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MPs have voted in favour of the Government's timetable to trigger Article 50 by March |
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#101 |
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Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: London SW6
Posts: 37,482
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It is also baffling as to why EU law categorically states that we will be entitled to a two year negotiation period once A50 is triggered. Yet they have changed their own treaty to suit their own agenda! Shouldn't this be up for contention?
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#102 |
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 34,226
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A 327 majority in favour.
As this shows the Commoms will back triggering A50. Only the Lords can block it and they had better not dare as it would be an outrage given the clear will of the Commoms and the referendum result, Labour seems to be edging towards demanding access to the customs union . That's incompatible with some of what Leave promised , and what the Tory right can vote for. Labour also has no agreement within it on immigration , and accepting immigration control would force the party issue , or leave them unable to back the plan. Labour will want the Tories to be committed to the unobtainable - so they are seen to fail, and they will gain political advantage. And they will want to list unobtainable economic ends , so they can blame the Tories when the economy slumps . their best plan is still to make an utopian list - and then try and get votes when its not met. This still has a long way to run . One option may be for May to table the immigration issue first - because that dictates the economic solution . She could call a debate on something like - This house agrees that the referendum result demands the reintroduction of some effective, national, control of immigration That gives her a priority her MPs will all back - and it blows Labour apart, while driving Labour and Liberals away from the voter's view. Once the priority is approved, the answer to most economic issues is we will get the best deal we can after establishing that immigration control. |
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#103 |
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Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 12,901
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Gina Miller, Nick Clegg, Tony Blair and Remoaners.. your boys took one hell of a beating !
now we finally can move on and get on with Brexit. Remoaners have to lump it or move. This is what unity looks like. Supreme Court doesn't matter. Labour has given the Tories the blank cheque they wanted !
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#104 |
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Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 12,901
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chiangmai1 3 hours ago
all those mp,s who support leave will keep the seats.the others who don,t may be out the next time a vote happens.the gina millers of the uk deserve what they get against what the people want https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/234900...iament-result/ Couldn't have put it better myself ! the rats have been exposed ! May's trap was executed perfectly, brilliantly set up. She played a blinder here.Smug and arrogant Gina Miller, who has no business in the political arena in the first place with the big boys and girls and interfering in the will of the British people.. can now do one ! I don't think she don't care about the British people she doesn't seem patriotric.. she seem to care just about herself/her own agendas and I'm really glad she ain't stopping Brexit ! we would never never of heard the end of it.. the irony is all that money she's wasted on court fees and cases, plus travelling to the supreme court.. all for nothing !
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#105 |
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Parliment Sq waving a banner
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Interestingly only 5 Lib Dems voted against. Not sure if the others voted with the government or abstained. Would have expected all 9 to vote against.
Those voting against Alistair Carmichael Nick Clegg Tim Farron Sarah Olney Mark Williams I would have expected 9 too with all the Lib Dems guff on Remaining. |
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#106 |
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Parliment Sq waving a banner
Posts: 3,289
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Anyone see Anna Soubry on the news? I thought she was going to burst into tears, flounce off and slam the door!
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#107 |
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Parliment Sq waving a banner
Posts: 3,289
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Not forgetting Ken Clarke voting against!!
My MP voted against I shan't be voting for her again. |
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#108 |
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Join Date: May 2003
Location: The Green Hills of Earth
Posts: 80,430
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There isn't really such a thing as 'Britain - The Entity' apart from the 65 million people with all their differing interests
Without the people Britain is just a lump of rock |
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#109 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 10,592
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Quote:
It doesn't. Both main parties have MPs who will never vote to Leave. both have people who will insist, on' contradictory' requirements.
