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I REALLY REALLY feel for Oti... |
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#76 |
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Bit of both I suspect. Its easier sometimes to teach someone that knows nothing rather than to re-train them to learn. I guess with the limited time that have to learn dances, Oti went with what she could use, and fabulous it was too. Danny is a wonderful dancer, for stage work, but looking from a ballroom/latin dancers viewpoint, not quite so great. I see so much wrong, especially in ballroom when he makes the dance so physical,.....
I think I get what you are saying with several of his dances, but even though I know nothing about dance, I thought his AS in the semi final looked controlled and graceful, plus of course brilliant choreography from Oti. Ore seems to have received all the Gene Kelly comparisons, but Danny reminded me very much of Gene in that routine. My dance of the series. |
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#77 |
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I have loved and had high hopes for Danny even before he had danced a step on Strictly. Once he was paired with my joint fave female pro, I knew that there was only one word for it - DYNAMITE.
But I want to put the spotlight on the other half of this partnership who thoroughly deserved to win tonight for her sheer excellence as a dancer, her amazing originality as a choreographer and her wonderful teaching ability demonstrated by her taking on an exemplary celeb dancer and turning him into an EVEN BETTER one. Her name is Oti Mabuse - so, in defeat, let's hear it for THE undoubted 'Strictly Professional of 2016'!!! Well done Oti!!! x Oti (and AJ for that matter) must now be asking themselves what is the point of insisting on dancing quality, footwork and really innovative routines. Oti said she wanted to bring something new and exciting to the table and did just that. I am quite literally stunned they didn't win. I have no idea what the public saw in Ore (his cry baby thing got on my nerves, really). |
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#78 |
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I have never said he is a ringah - I have no problems at all with celebs that can dance, whether they be dance trained or nor, as long as they have not been trained in the specifics of ballroom and latin, which are completely different from any dance genre.
Yes he is a professional dancer, but not a professional ballroom or latin dancer, this is something quite different obviously. He can dance, of course he can, but he doesn't have the necessary skills for ballroom and latin, those with a trained eye can see this. He "fakes" it well and it is clear that Oti choreographed to his strengths but he to my eyes, does not dance ballroom or latin to as high a standard as Ore for example. M Jo having been taught from a very young age, has a very solid back ground in technique and she has taught Ore this to the best of her ability. It is this that I see in Ore's dancing, the subtleties, the technique, smoothness etc. Sometimes, actually quite often, less is more. Also I'm surprised by your comment about Jo teaching Ore-I'm sure that's true but has Oti not also been taught from a young age? Lastly in terms of technical issues more generally- if they were to show ballroom/Latin competitions prime time on Saturdays I'm pretty confident they would not get the viewing figures and press that Strictly gets. There is a reason for this. Sometimes more is more. |
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#79 |
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Thanks.
So in a sense, like Claudia, his prior training was actually a hindrance rather than a help?Slightly easier if you have never done anything like it before. Danny has a fabulous natural talent though and with more time spent on him, he could have developed into a very good ballroom/latin dancer indeed. I mean from a technical point of view, he already has the performance factor in bucket loads. |
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#80 |
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I'm sure Oti will be fine.
There's nothing to say she won't get a good partner again. At the end of the day she made it to the final clearly had a fantastic time with Danny where they made some incredible achievements and broke Strictly records. I'm sure she doesn't have much to complain about. |
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#81 |
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I'm sure Oti will be fine.
There's nothing to say she won't get a good partner again. At the end of the day she made it to the final clearly had a fantastic time with Danny where they made some incredible achievements and broke Strictly records. I'm sure she doesn't have much to complain about. Even if Oti is disappointed, I think that she will get over it very quickly. |
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#82 |
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I agree, in fact all of Danny's dances seem to go the same way. I have always been impressed with the performances but not always with the actual dancing.
The dances are mostly full on, too much energy - which needs to be controlled - put in to the dance in the wrong way. If you don't move and apply the energy in a controlled way, correctly, it ends up looking rushed and sometimes messy. With Danny's dancing, I struggle to see any finesse, elegance or light and shade. Its all very one paced - high speed. I daresay this appeals to a lot of viewers, they like the impact it creates, but that does not mean it has been danced well. Ore is such a classy dancer and knows the meaning of subtle. Jo has taught him well. Quote:
My post was really more about the fact that Danny has been held up by many as a professional and would not vote for him on that basis as he had no journey , but some experts are saying that he does not have these skills.
