|
||||||||
New anti-Semitism definition |
![]() |
|
|
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
|
|
#26 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 30,189
|
Quote:
According to a snatch of news I caught, anti-semitism would be defined as taking a critical view based purely on them being Jewish. I'd have thought that would come under existing laws.
https://antisemitism.uk/law/offences/ |
|
|
|
|
Please sign in or register to remove this advertisement.
|
|
|
#27 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: It's Grim
Posts: 24,401
|
As we have constantly seen in this country, the protection of the state is the last thing any social group would wish to have.
While such protection does not create anti-semitism it will surely allow it to thrive. |
|
|
|
|
|
#28 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 12,746
|
Quote:
So if they were a - for example - a banker, you could legitimately hate them for being a Jewish banker as it won't be purely based on them being Jewish
![]() Sounds a daft definition if so. |
|
|
|
|
|
#29 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 650
|
Quote:
I think the law is assuming all Jews get along with each other.
That simply isn't true. My late[ Jewish] employer use to say I have a few friends many acquaintances and lots of enemies . Also what about the thousands of Israeli jews that demonstrate against their own government and the atrocities carried out in the occupied territories. are they anti semitic. I am not and never have been against Jews some I cherise has friends but I believe we should have the right to criticize anyone or anything we don't agree with. . http://www.nkusa.org/ |
|
|
|
|
|
#30 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 12,746
|
Quote:
Under this proposed law Neturei Karta would be guilty of anti Semitism (anti Zionist and anti Israel).
http://www.nkusa.org/ |
|
|
|
|
|
#31 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 9,312
|
The PM has a strong record of helping the Jewish community and her speech is the next logical step in her crusade.
Em, Jews were one of the victims of the Crusades |
|
|
|
|
|
#32 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 650
|
Quote:
Is that not a conclusion that is in the hands of the judge that is ruling? As far as I can see being anti Zionist and anti Israel does not mean anti semitic , much depends on context and on what is said and how.
So this proposed law pretty much silences individuals who have a very different idea of Zionism; that of being a secular political ideology that has little to do with Judaism and not having a right to exist any more or less than any other nation. (the Neturei Karta stance in short) |
|
|
|
|
|
#33 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,744
|
Quote:
No. The anti Semitism definition is using the understanding that Zionism is the belief that Israel has a right to exist as a Jewish homeland.
So this proposed law pretty much silences individuals who have a very different idea of Zionism; that of being a secular political ideology that has little to do with Judaism and not having a right to exist any more or less than any other nation. (the Neturei Karta stance in short) |
|
|
|
|
|
#34 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 12,746
|
Quote:
No. The anti Semitism definition is using the understanding that Zionism is the belief that Israel has a right to exist as a Jewish homeland.
So this proposed law pretty much silences individuals who have a very different idea of Zionism; that of being a secular political ideology that has little to do with Judaism and not having a right to exist any more or less than any other nation. (the Neturei Karta stance in short) I agree that it is to Israel's advantage, and Zionism's, to conflate the two issues just as many in Islam are trying to do. |
|
|
|
|
|
#35 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,427
|
Quote:
However from the links that is not what it says. It is a qualified view. Hating Israel becasue it is a Jewish state is the problem hating Israel because you dislike the political principles behind its creation is a bit different. Hating Zionism because it works for Jews is different from hating Zionism because of its divisiveness on religious lines.
I agree that it is to Israel's advantage, and Zionism's, to conflate the two issues just as many in Islam are trying to do. |
|
|
|
|
|
#36 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,141
|
Quote:
It's very sad that such a draconian law is necessary to counter such awful hate crime.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#37 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: In a jar, on a shelf
Posts: 31,672
|
Quote:
Well, that's probably because those peoples "different" ideas are a pile of steaming anti Semitic bollocks, dressed up as a fake political ideology.
That's not anti-semitic, just an outcome of Israeli law, plus a large influx of dodgy money that's kept the Israeli police and courts busy since the '90s, ie Russian/East European criminals. |
|
|
|
|
|
#38 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 912
|
Quote:
Not always. So the example earlier of a 'Jewish Banker'. There's probably no need to prefix with 'Jewish' unless there's some specific reason that the banker has to be Jewish. But it should be legitimate to criticise Israeli banking secrecy given that's widely abused by dubious customers, as can Israel's non-extradition policies.
That's not anti-semitic, just an outcome of Israeli law, plus a large influx of dodgy money that's kept the Israeli police and courts busy since the '90s, ie Russian/East European criminals. Secondly use your search engine and look up the Semitic lands and its people [you may get a surprise. |
|
|
|
|
|
#39 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 30,189
|
Quote:
As we have constantly seen in this country, the protection of the state is the last thing any social group would wish to have.
While such protection does not create anti-semitism it will surely allow it to thrive. Quote:
Under this proposed law Neturei Karta would be guilty of anti Semitism (anti Zionist and anti Israel).
http://www.nkusa.org/ |
|
|
|
|
|
#40 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,744
|
Quote:
Not always. So the example earlier of a 'Jewish Banker'. There's probably no need to prefix with 'Jewish' unless there's some specific reason that the banker has to be Jewish. But it should be legitimate to criticise Israeli banking secrecy given that's widely abused by dubious customers, as can Israel's non-extradition policies.
