Is this what this surge in anti Russian propaganda is all about? Are they trying to mobilize public support for war with Russia just like the Iraq war? Are people going to fall for it just like the Iraq war?
Is the west preparing for war with Russia
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Originally Posted by Jason_Cunningha:
“Is this what this surge in anti Russian propaganda is all about? Are they trying to mobilize public support for war with Russia just like the Iraq war? Are people going to fall for it just like the Iraq war?”
“Is this what this surge in anti Russian propaganda is all about? Are they trying to mobilize public support for war with Russia just like the Iraq war? Are people going to fall for it just like the Iraq war?”
No they are not.
Originally Posted by Jason_Cunningha:
“Is this what this surge in anti Russian propaganda is all about? Are they trying to mobilize public support for war with Russia just like the Iraq war? Are people going to fall for it just like the Iraq war?”
“Is this what this surge in anti Russian propaganda is all about? Are they trying to mobilize public support for war with Russia just like the Iraq war? Are people going to fall for it just like the Iraq war?”
The difference between Russia and Iraq is that Russia can fight back.....so, no.
As someone said above, under the Trump Administration, that is very unlikely to happen. The US view on Russia is a month away from changing.
I don't want to say this because it's going to sound horrible but the 'West' is refusing to go in on the ground and deal with the issue in Syria and they've been dropping bombs for years with ISIS still committing all sorts of massacres.
So......maybe we should let the Russians do what they want. Pull out all our military assets. Let the Russians kill who they want, it will be a stain on their country if they kill a huge amount of civilians. Maybe it's time to keep our noses out of issue's that we refuse to commit to. Just give aid money.
We only have fighter jets to feel like we're doing something but we're having little effect.
I don't want to say this because it's going to sound horrible but the 'West' is refusing to go in on the ground and deal with the issue in Syria and they've been dropping bombs for years with ISIS still committing all sorts of massacres.
So......maybe we should let the Russians do what they want. Pull out all our military assets. Let the Russians kill who they want, it will be a stain on their country if they kill a huge amount of civilians. Maybe it's time to keep our noses out of issue's that we refuse to commit to. Just give aid money.
We only have fighter jets to feel like we're doing something but we're having little effect.
Originally Posted by Pencil:
“Not now that Trump's won the election.
It got scary there for a while though.”
“Not now that Trump's won the election.
It got scary there for a while though.”
When Trump won there was a huge surge in anti Russian propaganda maybe they are trying to get the war started before he comes into power.
Originally Posted by Granny McSmith:
“The difference between Russia and Iraq is that Russia can fight back.....so, no.”
“The difference between Russia and Iraq is that Russia can fight back.....so, no.”
I think its a case with the US and Russia of trying to see who is the top nation.
If you look back in history you will see the US trying to make other nations its friends even to the point of backing them against Britain over the empire.
Russia today is doing the same sort of thing trying to win friends little by little .
I believe Russia invaded part of Ukraine because it was about to join the EU .
It already has the EU by the neck with its supply of oil and gas.
Originally Posted by Pencil:
“Not now that Trump's won the election.
It got scary there for a while though.”
“Not now that Trump's won the election.
It got scary there for a while though.”
Trump is the perfect president to throw his toys out of the pram over the smallest thing.
It won't take him long to fall out with Russia.
However, it's more likely that Russia is a red herring and the war will be with China.
Originally Posted by Jason_Cunningha:
“Is this what this surge in anti Russian propaganda is all about? Are they trying to mobilize public support for war with Russia just like the Iraq war? Are people going to fall for it just like the Iraq war?”
“Is this what this surge in anti Russian propaganda is all about? Are they trying to mobilize public support for war with Russia just like the Iraq war? Are people going to fall for it just like the Iraq war?”
No, of course they're not.
Originally Posted by Jason_Cunningha:
“Is this what this surge in anti Russian propaganda is all about? Are they trying to mobilize public support for war with Russia just like the Iraq war? Are people going to fall for it just like the Iraq war?”
“Is this what this surge in anti Russian propaganda is all about? Are they trying to mobilize public support for war with Russia just like the Iraq war? Are people going to fall for it just like the Iraq war?”