Labour seems to be edging towards demanding access to the customs union . That's incompatible with some of what Leave promised , and what the Tory right can vote for. Labour also has no agreement within it on immigration , and accepting immigration control would force the party issue , or leave them unable to back the plan. Labour will want the Tories to be committed to the unobtainable - so they are seen to fail, and they will gain political advantage. And they will want to list unobtainable economic ends , so they can blame the Tories when the economy slumps . their best plan is still to make an utopian list - and then try and get votes when its not met. This still has a long way to run . One option may be for May to table the immigration issue first - because that dictates the economic solution . She could call a debate on something like - This house agrees that the referendum result demands the reintroduction of some effective, national, control of immigration That gives her a priority her MPs will all back - and it blows Labour apart, while driving Labour and Liberals away from the voter's view. Once the priority is approved, the answer to most economic issues is we will get the best deal we can after establishing that immigration control. If this is Tory party tactic it's a matter of been there done that a couple of months ago and our currency bears the scars. |
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#110 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 3,660
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chiangmai1 3 hours ago
all those mp,s who support leave will keep the seats.the others who don,t may be out the next time a vote happens.the gina millers of the uk deserve what they get against what the people want https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/234900...iament-result/ Couldn't have put it better myself ! the rats have been exposed ! May's trap was executed perfectly, brilliantly set up. She played a blinder here.Smug and arrogant Gina Miller, who has no business in the political arena in the first place with the big boys and girls and interfering in the will of the British people.. can now do one ! I don't think she don't care about the British people she doesn't seem patriotric.. she seem to care just about herself/her own agendas and I'm really glad she ain't stopping Brexit ! we would never never of heard the end of it.. the irony is all that money she's wasted on court fees and cases, plus travelling to the supreme court.. all for nothing ! ![]() You do understand that the motion was passed on the premise that May will have to outline her plans and must answer the question as to whether the UK will stay in the Customs Union? You do understand that there is a huge majority in Parliament that will not pass any Act taking the UK out of the EU unless remaining in the Customs Union is confirmed? You do understand why that is? And I assume you also understand that the reckless appeal of the government has opened a huge can of worms? In particular the case that the Northern Irish constitution cannot legally be amended unless the people of Ireland have given their mandate. In this case the constitution would irrevocably changed by taking Northern Ireland out of the EU while the people have given no such mandate. So rather than relying on the Sun for your information you'd be much better advised to do your own research if you really want to understand where this is all heading. |
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#111 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 3,660
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It is also baffling as to why EU law categorically states that we will be entitled to a two year negotiation period once A50 is triggered. Yet they have changed their own treaty to suit their own agenda! Shouldn't this be up for contention?
The exit must be completed within two years from triggering Article 50. Barnier has stated the obvious - the negotiations of the divorce terms should be completed after 18 months to allow 6 months for ratification by the EU27 and UK Parliament. In reality 6 months is a very narrow window to do this, especially considering the utter mess the UK is in being entirely unable to agree what Brexit means, amplified now by the fact that Labour (with a huge backing from other MPs) is demanding continued membership of the customs union. |
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#112 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 3,660
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It's too far along to play these silly games. Theresa May played this immigration card at Tory Party Conference and crashed the pound. They've made promises to Nissan re trade and no doubt others behind closed doors. Any backtracking on trade is just going to crash pound again. This isn't some political game it's the future prosperity of all of us. Jobs depend on trade.
If this is Tory party tactic it's a matter of been there done that a couple of months ago and our currency bears the scars. |
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#113 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 25,438
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That isn't what should happen and that isn't what most Leave voters want.
Theresa May knows this - no FOM at any cost, no FOM then no single market, suits me. David Cameron said if we voted to Leave the EU then we leave the single market and I believed him, do you think he lied then? |
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#114 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Wammy's House
Posts: 4,784
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chiangmai1 3 hours ago
all those mp,s who support leave will keep the seats.the others who don,t may be out the next time a vote happens.the gina millers of the uk deserve what they get against what the people want https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/234900...iament-result/ Couldn't have put it better myself ! the rats have been exposed ! May's trap was executed perfectly, brilliantly set up. She played a blinder here.Smug and arrogant Gina Miller, who has no business in the political arena in the first place with the big boys and girls and interfering in the will of the British people.. can now do one ! I don't think she don't care about the British people she doesn't seem patriotric.. she seem to care just about herself/her own agendas and I'm really glad she ain't stopping Brexit ! we would never never of heard the end of it.. the irony is all that money she's wasted on court fees and cases, plus travelling to the supreme court.. all for nothing ! ![]() So you thinks she deserves rape threats, and threats to have her kids murdered? |
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#115 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 25,438
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Smug and arrogant Gina Miller, who has no business in the political arena in the first place with the big boys and girls and interfering in the will of the British people.. can now do one ! I don't think she don't care about the British people she doesn't seem patriotric.. she seem to care just about herself/her own agendas and I'm really glad she ain't stopping Brexit !
we would never never of heard the end of it.. the irony is all that money she's wasted on court fees and cases, plus travelling to the supreme court.. all for nothing ! ![]() |
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#116 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 970
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Quote:
Gina Miller, Nick Clegg, Tony Blair and Remoaners.. your boys took one hell of a beating !
now we finally can move on and get on with Brexit. Remoaners have to lump it or move. This is what unity looks like. Supreme Court doesn't matter. Labour has given the Tories the blank cheque they wanted ! ![]() The government appears to have accepted it will lose the SC appeal, was in the wrong to try to use the Royal Prerogative and has been compelled to seek parliament's authorisation. So if anyone has taken a beating, it is the government. Though by all means, beat Clegg and Blair. |
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#117 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 30,189
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Correct. May has no choice other than remaining in the Customs Union due to her promises. It is also the only option to curb FoM (apart from a dirty EEA solution).
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#118 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 577
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You do understand that a motion in Parliament has no legal standing will not in any way affect the Supreme Court's judgement?