Also I'm surprised by your comment about Jo teaching Ore-I'm sure that's true but has Oti not also been taught from a young age? Lastly in terms of technical issues more generally- if they were to show ballroom/Latin competitions prime time on Saturdays I'm pretty confident they would not get the viewing figures and press that Strictly gets. There is a reason for this. Sometimes more is more. Oti, in my view, took advantage of this, which is sensible and then made routines that showed Danny off, but I really think it was 'over fierce', 'over done' and 'chuck the kitchen sink in'. It was her decision to go with what Danny had and not concentrate on refining his tech. And it nearly paid off. Yep, a lot of people thought it was great. I didn't and many, by the end, I think, could see that Ore was actually a better ballroom and latin dancer than Danny. More and more and more, not that brilliantly done, ends up looking frantic and messy. And I thought the showdance was an example of this last night. |
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#83 |
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Joanne, Katya, Natalie, Oksana all did a cracking job as well. I don't think it's fair to single one out - I thought all the female pros (that made it past week 3) were absolutely amazing this year. Looking forward to next year - let's hope the boys can up their game 😉
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#84 |
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My post was really more about the fact that Danny has been held up by many as a professional and would not vote for him on that basis as he had no journey , but some experts are saying that he does not have these skills.
Also I'm surprised by your comment about Jo teaching Ore-I'm sure that's true but has Oti not also been taught from a young age? Lastly in terms of technical issues more generally- if they were to show ballroom/Latin competitions prime time on Saturdays I'm pretty confident they would not get the viewing figures and press that Strictly gets. There is a reason for this. Sometimes more is more. If "more is more" = overdancing, then no thank you. Everything has to be controlled, this is something that you learn very early on. Every action you see the pro's dance is very controlled, they have spent years perfecting this. Nothing wild is acceptable. |
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#85 |
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Although I am not an expert, I have seen all of this myself and am really glad to see it put so well.
Yes, but he was able to appeal, and hide his not always great technique, BECAUSE of his stage dance experience, not that I really care. Oti, in my view, took advantage of this, which is sensible and then made routines that showed Danny off, but I really think it was 'over fierce', 'over done' and 'chuck the kitchen sink in'. It was her decision to go with what Danny had and not concentrate on refining his tech. And it nearly paid off. Yep, a lot of people thought it was great. I didn't and many, by the end, I think, could see that Ore was actually a better ballroom and latin dancer than Danny. More and more and more, not that brilliantly done, ends up looking frantic and messy. And I thought the showdance was an example of this last night. |
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#86 |
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Joanne, Katya, Natalie, Oksana all did a cracking job as well. I don't think it's fair to single one out - I thought all the female pros (that made it past week 3) were absolutely amazing this year. Looking forward to next year - let's hope the boys can up their game 😉
I think Oti did very well to choreograph to his strengths and his dances always were quite an impressive spectacle. The one I will remember was the contemporary style VW (the one to INXS). I'd normally hate something like that and prefer a more classic style but I loved the emotion he portrayed. I always thought he was one of the best contestants at creating a mood and telling a story in ballroom even though his technique was not perfect. |
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#87 |
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She has brought some incredible dances and made history with that Samba.
Based on the series, she and Danny have won but based on the final... they lost. |
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#88 |
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She has brought some incredible dances and made history with that Samba.
Based on the series, she and Danny have won but based on the final... they lost. The public decided to vote on based on who they thought was the best on the night and the fact Ore went on a journey |
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#89 |
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Oti is a latin dancer, I'm sure she learned some ballroom years ago, but she is known on the circuit as a latin dancer. Her ballroom is not so good. Jo on the other hand has danced both ballroom and latin at International level, up until Youth category, when she then favoured ballroom.
If "more is more" = overdancing, then no thank you. Everything has to be controlled, this is something that you learn very early on. Every action you see the pro's dance is very controlled, they have spent years perfecting this. Nothing wild is acceptable. edit: Not knocking her at all DOTI fans btw. She's definitely a great dancer and an asset to the show. Literally just a case of a hobby ballroom dancer asking a professional a question.
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#90 |
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Possibly not in this case, as he was already a dancer, a good one at that. Just takes time unlearning habits or learning new and correct ones.!!
Slightly easier if you have never done anything like it before. Danny has a fabulous natural talent though and with more time spent on him, he could have developed into a very good ballroom/latin dancer indeed. I mean from a technical point of view, he already has the performance factor in bucket loads. |
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#91 |
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I think Oti choreographed some great routines, but I think she miscalculated with the showdance.
