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Old 16-12-2016, 16:54
Nodger
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FuQwedAWHI

(not directly related to the thread, but related nonetheless).
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Old 16-12-2016, 17:10
heiker
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Swayed the leave vote according to Labour MP Ben Bradshaw.

http://news.sky.com/story/russian-ha...aw-mp-10694779

This barrel that's being scraped is very deep.
But the vote was carried out and counted using dead wood.......how did the Russians influence that
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Old 16-12-2016, 17:16
Doctor_Wibble
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But the vote was carried out and counted using dead wood.......how did the Russians influence that
Psychics. Lots and lots of psychics.
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Old 16-12-2016, 17:21
Nodger
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Wisconsin (I think) recount found more votes for Trump.
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Old 16-12-2016, 17:23
Doctor_Wibble
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Wisconsin (I think) recount found more votes for Trump.
That can't be right, Wisconsin is famous for a certain big rolling cheese incident and being name-checked in movies for no apparent reason, not losing votes down the back of the sofa.
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Old 16-12-2016, 17:26
Nodger
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That can't be right, Wisconsin is famous for a certain big rolling cheese incident and being name-checked in movies for no apparent reason, not losing votes down the back of the sofa.
Tucked behind a big blue curtain shielding a treadmill apparently. It took what looks like an armed FBI agent to find them:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...request-denied
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Old 16-12-2016, 17:35
Doctor_Wibble
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Tucked behind a big blue curtain shielding a treadmill apparently.

Did they have a low voter turnout? I'd be scared to have to use one of those crazy-looking contraptions, do they have someone to reset them to 'sedately ambling' if someone gets a bit enthusiastic? I mean I've heard of 'running for president' but had no idea it was quite so literal

And on the blatant blueness of the curtains, are they allowed such partisan colour schemes in the voting area or did they sneakily make them red on the other side?
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Old 16-12-2016, 18:33
Shalamara
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This explains so much. When I entered the voting booth a voice boomed through my hearing aid repeatedly saying Вы будете делать, как я говорю и проголосовать отпуск. I voted Leave and thought no more about it. It transpires it was the Russians hacking my hearing aid and forcing me to vote Leave. Oh but wait, I was going to vote Leave anyway

Seriously, this is stupid and Bradshaw is bonkers.
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Old 16-12-2016, 22:22
blueblade
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Swayed the leave vote according to Labour MP Ben Bradshaw.

http://news.sky.com/story/russian-ha...aw-mp-10694779

This barrel that's being scraped is very deep.
I thought it was usually the Sun wot won it

The Russians didn't cast the bloody votes, nor did they count them. It's pathetic and whiny weak to blame them for the outcome of democracy.

Same in the USA.

Deeply condescending to the electorate as well.
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Old 16-12-2016, 22:33
i4u
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I thought it was usually the Sun wot won it

The Russians didn't cast the bloody votes, nor did they count them. It's pathetic and whiny weak to blame them for the outcome of democracy.

Same in the USA.

Deeply condescending to the electorate as well.
It's about influence, rather than casting votes...the UK instigated EU sanctions targeting Putin & his friends. Get rid of the EU and sanctions are nigh impossible to implement or be affective.

There used to be something called the domino effect, we saw it re-emerge during the Arab Spring...Putin & Trump very likely want a weaker Europe.

Can you imagine Putin being concerned that one country the UK imposes sanctions against it?
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Old 17-12-2016, 01:32
Eurostar
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According to the front page of The Times tomorrow, the claims of large scale Russian cyberwarfare against Britain are accurate :

http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/russi...ttacks-9472410
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Old 17-12-2016, 01:39
MARTYM8
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According to the front page of The Times tomorrow, the claims of large scale Russian cyberwarfare against Britain are accurate :

http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/russi...ttacks-9472410
Do you think the US and UK security services just sit around drinking coffee. The Americans as we know hacked into Angela Merkel's calls.

You don't think it works both ways - cos it's really naive if you don't. I expect the Chinese do a lot too.

All this reds under the bed McCarthyesque hysteria is starting to get silly. I for one don't want to start a conflict with the worlds second biggest nuclear power.

You should head to the cinema and watch the new Snowden movie - might be an eye opener.
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Old 17-12-2016, 01:53
Eurostar
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Do you think the US and UK security services just sit around drinking coffee. The Americans as we know hacked into Angela Merkel's calls.

You don't think it works both ways - cos it's really naive if you don't. I expect the Chinese do a lot too.

