Originally Posted by blueblade:
“They wouldn't stop a heavy lorry.”
“They wouldn't stop a heavy lorry.”
The key to stopping heavy lorry attacks is to give everyone with a heavy lorry.
A truck has ploughed into a Christmas market in Berlin.
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Originally Posted by Terry N:
“Very convenient that he left his ID in the lorry.”
“Very convenient that he left his ID in the lorry.”
It's been a recurring comment here but I'm still not following the logic.
They plant the ID of a man who sums up everything that is wrong with German immig procedures /policy & is an indictment of their loss of control of a network of dangerous, home-based jihadis?
So how does planting that particular ID really help German politicians/authorities? Surely they could have invented/selected someone more politically convenient?
Their sec services already have a poor reputation for tackling jihadi networks already est there.
They've been criticised for not warning their citizens about market attacks and failed to protect them.
They caught the wrong man and lost a 24 hr start on the real perp.
Makes them look like tools , they missed the ID, didn't process the forensics fast enough ( fingerprints & DNA left in cab) to enable them to eliminate suspect 1 and get on the real trail.
Originally Posted by flashfiction:
“It's been a recurring comment here but I'm still not following the logic.
They plant the ID of a man who sums up everything that is wrong with German immig procedures /policy & is an indictment of their loss of control of a network of dangerous, home-based jihadis?
So how does planting that particular ID really help German politicians/authorities? Surely they could have invented/selected someone more politically convenient?
Their sec services already have a poor reputation for tackling jihadi networks already est there.
They've been criticised for not warning their citizens about market attacks and failed to protect them.
They caught the wrong man and lost a 24 hr start on the real perp.
Makes them look like tools , they missed the ID, didn't process the forensics fast enough ( fingerprints & DNA left in cab) to enable them to eliminate suspect 1 and get on the real trail.”
“It's been a recurring comment here but I'm still not following the logic.
They plant the ID of a man who sums up everything that is wrong with German immig procedures /policy & is an indictment of their loss of control of a network of dangerous, home-based jihadis?
So how does planting that particular ID really help German politicians/authorities? Surely they could have invented/selected someone more politically convenient?
Their sec services already have a poor reputation for tackling jihadi networks already est there.
They've been criticised for not warning their citizens about market attacks and failed to protect them.
They caught the wrong man and lost a 24 hr start on the real perp.
Makes them look like tools , they missed the ID, didn't process the forensics fast enough ( fingerprints & DNA left in cab) to enable them to eliminate suspect 1 and get on the real trail.”
Maybe it was planted by someone else who wanted just that , to make them look like tools ?
Originally Posted by duckylucky:
“Maybe it was planted by someone else who wanted just that , to make them look like tools ?”
“Maybe it was planted by someone else who wanted just that , to make them look like tools ?”
Possible, but who would be motivated to do that? What would they gain?
Originally Posted by flashfiction:
“It's been a recurring comment here but I'm still not following the logic.
They plant the ID of a man who sums up everything that is wrong with German immig procedures /policy & is an indictment of their loss of control of a network of dangerous, home-based jihadis?
So how does planting that particular ID really help German politicians/authorities? Surely they could have invented/selected someone more politically convenient?
Their sec services already have a poor reputation for tackling jihadi networks already est there.
They've been criticised for not warning their citizens about market attacks and failed to protect them.
They caught the wrong man and lost a 24 hr start on the real perp.
Makes them look like tools , they missed the ID, didn't process the forensics fast enough ( fingerprints & DNA left in cab) to enable them to eliminate suspect 1 and get on the real trail.”
“It's been a recurring comment here but I'm still not following the logic.
They plant the ID of a man who sums up everything that is wrong with German immig procedures /policy & is an indictment of their loss of control of a network of dangerous, home-based jihadis?
So how does planting that particular ID really help German politicians/authorities? Surely they could have invented/selected someone more politically convenient?
Their sec services already have a poor reputation for tackling jihadi networks already est there.
They've been criticised for not warning their citizens about market attacks and failed to protect them.
They caught the wrong man and lost a 24 hr start on the real perp.
