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Do Fellow Leave Voters Now Hope Brexit Doesn't Happen At All? |
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#1 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 12,914
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Do Fellow Leave Voters Now Hope Brexit Doesn't Happen At All?
I voted Leave, still strongly believe it was the right decision but I can see exactly where we are heading with the Referendum result.. we are going to exit the EU to please Leave voters but we will remain in the EU in all but name. Still have FOM, access to the single market.. but with no say on EU laws and in a worse position.
And I don't want to give the Remain voters the satisfaction of blaming Brexit and Leave voters for everything bad which happens.. when we probably won't get the Brexit the majority actually voted for (so both sides will end blaming each other which will end ugly) - the BIG elephant in the room which is what nearly everyone who voted Brexit wanted was an end to FOM which doesn't look likely with us still wanting single market access.. I'd much rather us wait until 2020 General Elections, elect a party/leader which is strong and will do Brexit properly (if we decide to go down that road) Anything else will hurt this country more than good, which I don't want. I'm not against staying in the EU if the only other option is a watered down version of what we have now with an even worse deal ! Anyone else agree? |
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#2 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Mid Wales / Canolbarth Cymru
Posts: 37,555
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This was always going to be the reality, and leavers were told this unremittingly.
Leaving our free access to the SM was always going to be economically ruinous so no minister, inc Davis, will countenance it. So that leaves us in a fudge. It is an unmitigated, unresolved mess. |
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#3 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Mount Olympus
Posts: 18,239
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No, I haven't changed my mind.
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#4 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 12,914
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Quote:
This was always going to be the reality, and leavers were told this unremittingly.
Leaving our free access to the SM was always going to be economically ruinous so no minister, inc Davis, will countenance it. So that leaves us in a fudge. It is an unmitigated, unresolved mess. |
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#5 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 12,914
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Quote:
No, I haven't changed my mind.
I'd rather wait until AFTER the next G.E |
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#6 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Dublin
Posts: 51,658
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Quote:
I haven't either but I want a Brexit that our spineless Tory government doesn't seem to have the stomach/fight to give us.
I'd rather wait until AFTER the next G.E |
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#7 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2002
Location: GL51 0EX
Posts: 14,098
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Quote:
I haven't either but I want a Brexit that our spineless Tory government doesn't seem to have the stomach/fight to give us.
I'd rather wait until AFTER the next G.E With your "BIG elephant" you can't say for sure as FOM wasn't mentioned in the question, and the only polling data I've seen put it in second position as a reason. If it was the only thing asked, the majority may have chosen the other way. Who knows if it was multiple choice Brexit+retaining FOM could have won the day (I'd have backed that one) The one thing you can say is true is people voted for the Brexit that a Tory government would deliver. Not a Brexit promised by UKIP, Labour or whoever. It was the Tories who asked, it was the Tories who promised to deliver it, it will be the Tories who shape what is delivered. This people knew when they were voting for it. I think there's no chance May will call a GE before it's done and dusted - that's why she's pushing to trigger A50 and get it out the way in 2019. There will then be a honeymoon period for her when every economic disaster can be blamed on birthing pains - every success attributed to Tory wisdom. Then you call the GE |
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#8 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,229
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Quote:
I voted Leave, still strongly believe it was the right decision but I can see exactly where we are heading with the Referendum result.. we are going to exit the EU to please Leave voters but we will remain in the EU in all but name. Still have FOM, access to the single market.. but with no say on EU laws and in a worse position.
And I don't want to give the Remain voters the satisfaction of blaming Brexit and Leave voters for everything bad which happens.. when we probably won't get the Brexit the majority actually voted for (so both sides will end blaming each other which will end ugly) - the BIG elephant in the room which is what nearly everyone who voted Brexit wanted was an end to FOM which doesn't look likely with us still wanting single market access.. I'd much rather us wait until 2020 General Elections, elect a party/leader which is strong and will do Brexit properly (if we decide to go down that road) Anything else will hurt this country more than good, which I don't want. I'm not against staying in the EU if the only other option is a watered down version of what we have now with an even worse deal ! Anyone else agree? |
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#9 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,659
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Quote:
I'm not against staying in the EU
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#10 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 1,010
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Quote:
Anyone else agree?
