|
||||||||
Secularism and why Christianity has alienated people |
![]() |
|
|
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
|
|
#1 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Cuddling MyLee
Posts: 4,730
|
Secularism and why Christianity has alienated people
You're probably thinking "not another religion post" with this discussion. I personally think Secularism is the way forward for the UK. Whilst I respect people have a faith and have that choice to believe, you can see why secularism is on the increase.
Christianity has alienated a lot of people in society. It's taken ages for the CoE and various other offshoots to accept female vicars to lead services. Not allowing same-sex marriages and some of the vitriol that has been broadcast in the media and from some Christians in huge opposition towards homosexuality. Adding to that, the hypocrisy of the church of preaching morals, when there are people without homes, without money and in need of help and support. The sad case of the homeless man that froze to death in Birmingham, when there was a street preacher not far from where he was preaching not bothering to help. Personally I think Christianity will be almost dead religion in the UK in 30-40 years, and I for one would welcome a secular state. I don't see Islam as a threat, as there is only 3-5% of adherents and even that has had it's numbers dwindle. I also think it says it all when other faiths (Sikh, Islam, Hindus, Judaism) seem to be out there delivering their basic principles of helping those out yet Christianity seems to becoming a very closed shop - in fact, I've heard of churches being middle class and full of Conservatives turning away those of working class or on benefits - the polar opposite of what Jesus Christ was! What do you think? |
|
|
|
|
Please sign in or register to remove this advertisement.
|
|
|
#2 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: May 2005
Location: woking
Posts: 21,659
|
I think the churches I attend are full to bursting at the weekends. I absolutely think the state should be secular but Christianity isn't dead yet and I doubt it ever will be.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#3 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 6,348
|
I personally believe that people should be able to hold whatever faiths and beliefs they want but in NO way should they impose them on other people. Religion etc should be kept out of schools and all workplaces.
It certainly has no place in how the country is run, and there should be no religious exceptions when providing services to anyone. |
|
|
|
|
|
#4 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 24,096
|
The reason christianity has alienated people in uk is, it's been almost entirely taken over, during the last 40 years, by evangelicals. That's why williams resigned, as archbish of cantab, and why his successor cary thinks the church of england will split up .........
|
|
|
|
|
|
#5 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 24,096
|
In many countries, christianity is growing, but mostly pentecostalism and similar sects.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#6 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: The Deathstar
Posts: 15,385
|
Quote:
I personally believe that people should be able to hold whatever faiths and beliefs they want but in NO way should they impose them on other people. Religion etc should be kept out of schools and all workplaces.
It certainly has no place in how the country is run, and there should be no religious exceptions when providing services to anyone. If some religious nut job quotes me a verse from their chosen fairytale, then I quote them an almighty bollocks in return. |
|
|
|
|
|
#7 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Cuddling MyLee
Posts: 4,730
|
Quote:
This exactly, if people want to learn about religion then there are certain establishments to do so, nut jobs preaching on the street should be outlawed & the door knocking from the people in suits, should also be made illegal.
If some religious nut job quotes me a verse from their chosen fairytale, then I quote them an almighty bollocks in return. We should be a 100% secular country, do what France does and embrace secularism. |
|
|
|
|
|
#8 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Station Eleven
Posts: 3,474
|
We won't have a secular state as long as the monarch is Defender of the Faith. I think Prince Charles has said he'd like the title Defender of Faith, but that would require the consent of Parliament.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#9 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: May 2005
Location: woking
Posts: 21,659
|
Quote:
Personally, I agree. I think street preaching, especially hate should be an unlimited fine and / or prison. Jehovah's Witness....I'd go far as criminalising them as it's a sect and with all the alleged abuse etc, it'd be one way to put a stop to them, perhaps some sort of de-programming service for members and the ones that are responsible for abuse, a one-off return for the death penalty?
We should be a 100% secular country, do what France does and embrace secularism. |
|
|
|
|
|
#10 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: looking for tinned loganberrie
Posts: 17,497
|
I used to be a staunch secularist. But the water is muddied completely these days by people who equate secularism with atheism. It's very difficult to discuss in a focussed way.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#11 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 6,773
|
Quote:
We won't have a secular state as long as the monarch is Defender of the Faith. I think Prince Charles has said he'd like the title Defender of Faith, but that would require the consent of Parliament.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#12 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,108
|
Quote:
We won't have a secular state as long as the monarch is Defender of the Faith.
'We will meet you where the lights are, The defenders, of the faith we are.'
|
|
|
|
|
|
#13 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: 🖥⌨🖱
Posts: 29,239
|
One of the biggest problems for secularism is that influential opponents conflate it with atheism (itself too often conflated with anti-theism) for the obvious reason that in so doing they can exploit and employ the power of atheophobic bigotry to protect religious privilege.