Makes them look like tools , they missed the ID, didn't process the forensics fast enough ( fingerprints & DNA left in cab) to enable them to eliminate suspect 1 and get on the real trail.”
Unfortunately logic like this doesn't work with conspiracy theorists. They see every attack as being planned by the security services, every single 'discrepancy' is enough to point to a massive cover up even though that discrepancy maybe Angent Mulder swapping his regular weekend shift with Agent Scully and there being an attack 10 miles away.
You should see the 9/11 2 questions thread here in GD to see how they clutch at straws with increasingly ludicrous theories.
Originally Posted by flashfiction:
“It's been a recurring comment here but I'm still not following the logic.”
“It's been a recurring comment here but I'm still not following the logic.”
"Ah, that's because you're a sheep who blindly believes everything you're told by the government-controlled msm"... etc...
Originally Posted by duckylucky:
“Maybe it was planted by someone else who wanted just that , to make them look like tools ?”
“Maybe it was planted by someone else who wanted just that , to make them look like tools ?”
There's a paper trail for the Tunisian that involves 3 countries and all the security, prisons and law enforcement agencies that have been involved with him from Tunisia via Italy to Germany.
That's a lot of complex work, in building a back story, set into motion almost 10 years ago, in order to deliver your purpose- "to make them look like tools".
Less of a stretch to think that as warned years ago, the non-vetting of refugees at the Greek border etc/no borders are a attractive proposition to the dregs of criminal classes across war-torn/impoverished countries. Alongside those who are genuine, who are grateful, who don't "hate us" ( as seen upthread) there will be a significant proportion who will exploit that "welcome"- the whole thing is unworkable for these reasons, as we were warned.
Originally Posted by MikeJW:
“"Ah, that's because you're a sheep who blindly believes everything you're told by the government-controlled msm"... etc...”
“"Ah, that's because you're a sheep who blindly believes everything you're told by the government-controlled msm"... etc...”
It's a worry when the shit you hear from the authorities about immigration procedures and now combined with the stuff you read on here, becomes almost as depressing as the lorry attack itself.
Originally Posted by flashfiction:
“
It's a worry when the shit you hear from the authorities about immigration procedures and now combined with the stuff you read on here, becomes almost as depressing as the lorry attack itself.”
“
It's a worry when the shit you hear from the authorities about immigration procedures and now combined with the stuff you read on here, becomes almost as depressing as the lorry attack itself.”
Yeah, it would be good to think that someone will learn some useful lessons from this, somewhere, but when there's such blame-spreading and disagreement over the very basics, it doesn't seem likely. Everyone will just say what they did before, only more loudly.
Originally Posted by TrollHunter:
“Possible, but who would be motivated to do that? What would they gain?”
“Possible, but who would be motivated to do that? What would they gain?”
I have no idea as I can't even begin to understand the mindset of a terrorist . I was thinking more in line of the ID being planted by his own scumbag colleagues to deflect from others ? No idea really just speculation , same as everyone else
Originally Posted by Zeropoint1:
“I do expect people who have been allowed to move to the safety of Europe or any other place to be grateful to their new hosts, I certainly would be. Why aren't other countries so welcoming? Is it only Europeans who have to welcome all comers?
It's the same when we are told about refugee camps in France, it's funny because I don't believe France has been a war zone since 1945. Though I accept the main stream media may have hidden that to devide us.”
“I do expect people who have been allowed to move to the safety of Europe or any other place to be grateful to their new hosts, I certainly would be. Why aren't other countries so welcoming? Is it only Europeans who have to welcome all comers?
It's the same when we are told about refugee camps in France, it's funny because I don't believe France has been a war zone since 1945. Though I accept the main stream media may have hidden that to devide us.”
Other countries obviously are welcoming. The vast majority of refugees aren't in Europe.
I'd also hazard a guess that the vast majority of refugees in Europe are grateful.
Originally Posted by duckylucky:
“I have no idea as I can't even begin to understand the mindset of a terrorist . I was thinking more in line of the ID being planted by his own scumbag colleagues to deflect from others ? No idea really just speculation , same as everyone else”
“I have no idea as I can't even begin to understand the mindset of a terrorist . I was thinking more in line of the ID being planted by his own scumbag colleagues to deflect from others ? No idea really just speculation , same as everyone else”
Oh. I thought you were talking about some government sanctioned conspiracy theory.