Only in the world of the Moscow propaganda machine.
in the real world, Putin has invaded two neighbouring countries since 2008, built new bases to threaten Finland and Japan , threatened Finland and the Baltic states with reoccupation, and Denmark with nuclear attack, buzzed NATO warships, flown bombers on attack profiles against NATO partners- from Portugal to Canada - as well as against Japan and Sweden, and repeatedly violated Swedish, and Baltic states airspace.
He's also added 3 new divisions to his forces on NATO's borders- with about 600 extra tanks - more than the UK, France and Germany field in total. He's put longer ranged nuclear missiles into Kaliningrad - of a type NATO hasn't had since the early 90s. And he's aggressively developing longer range Iskanders, and nuclear cruise missiles, which will break the INF treaty , when deployed.
Nato so far has put about another 5000 troops, and 40 tanks, forward into the Baltic states - so there's a tripwire there to deter any invasion. its hardly enough to advance on Moscow .
Its also hardly a NATO response. Sweden and Finland are both also increasing their defence capability and budgets - Finland announced its increasing its mobilised army strength by another 50,000 this week.
Russian aggression has sparked off alarm and increasing defence budgets now in all its European neighbours , and Japan. They are now reaping what they sowed , with small US forces deployed on their border, small NATO units deployed on their invasion routes into Poland and the Baltics, and the neutral states and Poland devising additional deterrent means, to deter any invasion or attack. If they do break the post Cold War nuclear treaties, there's going to have to be a counter to those weapons redeployed too.
of course, if the Russians got out of the Ukraine and Georgia , took their nuclear missiles back, stopped flying in other people's airspace, stopped talking about invading more neighbours, and stopped doubling their tank forces , things might revert back to something more normal.
Originally Posted by worzil:
“I think its a case with the US and Russia of trying to see who is the top nation.
If you look back in history you will see the US trying to make other nations its friends even to the point of backing them against Britain over the empire.
Russia today is doing the same sort of thing trying to win friends little by little .
I believe Russia invaded part of Ukraine because it was about to join the EU .
It already has the EU by the neck with its supply of oil and gas.”
“I think its a case with the US and Russia of trying to see who is the top nation.
If you look back in history you will see the US trying to make other nations its friends even to the point of backing them against Britain over the empire.
Russia today is doing the same sort of thing trying to win friends little by little .
I believe Russia invaded part of Ukraine because it was about to join the EU .
It already has the EU by the neck with its supply of oil and gas.”
The USA have been having proxy wars with China and Russia since Korea. Either that or they invade countries with no weapons capable of reaching the American mainland.
I can't see that changing.
More likely Trump will end up in a war with China or one of America's allies...today's incident with China & the US underwater drone, a shot across Trump's bow?
i dont think people are gonna fall for all this anti russian stuff we see and hear. its because partly the russians have frustrated the wests plans for syria and their regime change dream so they are mad at them and now blaming russia for brexit and donald being president.
whats next - russia to blame for bad weather.
whats next - russia to blame for bad weather.
It was looking like this for the months before they started a war with Iraq. They softened the public up for a while and then did it.
I certainly think it looked that way the way that Hillary Clinton was talking. Which was crazy when she was preaching platitudes about tolerance and building the bridges of division.....but at the same time ranting on about Russia.
Now that Trump won we may have dodged that bullet. and I do mean WE. Because with some of the language used by Clinton I think she was taking us towards a terrifying direction. Hopefully relations with Russia will be repaired. But who can say for certain? It may be wishful thinking on my part.
I certainly think it looked that way the way that Hillary Clinton was talking. Which was crazy when she was preaching platitudes about tolerance and building the bridges of division.....but at the same time ranting on about Russia.
Now that Trump won we may have dodged that bullet. and I do mean WE. Because with some of the language used by Clinton I think she was taking us towards a terrifying direction. Hopefully relations with Russia will be repaired. But who can say for certain? It may be wishful thinking on my part.
Originally Posted by thenetworkbabe:
“Only in the world of the Moscow propaganda machine.
in the real world, Putin has invaded two neighbouring countries since 2008, built new bases to threaten Finland and Japan , threatened Finland and the Baltic states with reoccupation, and Denmark with nuclear attack, buzzed NATO warships, flown bombers on attack profiles against NATO partners- from Portugal to Canada - as well as against Japan and Sweden, and repeatedly violated Swedish, and Baltic states airspace.