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#11 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 20,498
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Sorry, Brexiteers.
You should have thought of that. |
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#12 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: I survived the killzone!
Posts: 18,265
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I voted remain and still believe the vote to leave is an utter disaster and for a lot of those who voted for it it's a clear case of turkeys voting for Christmas.
However I support democracy and the people voted leave so leave we must. |
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#13 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,068
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Quote:
I voted remain and still believe the vote to leave is an utter disaster and for a lot of those who voted for it it's a clear case of turkeys voting for Christmas.
However I support democracy and the people voted leave so leave we must. |
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#14 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,200
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I would say leave now, as we have the momentum and take whatever we can get now but, in the GE, vote in a government who will change what needs to be changed and keep what is working. Nothing is ever set in stone so any negotiations made now can be improved upon once we have a government in that is willing to do the job properly.
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#15 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Devon
Posts: 48,023
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No. I don't see how leaving the EU but remaining in the single market addresses the main reasons people voted to leave which were ending FoM, ending EU law superceding UK law and ending paying billions to the EU to be a member.
The advantages of not being in the EU but be in the single market (but not a customs union), aka Norway, are the UK could do its own trade deals, pay a reduced contribution to be in the single market and fewer EU laws would apply. FoM however remains in place. |
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#16 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,428
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Nope not changed my mind am even more convinced leaving is the right thing to do
![]() The more people try to stop it the more I determined I become to see it through |
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#17 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: 🖥⌨🖱
Posts: 29,252
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Our membership of the EU was characterised by opt-outs to please Eursoceptic elements so I don't think a non-membership of the EU featuring opt-ins to mollify Europhile elements should come as any surprise.
My own conviction is that it would be better to be properly in or properly out but our political system cannot deliver that. What is imperative is that people hold politicians, or rather the government, to account for their dissatisfaction rather than blaming the voters on the other side. |
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#18 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Mid Wales / Canolbarth Cymru
Posts: 37,555
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I voted remain and still believe the vote to leave is an utter disaster and for a lot of those who voted for it it's a clear case of turkeys voting for Christmas.
. They would all compliantly trot out the Brexit mantra of "We will be only getting our own money back" of course, but what money? The valleys don't produce anything, and are massive net beneficiaries of the EU. And why did they need EU money at all? Because successive UK governments neglected and under-funded any kind of regeneration there. So they've bitten the hand that feeds them in favour of going under the yoke of the hand that starved them... again Utter folly. |
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#19 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 1,208
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The remainers could not must up sufficient arguments for the EU being a positive place to stay before the referendum and they still can't. It's still project fear.
Let's get on with leaving asap. |
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#20 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,022
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If they still dont produce anything, where is the massive EU funding going and to do what?
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#21 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 40,361
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We voted to leave the EU not remain in it in all but name with no voting rights or ability to influence its policies.
As has been said there are only two options - hard Brexit or no Brexit. Soft Brexit isn't Brexit at all and is arguably worse than being in the EU where at least you get MEPs and have voting rights. |
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#22 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Mid Wales / Canolbarth Cymru
Posts: 37,555
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Quote:
We voted to leave the EU not remain in it in all but name with no voting rights or ability to influence its policies.
As has been said there are only two options - hard Brexit or no Brexit. Soft Brexit isn't Brexit at all and is arguably worse than being in the EU where at least you get MEPs and have voting rights. |
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#23 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: London SW6
Posts: 37,581
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Quote:
I haven't either but I want a Brexit that our spineless Tory government doesn't seem to have the stomach/fight to give us.
I'd rather wait until AFTER the next G.E |
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#24 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 20,498
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Quote:
But you also want a Brexit that wasn't on the ballot and will be economically damaging to our country.
There was nothing else. The majority voted out, so out we go. |
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#25 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: London SW6
Posts: 37,581
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Quote:
The only choices were "in" or "out."
There was nothing else. The majority voted out, so out we go. |
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