As you were then.
The only thing that makes sense is that he left the ID there under the assumption he would be killed, kill himself or be taken into custody. When he was planning the attack it must have seemed extremely unlikely that he would actually manage to get away.
As he had the chance to escape, I suppose he must have taken it as he would then be potentially able to launch another attack in the future.
As he had the chance to escape, I suppose he must have taken it as he would then be potentially able to launch another attack in the future.
Originally Posted by Trulytrue:
“What about in your own personal world. Do you see and feel the hate around you. I live near Luton go shopping there a lot never felt this hate they have for us. I only see it if I accidently see TV news or read a headline telling me they hate us.”
“What about in your own personal world. Do you see and feel the hate around you. I live near Luton go shopping there a lot never felt this hate they have for us. I only see it if I accidently see TV news or read a headline telling me they hate us.”
Interesting question. No, to be honest I've never felt any hostility from the Muslims I've come in contact with. But there again, I've got no close friends who are Muslim.
We have close friends in the Indian community, some of whom were refugees from Uganda during the time of Idi Amin. We also have friends from Africa and the West Indies, Eastern Euorope and China. But for some reason I don't think the Muslim community find it so easy to integrate.
Maybe it's to do with their religion ? Forgetting the terrorist threat for a moment, I think you do find that Muslims take their religion and religious commitments far more seriously than most other groups. Even if they don't hate us, it makes them less approachable. And that works both ways, we find it difficult and so do they. Perhaps if we did socialise more it would break down barriers and they would be more likely to expose the real nut jobs in their midst. But I can't see it happening any time soon.
Originally Posted by RichmondBlue:
“Interesting question. No, to be honest I've never felt any hostility from the Muslims I've come in contact with. But there again, I've got no close friends who are Muslim.
We have close friends in the Indian community, some of whom were refugees from Uganda during the time of Idi Amin. We also have friends from Africa and the West Indies, Eastern Euorope and China. But for some reason I don't think the Muslim community find it so easy to integrate.
Maybe it's to do with their religion ? Forgetting the terrorist threat for a moment, I think you do find that Muslims take their religion and religious commitments far more seriously than most other groups. Even if they don't hate us, it makes them less approachable. And that works both ways, we find it difficult and so do they. Perhaps if we did socialise more it would break down barriers and they would be more likely to expose the real nut jobs in their midst. But I can't see it happening any time soon.”
“Interesting question. No, to be honest I've never felt any hostility from the Muslims I've come in contact with. But there again, I've got no close friends who are Muslim.
We have close friends in the Indian community, some of whom were refugees from Uganda during the time of Idi Amin. We also have friends from Africa and the West Indies, Eastern Euorope and China. But for some reason I don't think the Muslim community find it so easy to integrate.
Maybe it's to do with their religion ? Forgetting the terrorist threat for a moment, I think you do find that Muslims take their religion and religious commitments far more seriously than most other groups. Even if they don't hate us, it makes them less approachable. And that works both ways, we find it difficult and so do they. Perhaps if we did socialise more it would break down barriers and they would be more likely to expose the real nut jobs in their midst. But I can't see it happening any time soon.”
A lot of muslims don't agree with free mixing ie single men mixing with single women or married people free mixing with people who are not their husband if their spouse etc isn't present. I have muslim neighbours who won't go to parties because of their religion, they don't go to the pub as alcohol is served there and they're not happy with the free mixing in pubs. It's not that easy to socilaise with people like that. They tend to just mix with other muslims in cafes where only men go or at home for the women. Obviously there are exceptions but most of them are not into socilaising the infidel way.
Originally Posted by Susie_Smith:
“The only thing that makes sense is that he left the ID there under the assumption he would be killed, kill himself or be taken into custody. When he was planning the attack it must have seemed extremely unlikely that he would actually manage to get away.
As he had the chance to escape, I suppose he must have taken it as he would then be potentially able to launch another attack in the future.”
“The only thing that makes sense is that he left the ID there under the assumption he would be killed, kill himself or be taken into custody. When he was planning the attack it must have seemed extremely unlikely that he would actually manage to get away.