He's also added 3 new divisions to his forces on NATO's borders- with about 600 extra tanks - more than the UK, France and Germany field in total. He's put longer ranged nuclear missiles into Kaliningrad - of a type NATO hasn't had since the early 90s. And he's aggressively developing longer range Iskanders, and nuclear cruise missiles, which will break the INF treaty , when deployed.
Nato so far has put about another 5000 troops, and 40 tanks, forward into the Baltic states - so there's a tripwire there to deter any invasion. its hardly enough to advance on Moscow .
Its also hardly a NATO response. Sweden and Finland are both also increasing their defence capability and budgets - Finland announced its increasing its mobilised army strength by another 50,000 this week.
Russian aggression has sparked off alarm and increasing defence budgets now in all its European neighbours , and Japan. They are now reaping what they sowed , with small US forces deployed on their border, small NATO units deployed on their invasion routes into Poland and the Baltics, and the neutral states and Poland devising additional deterrent means, to deter any invasion or attack. If they do break the post Cold War nuclear treaties, there's going to have to be a counter to those weapons redeployed too.
of course, if the Russians got out of the Ukraine and Georgia , took their nuclear missiles back, stopped flying in other people's airspace, stopped talking about invading more neighbours, and stopped doubling their tank forces , things might revert back to something more normal.”
“Only in the world of the Moscow propaganda machine.
in the real world, Putin has invaded two neighbouring countries since 2008, built new bases to threaten Finland and Japan , threatened Finland and the Baltic states with reoccupation, and Denmark with nuclear attack, buzzed NATO warships, flown bombers on attack profiles against NATO partners- from Portugal to Canada - as well as against Japan and Sweden, and repeatedly violated Swedish, and Baltic states airspace.
He's also added 3 new divisions to his forces on NATO's borders- with about 600 extra tanks - more than the UK, France and Germany field in total. He's put longer ranged nuclear missiles into Kaliningrad - of a type NATO hasn't had since the early 90s. And he's aggressively developing longer range Iskanders, and nuclear cruise missiles, which will break the INF treaty , when deployed.
Nato so far has put about another 5000 troops, and 40 tanks, forward into the Baltic states - so there's a tripwire there to deter any invasion. its hardly enough to advance on Moscow .
Its also hardly a NATO response. Sweden and Finland are both also increasing their defence capability and budgets - Finland announced its increasing its mobilised army strength by another 50,000 this week.
Russian aggression has sparked off alarm and increasing defence budgets now in all its European neighbours , and Japan. They are now reaping what they sowed , with small US forces deployed on their border, small NATO units deployed on their invasion routes into Poland and the Baltics, and the neutral states and Poland devising additional deterrent means, to deter any invasion or attack. If they do break the post Cold War nuclear treaties, there's going to have to be a counter to those weapons redeployed too.
of course, if the Russians got out of the Ukraine and Georgia , took their nuclear missiles back, stopped flying in other people's airspace, stopped talking about invading more neighbours, and stopped doubling their tank forces , things might revert back to something more normal.”
Just out of curiosity how have you verified that all the above have actually occurred. I am not saying they specifically have not but in a propaganda war one frequently overeggs the pudding to achieve an outcome. For some reason you take as gospel what our intelligence says is happening but reject what Moscow says is happening. Surely Aleppo should have shown that not all that the US says is happening is actually true and depends very much on the agendas of those providing the information. You would think a dodgy dossier had never existed.
Originally Posted by Jakobjoe:
“i dont think people are gonna fall for all this anti russian stuff we see and hear. its because partly the russians have frustrated the wests plans for syria and their regime change dream so they are mad at them and now blaming russia for brexit and donald being president.
whats next - russia to blame for bad weather. ”
“i dont think people are gonna fall for all this anti russian stuff we see and hear. its because partly the russians have frustrated the wests plans for syria and their regime change dream so they are mad at them and now blaming russia for brexit and donald being president.
whats next - russia to blame for bad weather.
”
I think there's merit to what you say there. This wasn't the plan. I think that these people don't like uncertainty and this was not supposed to happen the way it did. They are probably not in a position where they planned to be at this moment in time.
