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Soft Brexit Or No Brexit? Those Are The Options It Seems.. |
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#26 |
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Manchester area
Posts: 15,161
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The country as a whole surely prefer Soft Brexit to Hard Brexit. 48% voted to Remain and therefore prefer Soft Brexit. If just 1 in 20 Leave voters prefer Soft Brexit, that raises the total to 50.6%, thus a majority.
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#27 |
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Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: London SW6
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I'd much rather forget the whole thing ever happened if we are heading down that road to be "punished" by the EU for voting to leave.. as disappointed as I'd be as I did believe in our country and Brexit that we are capable of standing proudly on our own.. but hey life goes on, we will all be dead eventually. So doesn't really matter..
Not having your cake and eating it, not being a able to enjoy the benefits of membership without the commitments is not "punishment". |
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#28 |
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Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 12,875
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Leave and Remainers, put down your differences and come together for the good of the UK !
instead of fighting about what happened the vote to leave the EU.. we are leaving, that much is clear. Time to accept that and move forward. For the good of the country, please move on.. |
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#29 |
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Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 3,660
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Leave and Remainers, put down your differences and come together for the good of the UK !
instead of fighting about what happened the vote to leave the EU.. we are leaving, that much is clear. Time to accept that and move forward. For the good of the country, please move on.. |
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#30 |
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,727
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That's why when people say we didn't vote to leave the EU single market etc.. well yes we did because the EU rules are very clear on membership so won't give us any "deal". And certainly not now they know how weak our hand is they will play hardball and we will be like Oliver with our tails between our legs asking for more please mighty EU masters we can't survive without you and hoping they give us breadcrumbs.. "puke*
![]() I'm past caring at this point, but the people know who they are who are basically damaging/sabotaging this once great country.. do us all a favour and go live in the EU if you love it that much ! ![]() |
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#31 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: London SW6
Posts: 37,469
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Quote:
Leave and Remainers, put down your differences and come together for the good of the UK !
instead of fighting about what happened the vote to leave the EU.. we are leaving, that much is clear. Time to accept that and move forward. For the good of the country, please move on.. |
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#32 |
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Scotlandshire
Posts: 9,078
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Leave and Remainers, put down your differences and come together for the good of the UK !
instead of fighting about what happened the vote to leave the EU.. we are leaving, that much is clear. Time to accept that and move forward. For the good of the country, please move on.. Now that we are leaving it's possible that it'll turn out that the middle ground really is worse than completely in or completely out. It might also turn out that May was genuinely eurosceptic but decided on balance in was better out. It's possible she's gone through all of that inside her head. Perhaps it's be a good idea if she tried to persuade soft Leavers and Remainers of that. |
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#33 |
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Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Devon
Posts: 47,965
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Leaving aside the likes of Blair and Major and those who want a second referendum based on the exit agreement in the hope the UK will remain in the EU there appears to a general consensus the UK will leave the EU.
There are only a limited number of options and imo they appear to be; 1. Remain in the EEA, the so called 'soft' Brexit 2. Leave the EEA and trade under WTO, the so called 'hard' Brexit 3. Leave the EEA and trade with the EU via a FTA. 4. The same as 3 but have a transitional period of option 1. Obviously leavers will typically favour 2 and/or 3 as they address the key reasons for leaving and remainers will favour 1 as the UK stays in the single market and to a lesser extent 4. The issue with 4 for leavers is it may never happen leaving option 1 in place. |
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#34 |
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Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 3,660
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Quote:
Leaving aside the likes of Blair and Major and those who want a second referendum based on the exit agreement in the hope the Uk will remain in the EU there appears to a consensus the UK will leave the EU.
There are only a limited number of options and imo they appear to be; 1. Remain in the EEA, the so called 'soft' Brexit 2. Leave the EEA and trade under WTO, the so called 'hard' Brexit 3. Leave the EEA and trade with the EU via a FTA. 4. The same as 3 but have a transitional period of option 1. Obviously leavers will typically favour 2 and 3 as it addresses the key reasons for leaving and remainers will favour 1 as the UK stays in the single market and to a less extent 4. The issue with 4 for leavers is it may never happen leaving option 1 in place. |
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#35 |
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 12,003
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Reality kicking in?
We can't have our cake and eat it, a hard Brexit is dangerous and as the more extreme option probably doesn't have majority support. I agree though, a soft Brexit is bad too, then we are paying in, abiding by the rules but have no influence. I don't think the next GE will resolve it either, most of UKIP are supported by the EU's payroll. The longer this goes on for, the better it is for them. |
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#36 |
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 40,276
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I do live in the EU, it's great. Have done since the day I was born. You're trying to cock it up for me.
The U.K. Is a member of the EU and we have voted democratically to leave. You are of course free to leave now and exercise your freedom of movement rights to join the mass ranks of the young unemployed in much of southern and Eastern Europe. So what is stopping you? |
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#37 |
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 12,003
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Were you born after 1 November 1993 - only people born after that date have been in the EU since birth.