All this reds under the bed McCarthyesque hysteria is starting to get silly. I for one don't want to start a conflict with the worlds second biggest nuclear power.

You should head to the cinema and watch the new Snowden movie - might be an eye opener.
Well many people here seemed to dismiss Bradshaw as a lunatic coming up with crazy conspiracy theories. I said in one of the other threads that there is a lot of anti-Russian propaganda and scaremongering going on in the west but the hacking allegations are plausible.
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Old 17-12-2016, 02:50
MARTYM8
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Well many people here seemed to dismiss Bradshaw as a lunatic coming up with crazy conspiracy theories. I said in one of the other threads that there is a lot of anti-Russian propaganda and scaremongering going on in the west but the hacking allegations are plausible.
I am aware we did have almost every international financial and political institution as well as almost every European political leader and the US President telling us to vote remain or dire consequences would follow.

Seems the remain side were very happy to have foreign interference in our referendum and lots of it as long as they were trying to deliver a remain vote I must have missed Putin telling us to vote leave.

The absolute rank hypocrisy and double standards is breathtaking!

It wasn't Putin that delivered a leave vote but British democracy.- something some remainers still haven't grasped six months on.
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Old 17-12-2016, 04:02
alfamale
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Well many people here seemed to dismiss Bradshaw as a lunatic coming up with crazy conspiracy theories. I said in one of the other threads that there is a lot of anti-Russian propaganda and scaremongering going on in the west but the hacking allegations are plausible.
As in Brexit hacking allegations? Genuine question, what advantage was Brexit meant to have gained from any alleged hacking? It wasn't like the US elections where Hillarys lies and duplicity became obvious.

I am always quite skeptical of foreign states being blamed of things when the timing is just so perfect for the govts/countries making the accusations. For example the US establishment seem to really be clutching at straws by chucking everything they can at claiming a lack of legitimacy of the US election because of big bad Russia before the Electoral college vote of 19th Dec.

And both the US and UK are also quite obsessed with russia due to the outcome in syria, where the sovereign state with Russias assistance seem to have wiped out all the islam extremist terrorist groups in Aleppo, oops sorry i mean wiped out the "moderate rebels" or the good guys. Never have i seen the western media show so much sympathy for muslim men with Al Qaeda leaning viewpoints and their niqab wearing wives in eastern Aleppo. Did i miss the news the day the western media showed similar sympathy to the 1,400+ palestinian civilians killed by israel in 2014 or the 400,000+ civilian iraqis that died after we invaded? Journalism nowadays on all sides seems to have become Copy/Paste your own govts propaganda.
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Old 17-12-2016, 04:28
thenetworkbabe
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Swayed the leave vote according to Labour MP Ben Bradshaw.

http://news.sky.com/story/russian-ha...aw-mp-10694779

This barrel that's being scraped is very deep.
Don't see his argumnt . How did hacking help? I doubt if Putin thought up the string of lies Leave deployed either - they were well up to that, and no hacks produced arguments for the campaign.

There's plenty for the Security Service, and its European sisters, to look into otherwise though - Russian propagandabots swamping western forums, Russian cyber attacks, and finance from Russian intelligence to far right organisations - including those anti the EU and immigration. There's also Russian leverage over businessmen and the politicians they control , cultivation of politicians on the authoritarian isolationist right. , and Russia's role in producing waves of refugees from Syria - not necessarily only as a biproduct of its efforts to keep its dictator in charge. Thats all on top of the normal high level of intelligence activity, and work with domestic far left subversives..
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Old 17-12-2016, 04:38
thenetworkbabe
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According to the front page of The Times tomorrow, the claims of large scale Russian cyberwarfare against Britain are accurate :

http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/russi...ttacks-9472410
Obviously . All the hostile powers with major hacking organisations hack the west - what else would they do all day. And Putin as a KGB disinformation specialist and foreign policy analyst is hardly going to think there's anything wrong with doing what he did in his working career. The Russians would also seek to bring western nations to a complete halt with hacking if they felt the need. They have already tried this out trying to bully the Baltic states, and North Korea has shown the range of targets that can be attacked. its natural that they would practice and prepare for taking down vital systems in a crisis

The question is how that impacted on the referendum, and its difficult to think of one case where any hacked information helped. Leave was perfectly capable of inventing its own lies, and none was based on any facts - hacked or not.
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Old 17-12-2016, 05:21
Inkblot
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I am aware we did have almost every international financial and political institution as well as almost every European political leader and the US President telling us to vote remain or dire consequences would follow.

