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In-work poverty hits a record high


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Old 07-12-2016, 10:56
Tassium
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The Joseph Roundtree Foundation have two and half pages available on the internet which explain definitions of poverty

Relative poverty
"Resources are so seriousky low below thise commanded by the average individual or family that they are in effect excluded from ordinary living patterns ,customs and activities"
That's nice but I wish these organisations would use more typical language.

"Not enough money to buy stuff and services that the majority can get"


So the consequence it clear, as more and more people are in this situation it must have a crushing effect on the UK economy because that's the type of economy we have.

The solution is not to end in-work benefits or create a sky-high minimum wage, it's to create an society where people can afford to live while on lower wages.

That means high quality public services that are free or very cheap, especially housing/transport/healthcare.

The destruction of public services is a destruction of the UKs economy.
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Old 07-12-2016, 11:52
razorboy
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So who defines "ordinary"?
It may be difficult to define but there are a lot of people in the position where there financial situation severely impacts on their ability to participate in society, eat a proper diet or keep themselves warm and this will eventually affect there health increasing pressures on the NHS and social care

I understand there are not easy answers but the wilfully evasive are either living in denial or showing a callous lack of humanity
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Old 07-12-2016, 12:28
nomad2king
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Wealth is defined by the difference between Income and costs, Why not the same for poverty, surely that is what counts. I know costs can be discretionary (as sometimes can Income for that matter) but surely we can find ways to define a basic living cost where the two main variables are housing and social care.
But the report isn't using costs in any way.
People with less than 60% of median income are classified as poor. Overall poverty was down, the government said.

Its figures suggested poverty numbers had been falling compared to six years ago.

"Since 2010, the number of people living in poverty has fallen by 300,000 but we know there is more to do. We are increasing the National Living Wage and taking millions of people out of income tax, to make sure it always pays to be in work," a government spokesman said.
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Old 07-12-2016, 13:14
Mark_Jones9
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The report uses the following poverty thresholds
Single Adult net income £141 a week
Lone parent with one young child net income £190 a week
Couple with no children net income £243 a week
Couple with two children net income £393 a week
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Old 07-12-2016, 13:51
nomad2king
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The current "Living Wage" for a Single parent with 3 kids is £18.40/hour. Good luck with getting anywhere near that. Same as it has ALWAYS been.
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Old 07-12-2016, 13:58
mungobrush
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The report uses the following poverty thresholds
Single Adult net income £141 a week
Lone parent with one young child net income £190 a week
Couple with no children net income £243 a week
Couple with two children net income £393 a week
There are multiple definitions of "poverty"
Just try google
What these self-interested groups do is pick the one that supports their agenda, then use that one to scream out shock horror headlines.
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Old 07-12-2016, 14:15
trunkster
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There are multiple definitions of "poverty"
Just try google
What these self-interested groups do is pick the one that supports their agenda, then use that one to scream out shock horror headlines.
Exactly, only look for and report facts and figures that support/justify your organisations existence.
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Old 07-12-2016, 15:13
Vast_Girth
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The current "Living Wage" for a Single parent with 3 kids is £18.40/hour. Good luck with getting anywhere near that. Same as it has ALWAYS been.
If that is correct, then that is only £35k a year. Most people should be aspirations of getting "anywhere near" that and beyond once they are established in their careers.
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Old 07-12-2016, 15:20
CSJB
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If that is correct, then that is only £35k a year. Most people should be aspirations of getting "anywhere near" that and beyond once they are established in their careers.
The average wage in the UK is only £26500.
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Old 07-12-2016, 15:27
Vast_Girth
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The average wage in the UK is only £26500.
Thats true, but a lot of people counted in that are just starting out in their careers, which drags the average down.. Once you are old enough to start a family you should be old enough to advance your career to earn more.
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Old 07-12-2016, 15:31
Mr Oleo Strut
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The current system simply isn't working for too many people.




http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7458981.html
Why is tax-money being used to underwrite businesses who are not paying their workers enough? They should be forced by government to pay the correct rate for the job. No nonsense.
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Old 07-12-2016, 15:47
Annsyre
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The report uses the following poverty thresholds
Single Adult net income £141 a week
Lone parent with one young child net income £190 a week
Couple with no children net income £243 a week
Couple with two children net income £393 a week
How does that compare with pensioners' incomes or are they included?
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Old 07-12-2016, 16:31
Bacon&Eggs
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Why is tax-money being used to underwrite businesses who are not paying their workers enough? They should be forced by government to pay the correct rate for the job. No nonsense.
Good question. Why doesn't work pay?
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Old 07-12-2016, 16:34
snowy ghost
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There wont be any work soon for millions of people ..when all the robots get stuck in
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Old 07-12-2016, 18:02
Bacon&Eggs
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Good question. Why doesn't work pay?
Well, Bacon&Eggs. In answer to your very good question, which seems to have all the economic "experts" around here silenced.

Because the labour market is a wash with cheap labour. It's simple supply/demand market forces.
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Old 07-12-2016, 18:51
Tassium
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Well, Bacon&Eggs. In answer to your very good question, which seems to have all the economic "experts" around here silenced.

Because the labour market is a wash with cheap labour. It's simple supply/demand market forces.
The minimum wage should largely deal with that problem.


It's rent/council tax, transport and utilities that's the problem.

If the all-in cost for a two bedroom flat was £350/month then we would have a much better economy. (rent/CT/utilities)

So the utilities were privatised to enrich the rich.
Social housing was decimated to enrich the rich.
Council tax for the lower paid is high to subsidise the rich.

There's a pattern here...
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Old 07-12-2016, 22:20
Bacon&Eggs
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The minimum wage should largely deal with that problem.
Absolutely it should but it doesn't because it's set too low to provide "a living" hence the need to subsidise it with in work benefits.

They arrived at £7.50 by determining what businesses could afford to pay, rather than what the typical person needs to live. ok that makes financial sense because we'd be daft to unnecessarily burden business beyond it's means but why is there a gap? If a business can't fulfill it's raison d'être and pay staff a "living" what use is it. It should be allowed to fail. We have a superb economy don't we, yet thousands of companies need hand outs to keep them afloat.

It's rent/council tax, transport and utilities that's the problem.

If the all-in cost for a two bedroom flat was £350/month then we would have a much better economy. (rent/CT/utilities)

So the utilities were privatised to enrich the rich.
Social housing was decimated to enrich the rich.
Council tax for the lower paid is high to subsidise the rich.

There's a pattern here...
The labour market creates personal wealth to workers where as the rich derive personal wealth from other markets - housing and investment, those requiring capital. Markets are driven by supply and demand and therefore can be manipulated if you can artificially over/under supply them. If you as a politician have a policy of over-supplying the labour market with immigrants, should you not also have a policy of over-supplying the housing market with homes?

To have a double standard here is to limit wealth potential for one and free potential for the other, to treat the worker differently to the investor, dare i say, the poor differently from the rich.
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Old 08-12-2016, 03:10
alfamale
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The average wage in the UK is only £26500.
And its not an equal distribution of people above and below that average. Isn't it something like 65% of working people earn less than this average wage? (For every one person earning £1M you need 80 people earning the national min wage to get to an average of £26k)
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Old 08-12-2016, 03:20
FusionFury
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What defines poverty? do they buy fags and booze?
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