I think sometimes less is more in that you don't have to throw in the kitchen sink to impress viewers. Neither does it have to be perfect technique. It has to strike a note with the viewers. I think Jo did that with Ore's showdance. If she had partnered Danny instead that showdance may have been even more impressive given Danny's performance capability. |
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#92 |
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Some very interesting and though provoking posts in the last page or so of this thread (and all done with respect) - thank you.
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#93 |
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I don't know since I am not experienced enough to tell, but I felt like Oti was doing some slightly funky things during the QS as well as Danny? Just a case of them not moving as a unit so they both look a bit wrong, or was her technique a bit off? I felt she looked a bit.. strained? I wonder if Danny was actually a bit stiff and nervous and it impacted her.
edit: Not knocking her at all DOTI fans btw. She's definitely a great dancer and an asset to the show. Literally just a case of a hobby ballroom dancer asking a professional a question.With regards to the choreo, I'll have to go back to have a look as it looked quite normal QS choreo to me, but I stand to be corrected ! |
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#94 |
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Thanks once again. So with a different pro, say Jo, do you think he would have developed in a different way throughout the show? Maybe his actual technique would have improved more than it did?
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#95 |
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She's wonderful and I hope she gets to lift that gitter ball.
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#96 |
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Interesting. I LOVE Samba, but have only ever danced bouncy, stretchy controlled ballroom Samba which is very difficult and incredibly precise but oddly 'free'. Sorry if that description is odd.
I never LIKED Danny's Samba, but thought it was something I didn't understand, perhaps, and I do admire it's physical commitment and he did what he was given well. But... You've made me think. Quote:
Wonderful description, made me smile.
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I agree, in fact all of Danny's dances seem to go the same way. I have always been impressed with the performances but not always with the actual dancing.
The dances are mostly full on, too much energy - which needs to be controlled - put in to the dance in the wrong way. If you don't move and apply the energy in a controlled way, correctly, it ends up looking rushed and sometimes messy. With Danny's dancing, I struggle to see any finesse, elegance or light and shade. Its all very one paced - high speed. I daresay this appeals to a lot of viewers, they like the impact it creates, but that does not mean it has been danced well. Ore is such a classy dancer and knows the meaning of subtle. Jo has taught him well. |
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#97 |
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I could not possibly say, but I feel that he was better suited to Oti and her flamboyant style. I feel this was a very good match. I think if he had have been paired with Jo, we would have seen a "different" Danny, but overall I think he did so very well with Oti, just did not get enough votes.
I wonder if he ever had enough votes to be honest; the semi final dance off suggests not.
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#98 |
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I agree, in fact all of Danny's dances seem to go the same way. I have always been impressed with the performances but not always with the actual dancing.
The dances are mostly full on, too much energy - which needs to be controlled - put in to the dance in the wrong way. If you don't move and apply the energy in a controlled way, correctly, it ends up looking rushed and sometimes messy. With Danny's dancing, I struggle to see any finesse, elegance or light and shade. Its all very one paced - high speed. I daresay this appeals to a lot of viewers, they like the impact it creates, but that does not mean it has been danced well. Ore is such a classy dancer and knows the meaning of subtle. Jo has taught him well. |
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#99 |
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I very much agree, particularly Katya. I have a feeling in years to come it will be Ed Balls that is remembered from this series due to her amazing choreography.
I think Oti did very well to choreograph to his strengths and his dances always were quite an impressive spectacle. The one I will remember was the contemporary style VW (the one to INXS). I'd normally hate something like that and prefer a more classic style but I loved the emotion he portrayed. I always thought he was one of the best contestants at creating a mood and telling a story in ballroom even though his technique was not perfect. I was always impressed by Dannis dances, but rarely swept away and transported to a different (better) place. And that's what many of us watch strictly for - just a bit of escapism. I thought both Dannis final dances were stuffed full of content, but lacking in atmosphere. The show dance had plenty of atmosphere, but was too overwrought for my taste. |
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#100 |
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Glad to hear this written by a professional as it's how I have felt about Danny's dancing throughout the show. Bash and Dash as someone else put it very well and very little lyrical quality. Not sure if this is Oti's style or if this is how she felt Danny was at his best. Ore on the other hand is just a natural mover and Jo did an excellent job with him.
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So in a sense, like Claudia, his prior training was actually a hindrance rather than a help?