As he had the chance to escape, I suppose he must have taken it as he would then be potentially able to launch another attack in the future.”
As is their sick custom. Considering Germany's laxity he's probably got another ID by now, if he didn't already have one going spare. .
Anis Amri - According to his brother "... was sure his brother was innocent, saying he had left for Europe "for economic reasons... to work, to help the family. He didn't go for [terrorist] reasons ". There's a surprise, not.
Originally Posted by Trulytrue:
“What about in your own personal world. Do you see and feel the hate around you. I live near Luton go shopping there a lot never felt this hate they have for us. I only see it if I accidently see TV news or read a headline telling me they hate us.”
“What about in your own personal world. Do you see and feel the hate around you. I live near Luton go shopping there a lot never felt this hate they have for us. I only see it if I accidently see TV news or read a headline telling me they hate us.”
I saw a BBC programme about Luton a few years ago and from what I saw didn't seem very friendly to me.
Originally Posted by blueblade:
“They've got to be careful, because at the end of the day they are still very much the minority in terms of the total population. I think some of them are forgetting this fact because up till now, the majority haven't said or done very much.
It only takes a few atrocities for things to change on that score.”
“They've got to be careful, because at the end of the day they are still very much the minority in terms of the total population. I think some of them are forgetting this fact because up till now, the majority haven't said or done very much.
It only takes a few atrocities for things to change on that score.”
Which is why they're not the least bit interested in being careful and why not only are they not forgetting this fact, they're actually counting on it. If picking some of us off gets us picking each other off as well, that can only be a bonus as far as they're concerned. Divide and conquer.
Sure, a lot of their 'own' minority innocents would have to be sacrificed along the way, but why would killing complete strangers of their own kind bother them if they're willing to sacrifice themselves in pursuit of a 'glorious' exit and a bunch of virgins? Many of those strangers will have come here actually hoping to embrace Western culture anyway, feeling that what we have to offer really is better than the life that extremists would wish for them. Their loss won't be celebrated any less by the terrorists than the loss of people who have been rooted here for generations.
I'm not one of those who thinks 'Throw open the borders! We can accommodate everyone!', far from it, but my heart does sink a bit whenever incidents of obvious racial intolerance are reported because I imagine that terrorists are winning an inch with each one and thinking 'Woohoo! Today the muslims are dodging the bacon, tomorrow they'll be dodging the bullets!' I'd rather not give them the satisfaction.
Originally Posted by Pink_Smurf:
“A lot of muslims don't agree with free mixing ie single men mixing with single women or married people free mixing with people who are not their husband if their spouse etc isn't present. I have muslim neighbours who won't go to parties because of their religion, they don't go to the pub as alcohol is served there and they're not happy with the free mixing in pubs. It's not that easy to socilaise with people like that. They tend to just mix with other muslims in cafes where only men go or at home for the women. Obviously there are exceptions but most of them are not into socilaising the infidel way.”
“A lot of muslims don't agree with free mixing ie single men mixing with single women or married people free mixing with people who are not their husband if their spouse etc isn't present. I have muslim neighbours who won't go to parties because of their religion, they don't go to the pub as alcohol is served there and they're not happy with the free mixing in pubs. It's not that easy to socilaise with people like that. They tend to just mix with other muslims in cafes where only men go or at home for the women. Obviously there are exceptions but most of them are not into socilaising the infidel way.”
That police commissioner or commander who said he would consider letting female Muslim recruits wear the burka got his comeuppance at the passing out of recruits after a training course - one hijabbed lady refused to shake his hand because it was against her religion. Not only was she extremely ill mannered but what use will she be as a police officer? Will she be able to arrest men? Will she have a police partner's back in an incident? Will she just hang back and say modesty forbids manhandling? Or will she make an issue of it and claim compensation on the grounds of religious discrimination when she gets sacked for not doing her job?
Originally Posted by francie:
“Anis Amri - According to his brother "... was sure his brother was innocent, saying he had left for Europe "for economic reasons... to work, to help the family. He didn't go for [terrorist] reasons ". There's a surprise, not.”
