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Angela Merkel calls for ban on burqa in Germany |
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#51 |
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Is there a German election soon?
![]() http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7458536.html Hasn't she had a decade in office to do this? Germany’s potential burqa ban has a problem: Where are the burqas? |
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#52 |
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This stunned me. So 'Banning the Burqa' has become a political point scoring issue and not the male attitudes that have made it an issue in the first place..?
It was reported today that a boy was raped in Sweden by a group of Afghani's and yet - the Burqa is what we really need to fight - right? Is this just a case of picking on the easiest, quietest but, visible target? How about tackling the general misogyny their religion/culture inspires? How about tackling proper and appropriate integration? Nope - let's pick on the poor sods that have zero voice either way. But nevertheless I can't imagine it being a pressing issue which is high on the list of priorities. As such I agree with you that it's a soft target which doesn't really address anybody or help anybody. It just seems to be a very cheap way to attempt to cling onto votes. Which I think most people will see through. It's nearly as boneheaded as the French authorities banning the burquni recently. Again, it's bloody stupid and simply doesn't address the real concerns of most people who have issues with some of the crazy immigration policies. It does pick on the smallest minority of people who are causing the least harm. It was truly something to be ashamed of seeing the photograph of French police with the Muslim woman on a beach trying to get her to remove her swimwear. I don't know what is going on in their heads. These politicians I mean. Is this about some prejudice going on in their own minds, and they think that this is what offends the average person? Or is it some kind of distraction tactic to try to make it appear as if the problem is something they find easier to deal with? I honestly don't know. |
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#53 |
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This stunned me. So 'Banning the Burqa' has become a political point scoring issue and not the male attitudes that have made it an issue in the first place..?
It was reported today that a boy was raped in Sweden by a group of Afghani's and yet - the Burqa is what we really need to fight - right? Is this just a case of picking on the easiest, quietest but, visible target? How about tackling the general misogyny their religion/culture inspires? How about tackling proper and appropriate integration? Nope - let's pick on the poor sods that have zero voice either way. Quote:
I can see Trump supporting this but I can't see a bill being put forward in Congress then passing.
What I see happening, however, is Trump encouraging states to do this resulting in a solid amount of red states like Oklahoma, Alabama, Louisiana, Georgia, South Carolina, Texas maybe even the likes of Pennsylvania and Ohio doing it in the next four years. As for the UK, maybe England and Wales will get it down the line if a terrorist attack happens at some point which the right wing lot of Tories will use to their advantage to get this passed, unsure about Northern Ireland as I don't know if Sinn Fein would be keen on it and Scotland definitely not as I can't see any of Nicola, Ruth or Kezia supporting it. Quote:
There are some brainwashed people around here. The burkha should never have been allowed here in the first place, it's disgusting.
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But the burqa is a symptom of that misogyny.
the issue is really about male insecurity and the fact women are in total control of what is visible to men. its not supposed to be that way is it.
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#54 |
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so the 'problem' isnt burka wearers but the fascistic right that she's having to pander to.
Germany’s potential burqa ban has a problem: Where are the burqas? This burqa stuff seems to mainly come from politicians for some reason. I'm sure some of you will be able to remember quite far back now how Jack Straw made a public statement about how he felt that the burqa was wrong and that people shouldn't wear it. That was around the year 2000. It always seem to come from politicians. I've seen the burqa being brought up as a symbol of oppression from time to time in discussion, but really as far as I see it it figures very low on the list of problems in some of the most heated discussions about Muslims and immigration. It's not seen as a good thing, but it's hardly seen to be the major problem with most people like the politicans might have you believe. To my mind it's an almost insignificant issue compared to other things. |
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#55 |
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Like I said in my previous post, I've hardly seen anyone wearing a burqa in my life. This is in the UK though, I can't speak for how prevalent burqa wearing in Germany is.
But nevertheless I can't imagine it being a pressing issue which is high on the list of priorities. As such I agree with you that it's a soft target which doesn't really address anybody or help anybody. It just seems to be a very cheap way to attempt to cling onto votes. Which I think most people will see through. It's nearly as boneheaded as the French authorities banning the burquni recently. Again, it's bloody stupid and simply doesn't address the real concerns of most people who have issues with some of the crazy immigration policies. It does pick on the smallest minority of people who are causing the least harm. It was truly something to be ashamed of seeing the photograph of French police with the Muslim woman on a beach trying to get her to remove her swimwear. I don't know what is going on in their heads. These politicians I mean. Is this about some prejudice going on in their own minds, and they think that this is what offends the average person? Or is it some kind of distraction tactic to try to make it appear as if the problem is something they find easier to deal with? I honestly don't know. politicians are reacting to the shouty fascistic right who say they are not allowed to say anything because of PC. its pandering to the red neck sensibilities of a violent minority. as for immigration in uk over 40 years on average has been 0.4% / year . its not about immigration its really about neo liberal thatcherite policies. but why would politicians, wealthy and corporates - all of whom have been beneficiaries of these policies point fingers at themmselves. far easier to scapegoat the weakest, voiceless in society. |
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#56 |
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There's no law against being an idiot. If an obese person, for example, wanted to wear speedos in the high street then it's their problem not ours (well apart from trying to blank out the image).
If your argument is that women shouldn't wear burkas because it oppresses women then you have to start thinking of banning Jewish women wearing the Sheitel, perhaps ban marriage ceremonies where men and women are separated, schools where boys and girls are separated... ... where does it end?
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#57 |
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in uk its estimated that between 1000-2000 women wear the burka. in france the french government estimated 2000 .
far easier to scapegoat the weakest, voiceless in society. |
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#58 |
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Actually where it is a reenactment or fancy dress or just a bit of idiocy it is not but if it is considered a political uniform then it does fall foul of a Public Order act. That was the point I was trying to make that a political uniform (and there is little doubt that many use the Burqua as a political statement) is against the law.
