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BBC tests 4K Planet Earth II in HDR on iPlayer |
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#1 |
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BBC tests 4K Planet Earth II in HDR on iPlayer
The BBC has begun a trial of 4K high dynamic range (HDR) video on its iPlayer streaming platform.
The test involves four minutes of footage from its Planet Earth II series, which promise to reveal more detail and present more vibrant colours than was possible before. It is part of efforts to develop technologies that will make live broadcasts in the new formats possible. But only a minority of TVs can screen the footage at this stage. "One of the clips is a frog on a leaf with lots of rain, and the reason this is so interesting is that the redness of the frog is a really deep Ferrari red that you would never get in broadcast television at the moment," explained Phil Layton, head of broadcast and connected systems at BBC Research & Development. "We want to show that this is how the BBC could make ultra-high definition HDR material available to iPlayer. "And we want to use this as a trigger to work with manufacturers to get their products updated so there's a pathway there for future on-demand BBC content As the trial went live, only Panasonic's latest screens supported the test's underlying technology - known as hybrid log-gamma (HLG). Although recent models from other manufacturers can also be updated to add the facility, it is unclear whether the firms will do so. Holding back support for HLG would give the companies an opportunity to market future models as being the first to support the format closer to when it launches. More pixels, better pixels From the consumer's point-of-view, there are two key improvements. A 4K picture - also referred to as ultra-high definition (UHD) - means that four times as many pixels are used than in 1080p HD. This makes it possible to reveal details - such as the texture of an animal's fur or the faces of the crowd at a football match - that would have appeared more blurry otherwise. The main caveats are that the TV needs to be suitably large and the viewers close enough to it, otherwise they will not appreciate the difference. HDR takes advantage of the fact displays can go brighter than before to allow an image to be graded with more levels of brightness between black and white. This is not about everything looking brighter, but rather using the greater contrast range to allow shadows to appear less murky and highlights - such as sunlight gleaming off water or stars twinkling at night - to be better defined. In addition, HDR uses a wider colour space - meaning it is capable of showing shades of colours that could not be transmitted in traditional broadcasts, helping footage appear more lifelike. Many people who have experienced both, say that HDR has a greater impact on picture quality than 4K. "It gives more nuance to the picture, which if you are talking about Planet Earth is going to be amazing," said Stuart Miles, founder of the Pocket-lint news site. "The best way to describe it is it's like when you add a subwoofer to a sound system. "Until you've had it you don't realise you need it, but once you've added it you ask how you could have lived without it." Higher costs The BBC will make the footage available via the different smart TV versions of its iPlayer app as soon as the relevant models support it. But it will be some time before it starts offering scheduled broadcasts in 4K and HDR. Mr Layton said the technological challenges could be resolved within the next 18 months. But programmes will cost more to make if they take advantage of the innovations. So, the improved quality will have to be weighed against the fact the majority of viewers will be unlikely to have TVs that support the new technologies for some time to come. In the meantime, Amazon and Netflix both offer some pre-recorded shows and movies in HDR and 4K. And BT and Sky both offer movies and sport in 4K but not HDR. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-38242187 |
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#2 |
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Quote:
The BBC has begun a trial of 4K high dynamic range (HDR) video on its iPlayer streaming platform.