The U.K. Is a member of the EU and we have voted democratically to leave. You are of course free to leave now and exercise your freedom of movement rights to join the mass ranks of the young unemployed in much of southern and Eastern Europe. So what is stopping you? Anyway, to your main point, even those of us born before then, in the 80's, it would still stand as we would have been in primary school when we were not in the EU (so unaware of it either way). |
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#38 |
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 12,662
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Options??
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Options imply something coherent and distinct...all we are getting right now is whatever Bojo, Davies or Fox wrote on the back of a fag packet this morning or what they dreamed up last night...probably from eating too much cheese. Wake me up when they all find the hymn books...never mind start singing from the same page
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#39 |
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Gtr Manchester UK
Posts: 7,914
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Leave and Remainers, put down your differences and come together for the good of the UK !
instead of fighting about what happened the vote to leave the EU.. we are leaving, that much is clear. Time to accept that and move forward. For the good of the country, please move on.. Now, if that's not good enough for the Hard Brexiteers, what can and will they do about it? |
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#40 |
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 8,253
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Where do you get your "punished" quote from. Anyone actually representing the rest of the EU?
Not having your cake and eating it, not being a able to enjoy the benefits of membership without the commitments is not "punishment". https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/136483...-negotiations/ |
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#41 |
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,727
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Were you born after 1 November 1993 - only people born after that date have been in the EU since birth.
The U.K. Is a member of the EU and we have voted democratically to leave. You are of course free to leave now and exercise your freedom of movement rights to join the mass ranks of the young unemployed in much of southern and Eastern Europe. So what is stopping you? |
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#42 |
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Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 1,000
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Blame the Government. Specifically Cameron but also his colleagues on both sides of the 'debate'.
They had ample opportunity to define what 'Brexit' meant, before the referendum. They failed to do so. I, along with a number of others, asked the question over and over and over again on this forum and elsewhere. Not once did I get an unequivocal "out of the EEA" from anyone. We all know why the leavers were vague on this question though -- to have said "out means out of the EEA, single market etc" would have scared off the undecided voters. Well, you live with the consequences now. I don't agree with those seeking to delay A50 but I acknowledge that this is the inevitable result of Governmental incompetence. |
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#43 |
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Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: London SW6
Posts: 37,469
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Quote:
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#44 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Gtr Manchester UK
Posts: 7,914
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Blame the Government. Specifically Cameron but also his colleagues on both sides of the 'debate'.
They had ample opportunity to define what 'Brexit' meant, before the referendum. They failed to do so. I, along with a number of others, asked the question over and over and over again on this forum and elsewhere. Not once did I get an unequivocal "out of the EEA" from anyone. We all know why the leavers were vague on this question though -- to have said "out means out of the EEA, single market etc" would have scared off the undecided voters. Well, you live with the consequences now. I don't agree with those seeking to delay A50 but I acknowledge that this is the inevitable result of Governmental incompetence. Always thought the referendum should have had three choices, to remain in the EU, to leave but join EFTA (and remain in the EEA) - on the assumption if we couldn't join EFTA we would remain in the EU, and thirdly to leave the EU and not attempt to join EFTA. I think I would have gone for the second choice, to join EFTA. |
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#45 |
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 8,253
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Er, where?
VENGEFUL EU boss Jean-Claude Juncker is plotting a Brussels coup to seize control of Brexit negotiations and*punish the UK with a tough deal, The Sun can reveal. |
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#46 |
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Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 1,204
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As soon as you accept that the vote wasn't to leave the single market or end freedom of movement.
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#47 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 1,000
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Quote:
Always thought the referendum should have had three choices, to remain in the EU, to leave but join EFTA (and remain in the EEA) - on the assumption if we couldn't join EFTA we would remain in the EU, and thirdly to leave the EU and not attempt to join EFTA.
I think I would have gone for the second choice, to join EFTA. I have always thought there should have been two questions on the ballot: 1) In or out of the EU; 2) in or out of the EEA/Single Market/whatever you want to call it. At the very least it would have more appropriately steered the debate. We would then have had absolute clarity on where the mood of the country truly is. |
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#48 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,568
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Quote:
Try clicking on the link
VENGEFUL EU boss Jean-Claude Juncker is plotting a Brussels coup to seize control of Brexit negotiations and*punish the UK with a tough deal, The Sun can reveal. Particularly when said newspaper has a clear agenda to try and paint anything and anyone to do with the EU in as negative a light as possible. |
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#49 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Gtr Manchester UK
Posts: 7,914
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Quote:
Three-choice referendums don't work because of the plurality, rather than majority of the result.
. If we go down the referendum route to select our MP's then, yes, we should whittle the candidates down to two and vote for either. However - didn't we have a referendum on a reasonably similar system....
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#50 |
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Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 10,591
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You understand a newspaper's interpretation of something isn't the same as someone actually saying it?
Particularly when said newspaper has a clear agenda to try and paint anything and anyone to do with the EU in as negative a light as possible. |
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