You do understand that the motion was passed on the premise that May will have to outline her plans and must answer the question as to whether the UK will stay in the Customs Union? You do understand that there is a huge majority in Parliament that will not pass any Act taking the UK out of the EU unless remaining in the Customs Union is confirmed? You do understand why that is? And I assume you also understand that the reckless appeal of the government has opened a huge can of worms? In particular the case that the Northern Irish constitution cannot legally be amended unless the people of Ireland have given their mandate. In this case the constitution would irrevocably changed by taking Northern Ireland out of the EU while the people have given no such mandate. So rather than relying on the Sun for your information you'd be much better advised to do your own research if you really want to understand where this is all heading. |
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#119 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 970
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Quote:
chiangmai1 3 hours ago
all those mp,s who support leave will keep the seats.the others who don,t may be out the next time a vote happens.the gina millers of the uk deserve what they get against what the people want https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/234900...iament-result/ Couldn't have put it better myself ! the rats have been exposed ! May's trap was executed perfectly, brilliantly set up. She played a blinder here.Smug and arrogant Gina Miller, who has no business in the political arena in the first place with the big boys and girls and interfering in the will of the British people.. can now do one ! I don't think she don't care about the British people she doesn't seem patriotric.. she seem to care just about herself/her own agendas and I'm really glad she ain't stopping Brexit ! we would never never of heard the end of it.. the irony is all that money she's wasted on court fees and cases, plus travelling to the supreme court.. all for nothing ! ![]() We should all be grateful to her for that. Brexiteers should be grateful as an incorrectly executed Brexit could have been nixed further down the line. By making the government follow the correct procedure, Miller has ensured that can not be used as an excuse. So Brexiteers should be grateful to her. |
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#120 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 30,189
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Gina Miller, Nick Clegg, Tony Blair and Remoaners.. your boys took one hell of a beating !
Yesterday we had the leader of the House say the government will produce their strategy plan, for a Tory Eximoron a few minutes later to point a finger at the opposition claiming only a fool would publish their strategy.....oops. |
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#121 |
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Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 3,660
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But....a Home Office Minister yesterday was unable to explain how the government could negotiate its own Free Trade Deals if in the Custom Union, Andrew Neil told the Minister he hadn't a clue how and that's why he could not explain and added the government will need a Magician....I could see Boris impersonating Tommy Cooper.
To put it into perspective - every single shipment from the UK into Europe would have to be stored at the port of entry until a customs officer gets around to opening it, examining it and then allowing it to pass. Even if the UK were to waive any customs checks on the way into the UK, the EU would not and could not do the same. This would mean that 80% of the UK manufacturing industry would not be able to work. There may even be a case that the UK would be forced to comply with WTO rule and conduct customs checks for goods entering the UK as it would otherwise be liable to fines for treating other countries unfairly. In that case we would have chaos we have never seen before. There is no infrastructure in Dover, Norwich or Folkestone whatsoever to conduct customs checks (i.e. there are no buildings and there is no room to build them). As Thornberry put it yesterday - every single box on a lorry or plane would need to be opened and checked prior to being allowed to pass. Anyone who has been in Dover knows that this is impossible. A very small trade off to say the best deal for Britain is to be restricted in making trade deals. |
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#122 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 3,660
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I get you, however, I believe you may be peeing into gale force winds in trying to explain to some others. Your only hope is Southgate is successfull with England and the some others, go back to football realm.
Heck, the Express claimed that the lawyers speaking yesterday afternoon were Miller's lawyers. |
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#123 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Parliment Sq waving a banner
Posts: 3,289
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Quote:
You do understand that a motion in Parliament has no legal standing will not in any way affect the Supreme Court's judgement?
You do understand that the motion was passed on the premise that May will have to outline her plans and must answer the question as to whether the UK will stay in the Customs Union? You do understand that there is a huge majority in Parliament that will not pass any Act taking the UK out of the EU unless remaining in the Customs Union is confirmed? You do understand why that is? ... What it has done is confirmed that Parliament will not block A50, as for the customs union as you saw yesterday what MPs threaten to or say they are going to do is somewhat different to what they actually do. |
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#124 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,074
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Quote:
Gina Miller, Nick Clegg, Tony Blair and Remoaners.. your boys took one hell of a beating !
now we finally can move on and get on with Brexit. Remoaners have to lump it or move. This is what unity looks like. Supreme Court doesn't matter. Labour has given the Tories the blank cheque they wanted ! ![]() |
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#125 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 10,592
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Oh absolutely. But I feel obligated to battle against the uninformed and utterly useless press in this country.
Heck, the Express claimed that the lawyers speaking yesterday afternoon were Miller's lawyers. |
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May's trap was executed perfectly, brilliantly set up. She played a blinder here.
