DS Forums

 
 

Tory Privatisation Of Network Rail Track


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-12-2016, 22:53
Lee Cool
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: London
Posts: 2,507

The Telegraph are reporting that the Tories are going to re privatise network rail tracks so the train operating companies can do the repairs, advantages are that they will repair more quickly and fares will "possibly be cheaper".

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...-train-tracks/

Personally I think its a terrible idea, imagine Southern Rail and Virgin Trains looking after their lines tracks. They can't even deal with what they have now! SWTrains is the only line I've used on a semi regular basis which seems to run ok. Southern and East Coast should be nationalised.
Lee Cool is offline   Reply With Quote
Please sign in or register to remove this advertisement.
Old 02-12-2016, 23:02
jonmorris
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: a land filled with trolls
Posts: 12,010
Southern is pretty much nationalised, and look at the problems because the DfT is imposing changes to make all trains DOO!

And I don't think Stagecoach is doing much wrong on the east coast is it?
jonmorris is offline Follow this poster on Twitter   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2016, 23:05
Lee Cool
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: London
Posts: 2,507
Southern is pretty much nationalised, and look at the problems because the DfT is imposing changes to make all trains DOO!

And I don't think Stagecoach is doing much wrong on the east coast is it?
Apparently Virgin Trains are still dealing with delay claims from September on the East Coast Line so can't be doing that well. Though seen as the tax payer has already picked up the bill for 2 failed companies on the East Coast line not sure why its given to yet another company who are happy to run it in profit but soon as they make a loss its back to the tax payer to foot the bill.
Lee Cool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2016, 23:09
BrokenArrow
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Hampshire
Posts: 20,806
Not legal while we remain in the single market, train and track must be separate.
BrokenArrow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2016, 23:10
Tanky
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,711
The prices are going up in January, it's already been announced-

Train fares in Britain will go up by an average of 2.3% from 2 January, the rail industry has announced.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-38180049

And I don't think Stagecoach is doing much wrong on the east coast is it?
It's pretty much more Virgin than Stagecoach, and fares are much more expensive now than they were before.
Tanky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2016, 23:12
smudges dad
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Fort William
Posts: 22,269
Obviously they didn't learn from Railtrack.
smudges dad is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2016, 23:33
Ash_M1
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Love The Beeb! PROUD Remoaner!
Posts: 11,149
Disgraceful Tories. When will they learn that selling off the family silver is a bad idea? They should be nationalising them not selling them off.
Ash_M1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2016, 23:35
swingaleg
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 76,811
Disgraceful Tories. When will they learn that selling off the family silver is a bad idea? They should be nationalising them not selling them off.
They'll privatise anything that isn't nailed down

oh......hang on......the rail tracks are nailed down.........
swingaleg is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2016, 23:37
BrokenArrow
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Hampshire
Posts: 20,806
Disgraceful Tories. When will they learn that selling off the family silver is a bad idea? They should be nationalising them not selling them off.
Also illegal under EU law.
BrokenArrow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2016, 23:52
Ash_M1
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Love The Beeb! PROUD Remoaner!
Posts: 11,149
Also illegal under EU law.
Is it? How come?

Let's hope Brexiteers don't blame the EU and immigrants when their trains don't turn up.
Ash_M1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 00:50
spiney2
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 24,092
The main reason railtrack got nationalised is they repeatedly killed people. For those who have forgotten.
spiney2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 01:16
Ash_M1
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Love The Beeb! PROUD Remoaner!
Posts: 11,149
The main reason railtrack got nationalised is they repeatedly killed people. For those who have forgotten.
I do recall. They tried privatisation under Major in the 90s. There were lots of train accidents and Railtrack were then re-nationalised.
Ash_M1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 01:28
koantemplation
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wolf359
Posts: 96,702
Is it? How come?

Let's hope Brexiteers don't blame the EU and immigrants when their trains don't turn up.
Well if it is illegal to sell off them because of EU law, then off course they are going to blame the EU. rolleyes
koantemplation is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 02:29
thenetworkbabe
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 34,224
The main reason railtrack got nationalised is they repeatedly killed people. For those who have forgotten.
The main reason is they needed massive investment, and the government couldn't pay for that . It had been put off, for 30 years, under nationalisation. . If people want better trains, more of them, and fewer bottlenecks, - they are going to have to pay for it one way or another - and it makes sense if the people who use the trains pay - not those who don't..