Originally Posted by Blairdennon:
“Surely Aleppo should have shown that not all that the US says is happening is actually true and depends very much on the agendas of those providing the information. You would think a dodgy dossier had never existed.”
“Surely Aleppo should have shown that not all that the US says is happening is actually true and depends very much on the agendas of those providing the information. You would think a dodgy dossier had never existed.”
Syria in general should raise questions. Western coalition flew lots of sorties & expended millions in bombs & missiles.. And achieved what, exactly? Much was said about our War on Terror, yet Russia seems to have achieved far more, in far less time with only a few dozen planes and hundreds of troops. And it being Xmas, no doubt that will translate into healthy order books for Russian arms exports.
Originally Posted by thenetworkbabe:
“Only in the world of the Moscow propaganda machine.
in the real world, Putin has invaded two neighbouring countries since 2008, built new bases to threaten Finland and Japan , threatened Finland and the Baltic states with reoccupation, and Denmark with nuclear attack, buzzed NATO warships, flown bombers on attack profiles against NATO partners- from Portugal to Canada - as well as against Japan and Sweden, and repeatedly violated Swedish, and Baltic states airspace.
He's also added 3 new divisions to his forces on NATO's borders- with about 600 extra tanks - more than the UK, France and Germany field in total. He's put longer ranged nuclear missiles into Kaliningrad - of a type NATO hasn't had since the early 90s. And he's aggressively developing longer range Iskanders, and nuclear cruise missiles, which will break the INF treaty , when deployed.
Nato so far has put about another 5000 troops, and 40 tanks, forward into the Baltic states - so there's a tripwire there to deter any invasion. its hardly enough to advance on Moscow .
Its also hardly a NATO response. Sweden and Finland are both also increasing their defence capability and budgets - Finland announced its increasing its mobilised army strength by another 50,000 this week.
Russian aggression has sparked off alarm and increasing defence budgets now in all its European neighbours , and Japan. They are now reaping what they sowed , with small US forces deployed on their border, small NATO units deployed on their invasion routes into Poland and the Baltics, and the neutral states and Poland devising additional deterrent means, to deter any invasion or attack. If they do break the post Cold War nuclear treaties, there's going to have to be a counter to those weapons redeployed too.
of course, if the Russians got out of the Ukraine and Georgia , took their nuclear missiles back, stopped flying in other people's airspace, stopped talking about invading more neighbours, and stopped doubling their tank forces , things might revert back to something more normal.”
“Only in the world of the Moscow propaganda machine.
in the real world, Putin has invaded two neighbouring countries since 2008, built new bases to threaten Finland and Japan , threatened Finland and the Baltic states with reoccupation, and Denmark with nuclear attack, buzzed NATO warships, flown bombers on attack profiles against NATO partners- from Portugal to Canada - as well as against Japan and Sweden, and repeatedly violated Swedish, and Baltic states airspace.
He's also added 3 new divisions to his forces on NATO's borders- with about 600 extra tanks - more than the UK, France and Germany field in total. He's put longer ranged nuclear missiles into Kaliningrad - of a type NATO hasn't had since the early 90s. And he's aggressively developing longer range Iskanders, and nuclear cruise missiles, which will break the INF treaty , when deployed.
Nato so far has put about another 5000 troops, and 40 tanks, forward into the Baltic states - so there's a tripwire there to deter any invasion. its hardly enough to advance on Moscow .
Its also hardly a NATO response. Sweden and Finland are both also increasing their defence capability and budgets - Finland announced its increasing its mobilised army strength by another 50,000 this week.
Russian aggression has sparked off alarm and increasing defence budgets now in all its European neighbours , and Japan. They are now reaping what they sowed , with small US forces deployed on their border, small NATO units deployed on their invasion routes into Poland and the Baltics, and the neutral states and Poland devising additional deterrent means, to deter any invasion or attack. If they do break the post Cold War nuclear treaties, there's going to have to be a counter to those weapons redeployed too.
of course, if the Russians got out of the Ukraine and Georgia , took their nuclear missiles back, stopped flying in other people's airspace, stopped talking about invading more neighbours, and stopped doubling their tank forces , things might revert back to something more normal.”
oh please, what the west has done this century makes Russia look like a teddy bear
It's late, so will keep it quick.