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#59 |
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I should have added mankinis to my list of idiotic things to wear.
![]() What happened to these men was deplorable; intolerance always is. Let's not increase it's occurence, shall we? |
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#60 |
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And anyway, how many people actually wear the burqa anyway? Is she actually talking about the burqa or the niqab? I don't know about in Germany but in the UK I've very rarely seen anyone wear a burqa. I think it's a lot rarer than people think.
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#61 |
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But as I see it wearing a burqa hardly figures highly into most of the heated arguments I've seen about Islam. It seems like a non-issue to most people.
This burqa stuff seems to mainly come from politicians for some reason. I'm sure some of you will be able to remember quite far back now how Jack Straw made a public statement about how he felt that the burqa was wrong and that people shouldn't wear it. That was around the year 2000. It always seem to come from politicians. I've seen the burqa being brought up as a symbol of oppression from time to time in discussion, but really as far as I see it it figures very low on the list of problems in some of the most heated discussions about Muslims and immigration. It's not seen as a good thing, but it's hardly seen to be the major problem with most people like the politicans might have you believe. To my mind it's an almost insignificant issue compared to other things. the political classes understand the power of the media aligned with populist fascistic rhetoric and the weakest pander to it or else the media will chew them up. just look at the way corbyn is attacked for his logical immigration stance. fact is immigration is a factor of the economy. no politician can stop it because it limits the capacity of corporates/business and the lack of investment into infrastructure is offset by having educated skilled semi skilled immigrants (that we havent paid for), unskilled are necessary to maintain the fabric of our society - the dirty work that we will not undertake. this in an ageing society. the reason why merkel sought large scale immigration is because there is a need for young productive migrants to offset germanys population issues. and migrants = growth in gdp. its much the same reason blair/tories have pursued the same policy except recruiting from across europe. they had hoped white eu immigration would not create societal backlash. point is uk needs migrants for economic needs. the blair government ran with anti islam narrative because uk was intent on ransacking - asset strip - the mid east. it needed to justify uk's crimes. this also had the effect of feeding the narrative amongst the fascistic right that was then getting in their minds 'legitimacy' because of government political needs |
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#62 |
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Too late. I will ask the question that so many ask on here in a rather holier than thou way. Why should we tolerate intolerance?
As a whole women wearing the burka are not Evil Islamist Terrorists so what is the logic behind banning the burka? |
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#63 |
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So the solution is further intolerance
Why should it be banned? Do you think that female Muslims should be punished further? |
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#64 |
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One does not make legal an act of abuse because it may mean that the abuse will be worse. The female Muslims are British citizens/residents and as such have access to, and the protection of, all the laws the rest of us have. WE do not allow men to beat their wives in public because it is feared that if they were not allowed to it would be much worse in private. If the wearing of the Burqua is perceived to be a form of abuse then in all honesty we cannot allow its continuance.
its all about how you feel. |
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#65 |
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Maybe it depends where you're from, I see loads of of women wearing a burqa and at spot at least one woman wearing one daily. It doesn't bother me though, they can wear it if they want to and are not likely to interact with me - a male - anyway. However I have never once in my life seen a woman wear one whilst working a customer-related job like another poster said and I live in a multicultural area. That might make it difficult as I rely on some lip reading too but I've never come across it.
You raise an interesting point though, in that I've never seen anyone wearing a burqa in a job which requires public interaction. Of course there must be some who do, but I've never encountered such a person in my life. Doesn't mean that it doesn't happen, but it must be rare. |
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#66 |
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How can you fight intolerance with intolerance?
As a whole women wearing the burka are not Evil Islamist Terrorists so what is the logic behind banning the burka? https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...nt-intolerance |
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#67 |
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I'm genuinely shocked that Merkel has said something sensible.
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#68 |
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so its about your/others perceptions but not the fact that it is entirely the choice of the wearer.
its all about how you feel. |
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#69 |
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If the wearing of the Burqua is perceived to be a form of abuse then in all honesty we cannot allow its continuance.
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#70 |
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trump supports hatred, it makes it easier to control the masses.
I can see a lot of Tories voting AGAINST it on purely moral grounds. ![]() https://yougov.co.uk/news/2016/08/31...cks-burka-ban/ Alot of Tory MPs actually campaigned for it back in 2013 in the alternative Queen's speech. I imagine the majority of the party will also be in favour of it. ![]() http://www.conservativehome.com/thet...bel-bills.html |
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#71 |
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Like I said in my previous post, I've hardly seen anyone wearing a burqa in my life. This is in the UK though, I can't speak for how prevalent burqa wearing in Germany is..
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#72 |
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Surely the sensible compromise is not to ban it, as its not right the state banning items of clothing - however burqas must not be worn in places where no one else is allowed to cover their face, such as at airports and banks?
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#73 |
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the irony of mainly white men telling women what not to wear and not recognising the misogyny in doing so
"could you show me the research that has shown a significant statistical link between women in usa/uk/europe wearing burka and terrorism. thanks." A terrorist escaped from the UK by boarding a flight dressed in a burka in the early/ mid 2000s, I recall. "why not? why do you feel that you have the right to be telling women what to wear?" Muslim men do. theres no proven linkage. i suppose expecting women to be half naked is misogyny too. "the issue is really about male insecurity and the fact women are in total control of what is visible to men. its not supposed to be that way is it. "And your point is what? The religion and Men who follow the religion are telling the women they have to wear the burka. |
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#74 |
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I'm genuinely shocked that Merkel has said something sensible.
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#75 |
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I'm genuinely shocked that Merkel has said something sensible.
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