised for things none of the others would have been criticised for, which I think says more about group dynamics than it does about Martin as a person. I don't see Martin as someone playing a game, and I find it hard to understand why he is talked about with such venom on the show or on twitter. I also would have found the year boring without him - which is why I'm voting for him. But I do think he will be out tonight.
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Old 02-12-2016, 15:12
patsylimerick
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I think Martin made the error of coming on to a show he hadn't really watched and didn't really get - an error I don't think anyone else in this year's group made, but that quite a lot of people over the years have done. I don't understand doing that, but it doesn't make someone a horrible person. I thought it was interesting that Carol described him as not part of the showbiz circuit like most of them.

I think initially the tight-knit group resented two new people, and Danny got them to like him by a) understanding the programme very well, he's a bright man, b) telling them how they were doing, e.g. telling Scarlett she was going to win, and c) getting them to dislike Martin, something Martin made easy by silly things like not wanting to eat the food. Whether that was luck or judgement on Danny's part, I don't know. I think that group behaviour, of bonding over disliking someone else, is incredibly easy to fall into in such unnatural circumstances, and I don't think it means Martin lacks social skills in real life, just that he didn't understand the game he was part of, and the others have got no distance to see what they are doing. Also simply they're bored and bitching is very tempting if you're bored.

I don't think Martin is a saint (just a reasonably nice man) and I don't think he has played no part in his rocky start, but I do think that once they had decided they didn't like him, nothing he could do was right and there have been several examples of him being criticised for things none of the others would have been criticised for, which I think says more about group dynamics than it does about Martin as a person. I don't see Martin as someone playing a game, and I find it hard to understand why he is talked about with such venom on the show or on twitter. I also would have found the year boring without him - which is why I'm voting for him. But I do think he will be out tonight.
Really excellent post. The bits in bold are particularly insightful and, IMO, spot on.

I also think he'll be out tonight. Don't think he was ever going to make the final as he's too polarising. Scarlett is polarising on places like DS - but massively popular with the casual voters and viewers, I think. Adam, the same.

I've never factored him into the final. I'd like to see Joel take it over Adam and Scarlett; but he's no saint either and I think he's fallen heavily into the phenomena you describe above.
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Old 02-12-2016, 15:19
Bedlam_maid
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I think Martin made the error of coming on to a show he hadn't really watched and didn't really get - an error I don't think anyone else in this year's group made, but that quite a lot of people over the years have done. I don't understand doing that, but it doesn't make someone a horrible person. I thought it was interesting that Carol described him as not part of the showbiz circuit like most of them.

I think initially the tight-knit group resented two new people, and Danny got them to like him by a) understanding the programme very well, he's a bright man, b) telling them how they were doing, e.g. telling Scarlett she was going to win, and c) getting them to dislike Martin, something Martin made easy by silly things like not wanting to eat the food. Whether that was luck or judgement on Danny's part, I don't know. I think that group behaviour, of bonding over disliking someone else, is incredibly easy to fall into in such unnatural circumstances, and I don't think it means Martin lacks social skills in real life, just that he didn't understand the game he was part of, and the others have got no distance to see what they are doing. Also simply they're bored and bitching is very tempting if you're bored.

I don't think Martin is a saint (just a reasonably nice man) and I don't think he has played no part in his rocky start, but I do think that once they had decided they didn't like him, nothing he could do was right and there have been several examples of him being criticised for things none of the others would have been criticised for, which I think says more about group dynamics than it does about Martin as a person. I don't see Martin as someone playing a game, and I find it hard to understand why he is talked about with such venom on the show or on twitter. I also would have found the year boring without him - which is why I'm voting for him. But I do think he will be out tonight.
Good post.

I would add that it probably gets so boring in there that mutual criticism of someone else is a way of bonding, like monkeys picking fleas off each others backs.
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Old 02-12-2016, 15:30
slappers r us
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The thing is we now have proof Martin was being picked on from the very first day and much more than we saw

I dont think Carol would lie, do you??
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