The current problems are caused by limited scope to put fares up more, to pay for even more investment, disruption while investment occurs, and the Corbynites in the RMT sirring up as much trouble as they can, for their own political reasons.
thenetworkbabe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 03:09
James2001
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Mansfield
Posts: 27,514
Yay, then we can have another Ladbroke Grove, Hatfield or Potters Bar. Because it worked so well under private hands last time.
James2001 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 05:14
FusionFury
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 12,884
It's good news
FusionFury is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 05:34
Mr Oleo Strut
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,311
The Telegraph are reporting that the Tories are going to re privatise network rail tracks so the train operating companies can do the repairs, advantages are that they will repair more quickly and fares will "possibly be cheaper".

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...-train-tracks/

Personally I think its a terrible idea, imagine Southern Rail and Virgin Trains looking after their lines tracks. They can't even deal with what they have now! SWTrains is the only line I've used on a semi regular basis which seems to run ok. Southern and East Coast should be nationalised.
Rail privatisation = a continuing shambles. All the fault of Thatcher. Do we never learn!
Mr Oleo Strut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 06:14
jonmorris
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: a land filled with trolls
Posts: 12,010
It's pretty much more Virgin than Stagecoach, and fares are much more expensive now than they were before.
Virgin has something like a 10% stake. It's all about branding, nothing more.
jonmorris is offline Follow this poster on Twitter   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 06:17
jonmorris
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: a land filled with trolls
Posts: 12,010
Yay, then we can have another Ladbroke Grove, Hatfield or Potters Bar. Because it worked so well under private hands last time.
While blaming Thatcher and the like is easy, there were major problems at privatisation in that a lot of people took retirement and a lot of knowledge, especially at a local level, was lost.

British Rail appeared to have been extremely bad at keeping up to date records on maintenance, assets and so on. When people left, the knowledge left.

If you ask me that played a huge part in a number of problems too. It's really not as clear cut as some would like to think just to make a political point.

For the record though, I think this idea is silly and unworkable. Especially when many new franchises are actually management contracts. So we get the train side being virtually nationalised and the infrastructure side privatised. Best to leave things as they are IMO.
jonmorris is offline Follow this poster on Twitter   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 06:46
smudges dad
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Fort William
Posts: 22,269
The main reason railtrack got nationalised is they repeatedly killed people. For those who have forgotten.
For those who have forgotten, they went begging to the government for more money for infrastructure improvements, and then decided to declare a dividend with it instead.
smudges dad is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 09:55
Lee Cool
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: London
Posts: 2,507
The main reason is they needed massive investment, and the government couldn't pay for that . It had been put off, for 30 years, under nationalisation. . If people want better trains, more of them, and fewer bottlenecks, - they are going to have to pay for it one way or another - and it makes sense if the people who use the trains pay - not those who don't..

The current problems are caused by limited scope to put fares up more, to pay for even more investment, disruption while investment occurs, and the Corbynites in the RMT sirring up as much trouble as they can, for their own political reasons.
I agree the RMT are a bit of a nightmare but I can't recall a strike on SWTrains for years so maybe the individual companies are partly the blame?
Lee Cool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 11:53
jmclaugh
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Devon
Posts: 47,995
It appears to be about transferring responsibility for track maintenance to the TOCs which isn't privatising anything unless it transfers ownership of the tracks.
jmclaugh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 11:58
jonmorris
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: a land filled with trolls
Posts: 12,010
I agree the RMT are a bit of a nightmare but I can't recall a strike on SWTrains for years so maybe the individual companies are partly the blame?
The RMT are a rather militant group that has one aim in life - full nationalisation. Yet, its members have done exceptionally well from privatisation - with drivers paid for more than they'd have ever achieved under BR.

Most recently for Southern, we've had the normally quite reasonable Aslef arguing that trains are unsafe without a guard despite the exact same train being used on other routes without a guard - and never having had one.

I appreciate they are really trying to save jobs, but the safety argument doesn't make sense as they're not refusing to let members take out the exact same rolling stock for use on Thameslink because they're unsafe...
jonmorris is offline Follow this poster on Twitter   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 17:40
KJ_Red
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 169
A lot depends on what exactly Grayling means by this and how its implemented. If he's talking about what railway commentators call "vertical integration" where the company that runs the trains in an area is also responsible for the infrastructure, there is an argument that it would be more efficient. This report only talks about track maintainance. Its also not been released yet so we've only got bits of the story.
I do wish the media would stick to reporting what has happened, rather than what someone that someone else spoke to thinks might happen.
KJ_Red is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 17:43
JackKlugman
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 4,894
It appears to be about transferring responsibility for track maintenance to the TOCs which isn't privatising anything unless it transfers ownership of the tracks.
If they had to maintain the track to NR standards with NR inspecting it might be ok.
JackKlugman is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 20:05.