So, unfortunately, I fear the prospects for secularism are very much linked to greater equality for atheists at least in line with what we've achieved for gay people and ethnic minorities etc. |
|
|
|
|
#14 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: London
Posts: 41,692
|
Quote:
I used to be a staunch secularist. But the water is muddied completely these days by people who equate secularism with atheism. It's very difficult to discuss in a focussed way.
Or perhaps the muddying created by calling a government consultation document 'Schools that Work for Everyone' when it proposes removing the 50% limit on faith based admissions and allowing 'Faith' schools to select all its pupils on faith criteria. This consultation therefore proposes that we replace the ‘cap’ for faith free schools – including for existing schools – with a series of strengthened safeguards to promote inclusivity, thereby allowing free schools with up to 100% faith-based admissions. https://consult.education.gov.uk/sch...20%20FINAL.pdf If this dreadful proposal is accepted we will soon be seeing new schools opening with totally religiously segregated pupil bodies and we will all be paying for this. |
|
|
|
|
|
#15 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 267
|
Quote:
The sad case of the homeless man that froze to death in Birmingham, when there was a street preacher not far from where he was preaching not bothering to help.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#16 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 10,271
|
Christianity hasn't alienated me and I'm neither conservative or christian. I don't really get what the fuss is about.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#17 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ashtray City
Posts: 4,721
|
Should work like this in my opinion: we should have freedom of religion, and freedom from religion.
Why on Earth we should all dance to the tambourine of a religion or God we don't believe in is beyond me. Blasphemy laws really did do a great deal of damage for religion too, but sadly, I wonder if - in the worthwhile pursuit of harmony - we're starting to fall back into adopting it again. Secularism can be the only way forward. Having a state religion usually goes one of two ways - it dictates everything, and the inevitable clash between freedom, human rights etc. is called into question, or you have it where it's there in name but no-one is arsed by it, even a great many of the apparent adherents (e.g. Church of England). The latter seems harmless enough until you consider the role it still plays in politics, education, etc. Secularism is as good for religion as it is for non-religion. The argument can be made about how good laws are introduced or influenced by religion - which is fine - but it conveniently ignores that a great many good laws were made in spite of it, and a great many bad laws were made with its blessing. Whether laïcité is the way to go or not, well, that's up for debate. But surely, it's got to be a system that applies equally. I'm no fan of religion, but I find it utterly absurd how some would advocate the banning of religious apparel for one faith, but not another. That can't work. As soon as you issue 'preferred faiths', you're acting outside of secularism. But certainly, religion should abide by society, and not the other way around. |
|
|
|
|
|
#18 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ashtray City
Posts: 4,721
|
I should also add that I don't think Christianity is solely to blame for the current apathy towards religion. But equally, I don't think it can claim it is 'outside' the scope of blame either. Certainly, nobody's shit can claim to smell better than any other's!
|
|
|
|
|
|
#19 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 24,096
|
Depends wot u mean by ''christianity''. The sorts of churches i remember from my childhood have entirely vanished, and all been replaced by screaming ranting gibbering nutters.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#20 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 20,481
|
Looking forward to the day that secularist organisations take over the running of the thousands of Food Banks up and down the country.
Any idea when that will be? |
|
|
|
|
|
#21 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Devon
Posts: 12,830
|
Religion has been oppressive and abusive for Centuries and more.
Once the People became educated, and Societal Class Barriers dissolved, many said "Sod that for a Game of (Christian) Soldiers" |
|
|
|
|
|
#22 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ashtray City
Posts: 4,721
|
Quote:
Looking forward to the day that secularist organisations take over the running of the thousands of Food Banks up and down the country.
Any idea when that will be? What role do you think the Church and its many members could play in that? |
|
|
|
|
|
#23 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 911
|
Quote:
Religion has been oppressive and abusive for Centuries and more.
Once the People became educated, and Societal Class Barriers dissolved, many said "Sod that for a Game of (Christian) Soldiers" I realised many years ago that a church is not only bricks and mortar its a belief. |
|
|
|
|
|
#24 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ashtray City
Posts: 4,721
|
Quote:
I would suggest as a none believer that the majority of Brits whether they go to church or not still class themselves as Christians.
I realised many years ago that a church is not only bricks and mortar its a belief. |
|
|
|
|
|
#25 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 6,449
|
Quote:
You're probably thinking "not another religion post" with this discussion. I personally think Secularism is the way forward for the UK. Whilst I respect people have a faith and have that choice to believe, you can see why secularism is on the increase.
Quote:
Christianity has alienated a lot of people in society.
Quote:
Not allowing same-sex marriages and some of the vitriol that has been broadcast in the media and from some Christians in huge opposition towards homosexuality.
Quote:
Personally I think Christianity will be almost dead religion in the UK in 30-40 years, [
|
|
|
|
![]() |
|
All times are GMT. The time now is 13:54.