That's not anti-semitic, just an outcome of Israeli law, plus a large influx of dodgy money that's kept the Israeli police and courts busy since the '90s, ie Russian/East European criminals. What usually happens is that someone will make an observation about Jewish bankers, or Rothschild bankers, or Zionist bankers, or numerous variations thereof. Or they might use the language of the holocaust, in an attempt to draw, shall we say "dubious" comparisons between the murder of 6 million Jews and the current status of the Palestinians. This is anti Semitic. When challenged, they will duck and dive and wind up referring to the type of minutiae to which you refer. Incidentally, London is pretty much the biggest recipient of "dodgy" Russian money and I should know, having been involved in a good few pieces of litigation on point. I think its rather sad that as a country, we're restricting access to justice to the masses, but inviting Oligarchs to spend their (not so) hard earned billions wrangling over who owns what oilfield, or whatever; I guess that's another thread... |
|
|
|
|
|
#41 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: In a jar, on a shelf
Posts: 31,672
|
Quote:
Secondly use your search engine and look up the Semitic lands and its people [you may get a surprise.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#42 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,744
|
Quote:
Of course it will.
As will any minority. There are Muslim sects kicking the merry you know what out of each other across the globe. For example, the BBC are leading today on government forces in Aleppo shooting 82 (presumably non governmental) people on sight. Yet you want to focus on a few of my weird beard bretherin, who think prayer is an alternative to work, or the real world? They're harmless but hardly proof positive of whatever theory/snake oil you're selling... |
|
|
|
|
|
#43 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: In a jar, on a shelf
Posts: 31,672
|
Quote:
I think its rather sad that as a country, we're restricting access to justice to the masses, but inviting Oligarchs to spend their (not so) hard earned billions wrangling over who owns what oilfield, or whatever; I guess that's another thread...
|
|
|
|
|
|
#44 |
|
Inactive Member
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 18,881
|
Quote:
Fair enough; but I've never actually seen anyone make that distinction.
What usually happens is that someone will make an observation about Jewish bankers, or Rothschild bankers, or Zionist bankers, or numerous variations thereof. Or they might use the language of the holocaust, in an attempt to draw, shall we say "dubious" comparisons between the murder of 6 million Jews and the current status of the Palestinians. This is anti Semitic. When challenged, they will duck and dive and wind up referring to the type of minutiae to which you refer. Incidentally, London is pretty much the biggest recipient of "dodgy" Russian money and I should know, having been involved in a good few pieces of litigation on point. I think its rather sad that as a country, we're restricting access to justice to the masses, but inviting Oligarchs to spend their (not so) hard earned billions wrangling over who owns what oilfield, or whatever; I guess that's another thread... |
|
|
|
|
|
#45 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,744
|
Quote:
I wish I could remember the name of the Israeli police commander who wrote a book about the.. 'challenges' caused by the '90s influx of seriously organised criminals, along with how that affected the political dynamic. Money has a nasty habit of greasing palms and buying influence though.
I do find it disturbing that people blithely refer to this and similar issues as though its a uniquely Israeli problem, or has real or frankly any bearing to this field of debate. The implication is often, "look, yet more evidence of those global and well known manipulators of money markets weaving their evil web". |
|
|
|
|
|
#46 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,744
|
Quote:
Are you saying that uttering the name of a bank would or might be discriminatory?
I find it hard to conceive how references to "Rothschild Bankers" in the context of a debate about anti semitism could be taken by any sane person to be something other than evidence of, well, anti semitism. Forgive me, but your posts read like those of a classic CT artist. |
|
|
|
|
|
#47 |
|
Inactive Member
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 18,881
|
Quote:
And here's the nub.
I find it hard to conceive how references to "Rothschild Bankers" in the context of a debate about anti semitism could be taken by any sane person to be something other than evidence of, well, anti semitism. Forgive me, but your posts read like those of a classic CT artist. BIB....I think you're talking about yourself. |
|
|
|
|
|
#48 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 30,189
|
Quote:
This argument is truly bizarre.
There are Muslim sects kicking the merry you know what out of each other across the globe. For example, the BBC are leading today on government forces in Aleppo shooting 82 (presumably non governmental) people on sight. Yet you want to focus on a few of my weird beard bretherin, who think prayer is an alternative to work, or the real world? They're harmless but hardly proof positive of whatever theory/snake oil you're selling... Does the same apply to other minorities who this draconian intervention will conveniently silence? |
|
|
|
|
|
#49 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 9,312
|
Quote:
Yet you want to focus on a few of my weird beard bretherin, who think prayer is an alternative to work, or the real world? They're harmless but hardly proof positive of whatever theory/snake oil you're selling...
|
|
|
|
|
|
#50 |
|
Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,744
|
Quote:
I wasn't talking in the context of an anti-semitism debate.
BIB....I think you're talking about yourself. As for the BIB, I suggest you take a breath, mix with some ordinary folk and take a straw poll, followed by a long hard look in the mirror... |
|
|
|
![]() |
|
All times are GMT. The time now is 20:10.