“Anis Amri - According to his brother "... was sure his brother was innocent, saying he had left for Europe "for economic reasons... to work, to help the family. He didn't go for [terrorist] reasons ". There's a surprise, not.”
Maybe that's the real meaning of his economic reasons and helping the family with his "underage" arson and prison adventures in Italy?
No mention of his Tunisian criminal record and the armed robbery charges he ran away from?
I can see how easy it is for them to believe in such a wholesome young blokes innocence.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...rket-attacker/
Quote:
“Amri was investigated earlier this year by German police over a suspected attempt to buy automatic weapons for an unconnected terror plot. He was a known criminal who fled his native Tunisia to escape imprisonment, and spent time in jail in Italy.
He arrived in Italy at the age of 19 but is believed to have claimed to be a minor in the hope of being granted asylum.
But he failed to stay out of trouble in Italy. Anis went to prison in Italy after being convicted of setting fire to a school and also to the reception centre in which he was held after reaching the country, news agency Ansa reported.
Even prior to this investigation, Amri had been identified by German police as a potential terror threat because he was an asylum-seeker known to use aliases and false identity documents.
Bla bla bla”
“Amri was investigated earlier this year by German police over a suspected attempt to buy automatic weapons for an unconnected terror plot. He was a known criminal who fled his native Tunisia to escape imprisonment, and spent time in jail in Italy.
He arrived in Italy at the age of 19 but is believed to have claimed to be a minor in the hope of being granted asylum.
But he failed to stay out of trouble in Italy. Anis went to prison in Italy after being convicted of setting fire to a school and also to the reception centre in which he was held after reaching the country, news agency Ansa reported.
Even prior to this investigation, Amri had been identified by German police as a potential terror threat because he was an asylum-seeker known to use aliases and false identity documents.
Bla bla bla”
The whole stinking lot beggars belief.
Originally Posted by Trulytrue:
“What about in your own personal world. Do you see and feel the hate around you. I live near Luton go shopping there a lot never felt this hate they have for us. I only see it if I accidently see TV news or read a headline telling me they hate us.”
“What about in your own personal world. Do you see and feel the hate around you. I live near Luton go shopping there a lot never felt this hate they have for us. I only see it if I accidently see TV news or read a headline telling me they hate us.”
http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=...8A64&FORM=VIRE
This is one of many about Luton extremists. Pretty hateful don't you think?
Originally Posted by Pink_Smurf:
“A lot of muslims don't agree with free mixing ie single men mixing with single women or married people free mixing with people who are not their husband if their spouse etc isn't present. I have muslim neighbours who won't go to parties because of their religion, they don't go to the pub as alcohol is served there and they're not happy with the free mixing in pubs. It's not that easy to socilaise with people like that. They tend to just mix with other muslims in cafes where only men go or at home for the women. Obviously there are exceptions but most of them are not into socilaising the infidel way.”
“A lot of muslims don't agree with free mixing ie single men mixing with single women or married people free mixing with people who are not their husband if their spouse etc isn't present. I have muslim neighbours who won't go to parties because of their religion, they don't go to the pub as alcohol is served there and they're not happy with the free mixing in pubs. It's not that easy to socilaise with people like that. They tend to just mix with other muslims in cafes where only men go or at home for the women. Obviously there are exceptions but most of them are not into socilaising the infidel way.”
Yes, if they're going to deliberately ostracise themselves from Western society it's not going to be easy. I always thought it would just take time, but some of the second generation young Muslims have become more militant and and extreme than their parents. I don't know what the answer is.
Originally Posted by Rekekah_Carter:
“http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=...8A64&FORM=VIRE
This is one of many about Luton extremists. Pretty hateful don't you think?”
“http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=...8A64&FORM=VIRE
This is one of many about Luton extremists. Pretty hateful don't you think?”
l have seen this one before, and it's a disgrace that they can judge etc. Hate filled scum
Originally Posted by louisa320:
“l have seen this one before, and it's a disgrace that they can judge etc. Hate filled scum”
“l have seen this one before, and it's a disgrace that they can judge etc. Hate filled scum”
It truly is. Like I say, one of many, and I suspect this is the same in most, if not all, highly Muslim populated areas.
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