Leaked memo confirms David Davis will go into talks with 'have our cake and eat it'

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Eurostar

10-12-2016

Originally Posted by Rooks:
“Did I mention Single Market membership? I don't expect the UK to be in the Single Market after Brexit, nor would I want it for the exact reasons you mention (and other reasons). I'd expect a trading agreement with the EU and nothing more, probably in the form of a Free Trade agreement as that benefits us and them.”

The point there would be that many would regard a free trade agreement as being vastly inferior to full membership of the Single Market.

Marispiper

10-12-2016

It doesn't matter what deal Davis puts forward - with or without Parliament's approval - if you think we would get the nod from all member states...jog on!
Hard Brexit (no single market) is what we should go with...and with any luck...what we may end up with.

Jellied Eel

10-12-2016

Originally Posted by Eurostar:
“It actually stems from the propaganda spouted by the Mail and Express etc claiming that Merkel is a dictator who is in charge of the EU. People are so used to reading this garbage that they think it's actually correct and that the deal that the UK gets from the EU after Brexit will be decided by Merkel alone.”

Actually.. If you bothered to find out more about how the EU works, you'd realise Merkel is boss of Germany. And boss of Germany's CDU. Which is a member of the European People's Party.. Which is the largest political grouping in both the European Parliament and on the Council. And headed by dear'ol Junker.

Which is why politically, they'll struggle to offer a decent deal because they're committed socialists, ie most happy when they're spending other people's money.

As for Davis, being a former artist, he's probably used to tough negotiations..

Jellied Eel

10-12-2016

Originally Posted by Eurostar:
“The UK has the exact same deal that the other member states have ie. full access to the 28 nation Single Market without any restrictions whatsoever. If Britain has a 'bad deal', then everyone has a bad deal.”

There are restrictions, ie in order to get that access, we have to committ to following EU Directives.

Now, I wonder what might happen if the UK opened up the Commonwealth as an economic trading bloc, but with out all the regualtions..

Eurostar

10-12-2016

Originally Posted by Jellied Eel:
“Actually.. If you bothered to find out more about how the EU works, you'd realise Merkel is boss of Germany. And boss of Germany's CDU. Which is a member of the European People's Party.. Which is the largest political grouping in both the European Parliament and on the Council. And headed by dear'ol Junker.

Which is why politically, they'll struggle to offer a decent deal because they're committed socialists, ie most happy when they're spending other people's money.

As for Davis, being a former artist, he's probably used to tough negotiations..”

Juncker is not a German, he's a French speaking former Luxembourg PM. Indeed, it's rumoured the Germans may have been opposed to his appointment as President of the European Commission.

Rooks

10-12-2016

Originally Posted by Eurostar:
“The point there would be that many would regard a free trade agreement as being vastly inferior to full membership of the Single Market.”

I disagree. What you've said is perfectly correct assuming the UK is still a member of the EU. Outside of the EU, being a member of the Single Market is actually inferior to a free trade agreement because the rules that we'd have to abide by would make it significantly worse to trade with the rest of the world - something we really need to do if we are outside the EU.

Jellied Eel

10-12-2016

Originally Posted by Eurostar:
“Juncker is not a German, he's a French speaking former Luxembourg PM.”

Yes, I know. So the EPP.. how many MPs do they have in the UK?

Doctor_Wibble

10-12-2016

Originally Posted by Jellied Eel:
“Yes, I know. So the EPP.. how many MPs do they have in the UK?”

Good question, I understand one of more of their members went to form the Popular EPP or am I thinking of some other political group...?

Jayceef1

10-12-2016

Originally Posted by Eurostar:
“Juncker is not a German, he's a French speaking former Luxembourg PM. Indeed, it's rumoured the Germans may have been opposed to his appointment as President of the European Commission.”

We know that. It was never said he was German. Merkels's CDU is a member of the cross EU EPP of which Juncker is the head.

Eurostar

10-12-2016

Originally Posted by Jayceef1:
“We know that. It was never said he was German. Merkels's CDU is a member of the cross EU EPP of which Juncker is the head.”

I'm not sure there's any evidence the EPP will have any influence over the type of deal the UK gets. They have less than a third of the seats in the Parliament and there's going to have to be some sort of a consensus across the board.

Penny Crayon

10-12-2016

It would be very nice to think that the UK could somehow come out of this with a good deal but TBH - once we trigger article 50 - the rest of the EU countries don't have to agree with anything at all do they? They may just say - we accept your decision - see ya.

There's nothing spiteful or vindictive about it IMO - article 50 is simply a notice of resignation isn't it?

allaorta

10-12-2016

Originally Posted by Penny Crayon:
“It would be very nice to think that the UK could somehow come out of this with a good deal but TBH - once we trigger article 50 - the rest of the EU countries don't have to agree with anything at all do they? They may just say - we accept your decision - see ya.

There's nothing spiteful or vindictive about it IMO - article 50 is simply a notice of resignation isn't it?”

Effectively yes and though I've heard all the arguments for not triggering it quicker, I wish it had been so that business knows where it is and what it has to do, sterling knows where it is and not forgetting people who live in another EU country.

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