The test involves four minutes of footage from its Planet Earth II series, which promise to reveal more detail and present more vibrant colours than was possible before. It is part of efforts to develop technologies that will make live broadcasts in the new formats possible. But only a minority of TVs can screen the footage at this stage. "One of the clips is a frog on a leaf with lots of rain, and the reason this is so interesting is that the redness of the frog is a really deep Ferrari red that you would never get in broadcast television at the moment," explained Phil Layton, head of broadcast and connected systems at BBC Research & Development. "We want to show that this is how the BBC could make ultra-high definition HDR material available to iPlayer. "And we want to use this as a trigger to work with manufacturers to get their products updated so there's a pathway there for future on-demand BBC content As the trial went live, only Panasonic's latest screens supported the test's underlying technology - known as hybrid log-gamma (HLG). Although recent models from other manufacturers can also be updated to add the facility, it is unclear whether the firms will do so. Holding back support for HLG would give the companies an opportunity to market future models as being the first to support the format closer to when it launches. More pixels, better pixels From the consumer's point-of-view, there are two key improvements. A 4K picture - also referred to as ultra-high definition (UHD) - means that four times as many pixels are used than in 1080p HD. This makes it possible to reveal details - such as the texture of an animal's fur or the faces of the crowd at a football match - that would have appeared more blurry otherwise. The main caveats are that the TV needs to be suitably large and the viewers close enough to it, otherwise they will not appreciate the difference. HDR takes advantage of the fact displays can go brighter than before to allow an image to be graded with more levels of brightness between black and white. This is not about everything looking brighter, but rather using the greater contrast range to allow shadows to appear less murky and highlights - such as sunlight gleaming off water or stars twinkling at night - to be better defined. In addition, HDR uses a wider colour space - meaning it is capable of showing shades of colours that could not be transmitted in traditional broadcasts, helping footage appear more lifelike. Many people who have experienced both, say that HDR has a greater impact on picture quality than 4K. "It gives more nuance to the picture, which if you are talking about Planet Earth is going to be amazing," said Stuart Miles, founder of the Pocket-lint news site. "The best way to describe it is it's like when you add a subwoofer to a sound system. "Until you've had it you don't realise you need it, but once you've added it you ask how you could have lived without it." Higher costs The BBC will make the footage available via the different smart TV versions of its iPlayer app as soon as the relevant models support it. But it will be some time before it starts offering scheduled broadcasts in 4K and HDR. Mr Layton said the technological challenges could be resolved within the next 18 months. But programmes will cost more to make if they take advantage of the innovations. So, the improved quality will have to be weighed against the fact the majority of viewers will be unlikely to have TVs that support the new technologies for some time to come. In the meantime, Amazon and Netflix both offer some pre-recorded shows and movies in HDR and 4K. And BT and Sky both offer movies and sport in 4K but not HDR. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-38242187 That's a LOT of COPY & PASTE !!! No mention of watching on Computers by original author, nor poster !!! My 5K iMac can display 4K video with ease, I have several downloads that illustrate this..... |
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#3 |
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Quote:
No mention of watching on Computers by original author, nor poster !!!
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#4 |
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So does this mean if someone buys a new TV badged with the UHD Alliance's agreed standard 'Ultra HD Premium' it may not be compatible?
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#5 |
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Quote:
The main caveats are that the TV needs to be suitably large and the viewers close enough to it, otherwise they will not appreciate the difference.
Which sounds a bit more than a caveat.
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#6 |
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HDR formats for streaming content seem to be turning into a bit of a mess. We have Ultra HD Premium (which is basically HDR 10) which almost everyone supports, Dolby Vision (which nobody really supports except a few TV's), and now HLG which the BBC have decided to use (which only Panasonic currently support).
Whilst I am not technical enough to know the merits of the quality of these standards, broadcasters need to pick a standard and produce all content to the same standard, so that people dont spend £1000+ on a TV and have it incompatible with a streaming service. |
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#7 |
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Quote:
HDR formats for streaming content seem to be turning into a bit of a mess. We have Ultra HD Premium (which is basically HDR 10) which almost everyone supports, Dolby Vision (which nobody really supports except a few TV's), and now HLG which the BBC have decided to use (which only Panasonic currently support).
Whilst I am not technical enough to know the merits of the quality of these standards, broadcasters need to pick a standard and produce all content to the same standard, so that people dont spend £1000+ on a TV and have it incompatible with a streaming service. I notice that my three UHD content providers; Sky, Netflix and Amazon are members, but the BBC aren't. |
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#8 |
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Is it still a 50Hz based system? If so movement blurr will be just as bad.
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#9 |
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Quote:
Is it still a 50Hz based system? If so movement blurr will be just as bad.