1.
Us Brits don't have much too mobilize.....except a few harsh words, so Putin must be shaking in his boots (not).
2. We have the Syria thing and possible cyber hacking. For Syria read the west has had its nose rubbed in the dirt by Russia backed Syrian gov forces. The "possible" cyber hacking of the US election (I don't know if it's true or not) would, if true, be very serious. There was even some talk of intervention on the brexit vote too. Equally serious - if true.
3. It all started up a few years back with the Crimea/Ukraine thing....this is still very much an ongoing sore for the west. NATO inc Briton has deployed forces to other east European states in case Putin should try the same trick again.
4. You can't mess with the bear. Putin seems to be a very proud and nationalistic character, and Russia has been building up in recent times - there's nothing wrong with that as far as it goes. If Obama retaliates against a perceived Russian cyber attack, I would bet the house on Putin retaliating against that....and so on. So, for the US, it has to weigh up, is the current situation worth retaliating against - can they make a point without it resulting in the end of the world?
5. Mistakes and assumptions could lead to war, and it won't be anything like ww2.......it will be universal Armageddon.
......a conspiracy theorist would say it's all being designed by the US to keep Obama in office and trump out of power. They won't change leader if there is a major crisis in the world, such as the brink of global thermo nuclear war......
1.
Us Brits don't have much too mobilize.....except a few harsh words, so Putin must be shaking in his boots (not).
2. We have the Syria thing and possible cyber hacking. For Syria read the west has had its nose rubbed in the dirt by Russia backed Syrian gov forces. The "possible" cyber hacking of the US election (I don't know if it's true or not) would, if true, be very serious. There was even some talk of intervention on the brexit vote too. Equally serious - if true.
3. It all started up a few years back with the Crimea/Ukraine thing....this is still very much an ongoing sore for the west. NATO inc Briton has deployed forces to other east European states in case Putin should try the same trick again.
4. You can't mess with the bear. Putin seems to be a very proud and nationalistic character, and Russia has been building up in recent times - there's nothing wrong with that as far as it goes. If Obama retaliates against a perceived Russian cyber attack, I would bet the house on Putin retaliating against that....and so on. So, for the US, it has to weigh up, is the current situation worth retaliating against - can they make a point without it resulting in the end of the world?
5. Mistakes and assumptions could lead to war, and it won't be anything like ww2.......it will be universal Armageddon.
......a conspiracy theorist would say it's all being designed by the US to keep Obama in office and trump out of power. They won't change leader if there is a major crisis in the world, such as the brink of global thermo nuclear war......
Originally Posted by Jakobjoe:
“i dont think people are gonna fall for all this anti russian stuff we see and hear. its because partly the russians have frustrated the wests plans for syria and their regime change dream so they are mad at them and now blaming russia for brexit and donald being president.
whats next - russia to blame for bad weather. ”
“i dont think people are gonna fall for all this anti russian stuff we see and hear. its because partly the russians have frustrated the wests plans for syria and their regime change dream so they are mad at them and now blaming russia for brexit and donald being president.
whats next - russia to blame for bad weather.
”
Didn't you realise that all this warm weather we have been having recently is down to the Russians hacking the atmosphere and shifting the jet stream?
Why can't we reach out in to russian and see if they take it as friendship or slap it away, I don't know why we must be rivals
Originally Posted by johnny_boi_UK:
“Why can't we reach out in to russian and see if they take it as friendship or slap it away, I don't know why we must be rivals”
“Why can't we reach out in to russian and see if they take it as friendship or slap it away, I don't know why we must be rivals”
Vlad wants to be the big cheese.
Originally Posted by johnny_boi_UK:
“Why can't we reach out in to russian and see if they take it as friendship or slap it away, I don't know why we must be rivals”
“Why can't we reach out in to russian and see if they take it as friendship or slap it away, I don't know why we must be rivals”
Assassinating people on UK territory and interfering in elections is hardly the sign of someone who wants to be your friend. Besides, being friendly towards people like Putin has never worked in the past. They just see it as weakness and take advantage of it.
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