Seems the remain side were very happy to have foreign interference in our referendum and lots of it as long as they were trying to deliver a remain vote I must have missed Putin telling us to vote leave.
Can you give an example of a British politician saying they were happy to have foreign governments hacking our systems?
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Old 17-12-2016, 07:06
zounds
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I don't understand why Governments find it so hard to manage their own intrenets and monitor what goes in and out. They seem to treat cracking as an every day problem that they have no control over, whereas, if it's true they should be embarrassed about it. Most of their network doesn't need to be public facing and the servers that are could be easily monitored. All files could be encrypted and monitored keys given out etc...
I personally don't believe all this 'Putin hacked us' business.
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Old 17-12-2016, 10:01
Doctor_Wibble
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I am aware we did have almost every international financial and political institution as well as almost every European political leader and the US President telling us to vote remain or dire consequences would follow.
Ooh no, you are not understanding what is being said here, the uneducated and totally gullible Leave voters just completely believed every anti-EU thing anyone told them, from the flavour of their carpets and having to use green lightbulbs on Wednesday afternoons, all the way up to issuing official permits for alien abductions and probing.

And therefore it is completely logical that a few odd snippets of 'WTF EU' posted on teh interwebs was wot done it and defeated the combined superior intellectual might of the righteous and thwarted their so terribly genuine attempts to refrain from insulting half the electorate time and time again.
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Old 17-12-2016, 10:11
MARTYM8
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Can you give an example of a British politician saying they were happy to have foreign governments hacking our systems?
Can you give an example of a British politician saying they were happy to have the UK government via our security services hack other countries systems?

Cos we and the Americans have being doing it for years - and given we know the Americans have been accessing Merkels phone calls and more I expect they have probably been doing the same to us.

You are very naive if you don't think every major nation isn't up to this. All this reds under the beds hysteria is just getting comical now - it's just the latest excuse for certain people not to accept the results of the democratic process we had in June.
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Old 17-12-2016, 11:27
IvanIV
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Manipulate Brexit referendum, check. Manipulate US presidential elections, check. Manipulate Germans into not voting for Angela Merkel in next year's elections, remains to be seen. But let me tell you, if there was a mission impossible, this will be it It does not exactly inspire confidence in our institutions that are supposed to be there for our protection, does it? You can think about Putin what you like, but one has to admire the efficiency with which he achieved all this. Compared to him, our people look like a bunch of incompetent losers. I'd say don't **** with Putin, but rather bow before him, because his leniency is our only hope
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Old 17-12-2016, 11:33
Susie_Smith
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Manipulate Brexit referendum, check. Manipulate US presidential elections, check. Manipulate Germans into not voting for Angela Merkel in next year's elections, remains to be seen. But let me tell you, if there was a mission impossible, this will be it It does not exactly inspire confidence in our institutions that are supposed to be there for our protection, does it? You can think about Putin what you like, but one has to admire the efficiency with which he achieved all this. Compared to him, our people look like a bunch of incompetent losers. I'd say don't **** with Putin, but rather bow before him, because his leniency is our only hope
Well assuming that these accusations are true and Russia has somehow managed to manipulate the UK and US population to vote a certain way (who really believes that, come on) - it makes the UK and US authorities look extremely weak. Not only did they fail to make their IT systems secure, they failed to warn the public about how they were being manipulated. (Bit late to tell everyone now)

Overall, I think this is just another irresponsible attempt to demonize Russia.
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Old 17-12-2016, 11:43
MARTYM8
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Ooh no, you are not understanding what is being said here, the uneducated and totally gullible Leave voters just completely believed every anti-EU thing anyone told them, from the flavour of their carpets and having to use green lightbulbs on Wednesday afternoons, all the way up to issuing official permits for alien abductions and probing.

And therefore it is completely logical that a few odd snippets of 'WTF EU' posted on teh interwebs was wot done it and defeated the combined superior intellectual might of the righteous and thwarted their so terribly genuine attempts to refrain from insulting half the electorate time and time again.
Yes - we know.

You are so well informed and intelligent and all those 17.4 million leave voters are just thick gullible and ill informed.

Do you always do everything that the IMF, Goldman Sachs and Ryanair tell you to do?
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Old 17-12-2016, 11:47
Doctor_Wibble
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Do you always do everything that the IMF, Goldman Sachs and Ryanair tell you to do?
Are you suggesting there are heretics that don't
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