But of course "better HD" doesn't sell as many TV's as "Ultra HD" |
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#10 |
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Quote:
Is it still a 50Hz based system? If so movement blurr will be just as bad.
nothing to do with frame rates, and not influenced by them. I agree, UHD really does benefit from higher frame rates HLG is a BBC and NHK delveloped system PQ was developed by Dolby Labs HLG is what's called 'scene defined' and is designed to work in an environment where the broadcaster doesn't know (or can know!) what displays are being used The traditional broadcasters (inc Sky) seem to be lining up behind HLG PQ is 'display defined' and therefore requires the user to set his receiver to the parameters that his screen exhibits. The film studios, and Netflix/Amazon are moving towards backing PQ |
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#11 |
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I just watched this through my 2015 Panasonic UHD TV. No HDR, but the picture quality is excellent regardless. I'm purposely holding off watching Planet Earth 2 until I can do so in UHD, so hopefully this will become a fully integrated feature on iPlayer sooner rather than later.
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#12 |
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Quote:
That's a LOT of COPY & PASTE !!!
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#13 |
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HLG (and the competing HDR systems) are nothing more than 'gamma style' curves,
nothing to do with frame rates, and not influenced by them. I agree, UHD really does benefit from higher frame rates HLG is a BBC and NHK delveloped system PQ was developed by Dolby Labs HLG is what's called 'scene defined' and is designed to work in an environment where the broadcaster doesn't know (or can know!) what displays are being used The traditional broadcasters (inc Sky) seem to be lining up behind HLG PQ is 'display defined' and therefore requires the user to set his receiver to the parameters that his screen exhibits. The film studios, and Netflix/Amazon are moving towards backing PQ I don't know if the UK will now have enough clout to persuade other European Broadcasters to also adopt HLG |
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#14 |
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I guess a lot will depend on EBU adoption. If that happens then manufacturers will be persuaded to consider it. If NHK standardise it then that will do more to persuade theJapanese manufacturers.
Also depends on licencing costs - if HLG is cheaper than say, Dolby Vision, then it has a greater chance of winning out. Of course we have seen so many format wars before - this is just the next one. |
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#15 |
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Just viewed it.
its very good. But there's some cracking 4k you tube footage out there that's utterly amazing. I love the stuff this guy posts. Normally watch it if I'm having trouble sleeping at night its so relaxing https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXvv8xZ7mGU |
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#16 |
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I guess a lot will depend on EBU adoption. If that happens then manufacturers will be persuaded to consider it. If NHK standardise it then that will do more to persuade theJapanese manufacturers.
Also depends on licencing costs - if HLG is cheaper than say, Dolby Vision, then it has a greater chance of winning out. Of course we have seen so many format wars before - this is just the next one. |
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#17 |
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Quote:
I'm purposely holding off watching Planet Earth 2 until I can do so in UHD,
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#18 |
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Just watched it a few time on the Panasonic 65DX902 I have in the shop and the picture quality was fantastic, much better than 4K streams I've tested here from Netflix/Amazon. The content probably helped a little too.
Came through running on the 4K HLG demo no probs at all on the Fibre broadband we have (36ish mbps). Certainly looks like a good route for the BBC to get 4K out to the public on without the issues of transmission space on Freeview. |
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#19 |
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Any idea when this is gonna be available for LG owners?
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#20 |
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This makes it possible to reveal details - such as the texture of an animal's fur or the faces of the crowd at a football match - that would have appeared more blurry otherwise.
Was this not said about HD? Sounds like a con to me, a way to get mugs spending more money!
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#21 |
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Was this not said about HD? Sounds like a con to me, a way to get mugs spending more money!
![]() http://www.digitaltveurope.net/wp-co...ixo-HDR-WP.pdf |
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#22 |
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Which sounds a bit more than a caveat.
http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/by-...e-relationship For a 50" tv anything beyond 2m the difference between 4K and 1080 will become steadily less noticeable |
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#23 |
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Meanwhile the picture quality of the Channel 4 on demand service remains abysmal
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#24 |
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Successful trials like this over broadband mean the chance of 4K UHD appearing on RF mediums is going to reduce. Fibre broadband is the future for 4K UHD distribution.
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#25 |
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I am not watching it until it is released in 16K, I want it to look life like.
I just watched that YouTube clip in HD, not 4k and it looked fine to me! Higher resolution a complete waste of time. |
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